ebikes
12-13-18, 10:37 AM
#26
Senior Member
If there was an E bike that had regenerative braking and a way to capture all that energy lost on long downhills, I'd get one, but unfortunately that'll be something in the future, probably after my cycling days are over. Does anyone charge their E bikes from a generator hub?
Last edited by 350htrr; 12-13-18 at 10:51 AM. Reason: spelling
12-13-18, 11:14 AM
#27
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Yes, I have a BionX (out of business, no longer made) retrofit on my touring bike. It has a regeneration feature but the level of re-charge is pretty insignificant. The braking assistence is handy though. Like downshifting on your car.
+1 to all of the above. Having to plug in every night is the biggest challenge for ebike touring in the USA. Hopefully for anto it's easier in Ireland and the rest of Europe.
I had to go electric two years ago due to health issues. My 556 watt hour battery boasts a range 30-70 miles. Two years and 7.5k miles later that is more like 20-50 miles in hilly terrain with the ageing and use of the battery. That is on an unloaded bike around town. Loaded for travel I may get only 20-30 miles in hilly terrain. Carrying a second battery that would mean a range of just 40-60 miles before having to plug in for 5-6 hours. That's assuming I'm also carrying a second charger for the spare battery. Add to that a CPAP machine... long distance bike touring has become too dependent upon electricity for me to continue to participate.
I'm not even going to find a motel every 60 miles on an extended trip in the US and their regular use is not in my budget. A campground with power would be even more difficult to find. All I can do is short, local well planned trips. Sorry to be so negative anto. I love my e-assist but have yet to find a way to make it work for extended overnights.
i won't be doing anymore than a week or even overnighters 40 to 50 miles would be plenty enough for this oul bird lol.
mind you i'm thinking ahead if i can sell my bikes ill buy a good ebike start cycling again in the new year if i don't doubt very
much ill cycle again,
12-13-18, 03:25 PM
#28
Senior Member
12-13-18, 06:31 PM
#29
Senior Member
Thread Starter
12-13-18, 08:05 PM
#30
Senior Member
12-13-18, 09:49 PM
#31
Clark W. Griswold
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I wouldn't want a big heavy weight in my wheel along with an even heavier weight of my gear above it and even heavier weight of me above that but those who love to bodge in the garage love those things. I have seen too many with problems and for touring, broken spokes could be a extremely likely possibility. Pedego/Prodeco has had so many problems with broken spokes they won't replace a wheel till nearly every single spoke is broken at once. I spoke with them for a customer who had 20 broken spokes at one time and they were still like nope, just rebuild it, we don't replace till you hit 30. Specialized for the Turbo's and Turbo X's (which are discontinued in favor of better mid-drive bikes with fewer problems) has just been having shops rebuild wheels at this point because they are tired of dealing with it and we frequently get broken spoke hub drives in the shop some of really high quality like Stromer and some are cheap POS things that shouldn't have been made in the first place and it is always a pain.
Not to mention flat fixes on these things, trying to take out wires and put them back in but sometimes they don't want to come loose or go back together...needless to say, if it has a hub drive best to stay away. They might be fine for short commutes near shops with a very light rider/cargo on a high quality bike using high quality parts that isn't a super high powered motor and is ridden pretty gently but we are sadly in the real world where that isn't practical.
Plus I wouldn't want to convert a perfectly good bike to a crappy bike with a motor and battery on it. I would certainly want a dedicated platform that can handle the loads going through it and is designed for being an good e-bike. Hence why something like an R+M Supercharger would be perfect for the task.
Not to mention flat fixes on these things, trying to take out wires and put them back in but sometimes they don't want to come loose or go back together...needless to say, if it has a hub drive best to stay away. They might be fine for short commutes near shops with a very light rider/cargo on a high quality bike using high quality parts that isn't a super high powered motor and is ridden pretty gently but we are sadly in the real world where that isn't practical.
Plus I wouldn't want to convert a perfectly good bike to a crappy bike with a motor and battery on it. I would certainly want a dedicated platform that can handle the loads going through it and is designed for being an good e-bike. Hence why something like an R+M Supercharger would be perfect for the task.
12-13-18, 10:14 PM
#32
Senior Member
Pedego/Prodeco has had so many problems with broken spokes they won't replace a wheel till nearly every single spoke is broken at once. I spoke with them for a customer who had 20 broken spokes at one time and they were still like nope, just rebuild it, we don't replace till you hit 30.
