spare_wheel

This is a myth, IMO. In many of these cities (SF, Minneapolis, Seattle, PDX) mode share started going up prior to modest infrastructure build outs. For example, cycling mode share shot up from 3% to ~7% in PDX in just a few years with no major infrastructure improvements.

acidfast7

I am trying my best not to bash the US anymore, so I would kindly suggest that a Hovenring is not feasible in the US.

Especially, as it was used to replace (in the same location but at street level) what was considered unacceptable risk (dedicated bike lanes with dedicated signals that were integrated into the traffic circuit) because a car could go through a red and impact a cyclist.

CrankyOne

Well, based on this, PDX began building infrastructure in 1973 and had 190 miles in place by 1996. Modal share was 1.2% in 1990 (17 years after they began building bike paths) and reached 6.3% in 2011. It was at 3.5% in 2005, so I assume you were referring to the increase from 2005 to 2011. By 2005 though, they already had a gob of bike paths in place. So, PDX appears to be a great example of build it and they will indeed come.

vol

Sounds like there is an assumption that most people ride bikes in upright position?

daihard 

I didn't mean to say that cycling should only be used as a way to get around - rather, one should be able to ride a bike as a means of transport, just like one should be able to walk or take the bus, casually in plain clothes. That's never to say you shouldn't cloth yourself in bike gear or push yourself hard - those two activities are totally compatible, just like racing drivers and everyday motorists.

spare_wheel

so you are arguing that crappy 4-5 foot wide door zone bike lanes, the majority of which were installed over a decade ago, suddenly caused a surge from 3.5% to ~6% in just a few years? ooooohhhh kayyyyy.



PS: i have been biking on a daily basis in pdx for a very long time and have strong opinions on what helped trigger that spike in mode share.

acidfast7

To be fair, as stated in Brussels Express (a video that I posted previously). It really matters where those people that produced the jump from 3.5 to 6% came from.

Most cities in Europe, don't consider that much of an improvement (anything under 10%), because it's usually a conversion from people walking into work changing into cycling into work, so it's quite important to consider the cycling mode share as (cycling + walking)/(driving). If you're not pulling people out of cars but rather out of buses and from the sidewalk, then the changes in modal share usually result in little improvement.

spare_wheel

with all due respect, comparing ACS census mode share with the numbers that come from holland and denmark is an utterly useless comparison. USAnian census numbers only count someone as a cyclist if over 50% of commuting trips were conducted by bike.
*if a person bikes to work 2 times a week their trips do not count.
*if a person uses the train and a bike the vast majority of these trips do not count.
*if a person bikes to the grocery store after work the trip does not count.
*if a person cycles to a restaurant/theater/bar/club the trip does not count.

the dutch and danes count mixed and occasional use in their mode share numbers. moreover, as documented at length by hembrow both the dutch and the danes inflate their cycling mode share with statistical tricks and outright misrepresentation. if portland used these kind of metrics, mode share would be much higher. potentially in the 15-20% range:

https://bikeportland.org/2008/12/09/c...-streets-11877

acidfast7

I wouldn't say that the Dutch/Danes inflate their numbers, I would say that the POR underestimates their numbers. Why go to the store by bike, if you don't commute by bike ... I buy fresh bread every day ... why would I return home first to get the bike?

Also, note that I didn't compare the US and EU mode share numbers ... which you imply that I did.

Not very nice at all (and quite defensive to boot).

spare_wheel

Comparatively few people in Holland commute by bike when the trip is 5+ km.


Because you did:

CrankyOne

Are you arguing that they had no impact? That if no bicycle facilities had been installed that PDX would still have 6% share today?

I-Like-To-Bike

What in your opinion did help trigger that spike in mode share?

spare_wheel

The fact that they were *there* waiting definitely helped. But the "build it and they will come" is, IMO, a gross oversimplification and even potentially harmful to cycling advocacy.

spare_wheel

There was a very nice bikeportland post on this:

https://bikeportland.org/2013/07/02/w...ing-boom-89491

acidfast7

No, I said that the the new commuters need to come from cars to be valuable. Chop what I said all you want ... but don't alter my message ... it's not useful to get people on bikes if they're already walking or using public transport, as it may actually expand their CO2 footprint.

neil

There's nothing magically different about Americans from other people. They'll respond to the same stimuli as anyone else.

Make things far apart, with direct busy roads that are uncomfortable to bike on, and you'll find that they opt to drive. Invest in cycling and transit infrastructure instead of roads, and people will respond to that. Changing the built form of a city will take 2 or more generations, and requires the political will to stop building more roads. The sprawling masses we call cities in North America were mostly built in the 63 years from 1945-2008. They won't change overnight; it takes sustained pressure to build better alternatives, and political will to say no to the motor lobby when they come asking for yet another megaproject. Given the right environment, you could see more scenes like that in the US over the next couple of decades.

The last half decade has been an exciting time as the movement away from private automobiles has been growing, to some extent through economic necessity, but mostly because of demographic trends. It will be interesting to see in 30 years if we've been able keep moving this way, and what the world looks like as a result.

fietsbob

Do I get Sherman to Use the WABAC Time machine ?

It would make things easier than tearing down all the stiff built in the last century , and moving it
so as to have like wider bridges with Separated Bike lanes on both sides, instead of 4 lanes of motor traffic.


Or Just 2 lanes and a scant foot to the edge of the paving ..

spare_wheel

the C02 footprint of portland oregon is the least of our worries. seriously.

acidfast7

Oregon's CO2 footprint is a serious concern of mine (as are the other 49).

There's not many bigger concerns, except antibacterial resistance.

spare_wheel

when i visit europe it feel backwards from a sustainability perspective. but then again just about every city in the world does...

*per capita greenhouse gas production in portland is 26% lower than 1990 levels.
*15% of residents choose to pay a higher rate for 100% renewable electricity. (~30-40% of electricity is hydro or renewable).
* ~70% of recyclable materials are recycled.
*curb-side compost pickup has decreased solid waste by 44%.
*the nissan leaf often outsells gas-powered nissan vehicles on a monthly basis.

acidfast7

i'm not trying to start a fight, but those stats don't look so good, to be fair.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renewab...any#Statistics

I-Like-To-Bike

I saw that you commented on the blog "The largest jump occurred in 2008 (3.9% to 6.0%) and was almost certainly caused by massive increase in gas prices (and the cratering economy)."

This happened throughout the U.S. why did not other cities see a gain in cycling modal share? Or do you believe that the economy tanked more in Portland and that gasoline prices increased more in Portland than elsewhere? Even the writers of the blog article discounted nation wide economic trends as a cause for Portland's unique spike in mode share.

acidfast7

is 3.9 to 6.0 statistically significant?

spare_wheel

i don't think increasing coal use by 5% is something you should be bragging about, acidfast7. interestingly, munich's goal is 37% renewables by 2025 but portland is already at ~30% now.

I-Like-To-Bike

I don't know, I didn't gather the data. BTW, I thought you were the mathematician.