12-14-18, 03:34 PM
#34
Senior Member
One of the things I liked about touring was the feeling of self sufficiency, and travelling under my own power. With an E-bike you wouldn't get that satisfaction of riding over Red Mountain pass and saying "I did it ". Also you are limited to campgrounds or inns where you can recharge the batteries.
12-14-18, 04:36 PM
#35
Senior Member
One of the things I liked about touring was the feeling of self sufficiency, and travelling under my own power. With an E-bike you wouldn't get that satisfaction of riding over Red Mountain pass and saying "I did it ". Also you are limited to campgrounds or inns where you can recharge the batteries.
or... on a unicycle, backwards... 
12-14-18, 05:05 PM
#36
Senior Member
One of the things I liked about touring was the feeling of self sufficiency, and travelling under my own power. With an E-bike you wouldn't get that satisfaction of riding over Red Mountain pass and saying "I did it ". Also you are limited to campgrounds or inns where you can recharge the batteries.
12-15-18, 03:57 AM
#37
Senior Member
True, I should have said the "illusion of self sufficiency". Maybe if you built all the parts on a bicycle from metal that you mined, smelted, forged shaped etc, with tools that you made yourself, etc you'd be self sufficient.
12-15-18, 04:28 AM
#38
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I think 'personal achievement' is a better description of the feeling I get having completed a multi-week tour. There may come a day when E-assist is the only option but until then it isn't one I'd consider.
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12-15-18, 08:27 AM
#39
Senior Member
Thread Starter
my days of being a hero on a bike is truly over, the more help i can get getting over a hill the better that's the truth .
i don't enjoy cycling these days to much pain when the road starts to go up even riding my granny gear 34x34.
when your back is knackered theres no fun in cycling ,a good quality ebike would sort out the hills for me get me back in the saddle .but at the moment there just way to expensive,if i win the lottery tonight (yeah right) i'll buy that RnM super charger.
anto.
i don't enjoy cycling these days to much pain when the road starts to go up even riding my granny gear 34x34.
when your back is knackered theres no fun in cycling ,a good quality ebike would sort out the hills for me get me back in the saddle .but at the moment there just way to expensive,if i win the lottery tonight (yeah right) i'll buy that RnM super charger.
anto.
12-15-18, 11:00 AM
#40
Senior Member
my days of being a hero on a bike is truly over, the more help i can get getting over a hill the better that's the truth .
i don't enjoy cycling these days to much pain when the road starts to go up even riding my granny gear 34x34.
when your back is knackered theres no fun in cycling ,a good quality ebike would sort out the hills for me get me back in the saddle .but at the moment there just way to expensive,if i win the lottery tonight (yeah right) i'll buy that RnM super charger.
anto.
i don't enjoy cycling these days to much pain when the road starts to go up even riding my granny gear 34x34.
when your back is knackered theres no fun in cycling ,a good quality ebike would sort out the hills for me get me back in the saddle .but at the moment there just way to expensive,if i win the lottery tonight (yeah right) i'll buy that RnM super charger.
anto.
12-15-18, 01:10 PM
#41
Clark W. Griswold
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One of the things I liked about touring was the feeling of self sufficiency, and travelling under my own power. With an E-bike you wouldn't get that satisfaction of riding over Red Mountain pass and saying "I did it ". Also you are limited to campgrounds or inns where you can recharge the batteries.
12-15-18, 02:32 PM
#42
Senior Member
Thread Starter
i know what it's like to push a fully loaded bike up a steep hill, Torture .lol
i just came across a review this bike looks great.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=d38Dwq6kq-k
i just came across a review this bike looks great.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=d38Dwq6kq-k
12-15-18, 02:48 PM
#43
Senior Member
Did you pave roads yourself btw? Why do you need roads anyway?
As you acknowledge, this is just e-bike hate rooted in a fear of novelty.
12-15-18, 03:01 PM
#44
Senior Member
I wouldn't want a big heavy weight in my wheel along with an even heavier weight of my gear above it and even heavier weight of me above that...
Meh. It seems like most of the people on this forum haul around twice the weight I do on tour. It seems crazy to me, but they still seem to enjoy themselves. It actually seems more reasonable to me if they had a motor to haul it all. I can’t imagine enjoying hauling 50lbs+ of gear up hills all day. A motor might make it alright.
...needless to say, if it has a hub drive best to stay away.
A Billion Chinese people are cruising around on these things every day. Not to mention all of the non-Chinese who ride them problem free. I recently converted a mtb that I use for bike delivery. Nothing so fancy and overpriced as a Bionix kit. Not even a geared drive. It’s a 350w direct drive rear hub. The whole kit was $150 on Amazon. I beat the crap out of it, in all weather, riding off of curbs, constant stop and go under full acceleration delivering about seven hours daily(more deliveries made means more money). I have at Least 1,000mi+ on it currently. Not a single problem. Many, Many peole have the same experience with many more miles. Check out the forum endless sphere. It’s a big ebike forum. You work in a shop. Of course you deal with broken bikes all day. And they are more difficult to work on than a regular bike, so if ebikes aren’t your thing, you’re going to find that annoying and frustrating. But for every one you have to deal with, there are a Lot more out there working just fine, just like with regular bikes. That’s like a car mechanic saying not to buy a modern car because they’re more difficult to work on than an older one, and they see them broken down all day.
Plus I wouldn't want to convert a perfectly good bike to a crappy bike with a motor and battery on it. I would certainly want a dedicated platform.
No one is talking about converting a sweet high end bike. But a random used Trek or something, who cares? There are a ton of them to be had for cheap, they’re decent enough to get the job done, etc. I would honestly never buy a dedicated ebike from a shop. I can build out a decent frame with a Nice mid-drive or geared rear hub and bigger custom battery with a nicer controller and nice Shimano components for probably 1/2(or less?) of the price of an equivalent bike from a shop. And if what you say is correct, the one from the shop will be a pos and have constant issues anyway.
Meh. It seems like most of the people on this forum haul around twice the weight I do on tour. It seems crazy to me, but they still seem to enjoy themselves. It actually seems more reasonable to me if they had a motor to haul it all. I can’t imagine enjoying hauling 50lbs+ of gear up hills all day. A motor might make it alright.
...needless to say, if it has a hub drive best to stay away.
A Billion Chinese people are cruising around on these things every day. Not to mention all of the non-Chinese who ride them problem free. I recently converted a mtb that I use for bike delivery. Nothing so fancy and overpriced as a Bionix kit. Not even a geared drive. It’s a 350w direct drive rear hub. The whole kit was $150 on Amazon. I beat the crap out of it, in all weather, riding off of curbs, constant stop and go under full acceleration delivering about seven hours daily(more deliveries made means more money). I have at Least 1,000mi+ on it currently. Not a single problem. Many, Many peole have the same experience with many more miles. Check out the forum endless sphere. It’s a big ebike forum. You work in a shop. Of course you deal with broken bikes all day. And they are more difficult to work on than a regular bike, so if ebikes aren’t your thing, you’re going to find that annoying and frustrating. But for every one you have to deal with, there are a Lot more out there working just fine, just like with regular bikes. That’s like a car mechanic saying not to buy a modern car because they’re more difficult to work on than an older one, and they see them broken down all day.
Plus I wouldn't want to convert a perfectly good bike to a crappy bike with a motor and battery on it. I would certainly want a dedicated platform.
No one is talking about converting a sweet high end bike. But a random used Trek or something, who cares? There are a ton of them to be had for cheap, they’re decent enough to get the job done, etc. I would honestly never buy a dedicated ebike from a shop. I can build out a decent frame with a Nice mid-drive or geared rear hub and bigger custom battery with a nicer controller and nice Shimano components for probably 1/2(or less?) of the price of an equivalent bike from a shop. And if what you say is correct, the one from the shop will be a pos and have constant issues anyway.
Last edited by 3speed; 12-15-18 at 03:12 PM.
12-15-18, 03:27 PM
#45
Senior Member
As long as you'd made your own clothes, grew the cotton, sheared the wool from the sheep you raised, fed them, raised them, tilled the soil for the crops that fed them, owned the oil wells and drilled for the petrol for your polyester BY HAND. What about your shoes? And you didn't mention componentry or tires or saddles.
Did you pave roads yourself btw? Why do you need roads anyway?
As you acknowledge, this is just e-bike hate rooted in a fear of novelty.
Did you pave roads yourself btw? Why do you need roads anyway?
As you acknowledge, this is just e-bike hate rooted in a fear of novelty.
05-02-19, 04:15 AM
#46
Member
I have nothing against any rider of any age wanting to ride an ebike for commuting or touring. Whatever tickles your fancy. It’s all good. I am fairly young & in great shape, so I haven’t considered an ebike really. But I sure would love to try one for fun. I do a lot of international touring however, and from what i understand, no airlines will let you bring an ebike on a plane. So thats a dealbreaker for me. Otherwise, i think they are kinda cool. And tech is improving all the time. Here in NYC Chinese delivery guys have been using ebikes for years. I love racing them. Lol. And I am kinda jealous when they blow past me up hills. Argh! I often wonder how good an ebike would be with loaded panniers. Especially pulling loads up hills. Could come in handy. But then if you run out of juice how annoying are they to pedal with the added weight of the batteries? And if you’re out in the middle of nowhere, how hard is it to get them charged again. For now, at my age, I am fine with no electric assist. But i could see where it’s a great thing for some people. Anything that gets people moving is fine by me.
05-02-19, 05:23 AM
#47
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I have seen many people touring on e-bikes in europe. If it means the difference of riding vs sitting at home DO IT. :-)
05-02-19, 08:31 AM
#48
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Adventure Cycling sampled a $7800 Riese & Mueller purpose-built touring e-bike
https://www.r-m.de/en-us/models/deli...#F00144_050207
https://www.adventurecycling.org/sit...ller_Legan.pdf
and said it was the cat's pajamas. They've suggested that unless it's a short S24O, you'll want to plan your tour around indoor overnight accommodations to assure the ability to recharge. They did mention the bike's ~70 lbs (32 kg) unladen weight, and that makes me think the cycletourist would be running on at least some assist everywhere but perhaps downhill.
BTW - I see the boost-to-28mph (45kph) model is only ~5% more (MSRP) than the boost-to-20mph (32kph) model. They externally have no readily discernable difference. Unless one lives in an unknown-to-me jurisdiction where e-bikes are regularly inspected/tested by the authorities, why wouldn't one buy the model capable of higher speeds? Hmm.
In an entirely different article, they told the tale of an organized tour advertised for 'singles' where, due to some snafus, only one participant was actually single. Awkward. This got me thinking: how would you feel if you signed up (paid) for an organized tour and when you arrived at the start found you were the only participant that wasn't on an e-bike?
https://www.r-m.de/en-us/models/deli...#F00144_050207
https://www.adventurecycling.org/sit...ller_Legan.pdf
and said it was the cat's pajamas. They've suggested that unless it's a short S24O, you'll want to plan your tour around indoor overnight accommodations to assure the ability to recharge. They did mention the bike's ~70 lbs (32 kg) unladen weight, and that makes me think the cycletourist would be running on at least some assist everywhere but perhaps downhill.
BTW - I see the boost-to-28mph (45kph) model is only ~5% more (MSRP) than the boost-to-20mph (32kph) model. They externally have no readily discernable difference. Unless one lives in an unknown-to-me jurisdiction where e-bikes are regularly inspected/tested by the authorities, why wouldn't one buy the model capable of higher speeds? Hmm.
In an entirely different article, they told the tale of an organized tour advertised for 'singles' where, due to some snafus, only one participant was actually single. Awkward. This got me thinking: how would you feel if you signed up (paid) for an organized tour and when you arrived at the start found you were the only participant that wasn't on an e-bike?
Last edited by tcs; 05-02-19 at 08:36 AM.
05-02-19, 09:55 AM
#49
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Same here. When I crossed the U.S. in 1999 a subset of our small group stayed at a senior center in IA to escape the dreadful heat and humidity. Someone from the county paper came by to interview us for a story. I basically commented that my goal was to ride every foot without any motorized assistance (except for the three ferry rides we had to take) and that if had a mechanical that necessitated a ride forward for repairs I fully intended to return to the sport where I broke down and continue riding again. That never happened, and I achieved my goal. Didn't even have to walk one hill.
05-02-19, 11:41 AM
#50
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Big Dummy has been motorized into the $5,000 Big Easy, with Bosch Performance CX drive and PowerPack 500. This motorbike apparently has a range of ~100 miles depending on several variables, including a cadence of 60.
