shoota 

Guys I have a couple questions about the binder bolt that came on my '71 Windsor. First off what do we call this type? Secondly, is this Simplex? Thirdly, is there a Campy version that would work? Seems unlikely that this would have been original but I suppose it could have.

Gary Fountain

That looks like a Simplex made bolt - not that that is of any consequence. I think your Windsor needs a 3-part nut and bolt 'system' like you would find on a Cinelli Supercorsa. I think the Windsor's were based on the Cinelli Supercorsa design. I may be wrong and others will correct me but I can see that working. It's a cheese headed bolt at either end of a hexagon shaped barrel. The barrel fits between the seat stays and a bolt goes through the seatstay from either side into the barrel.

You can still buy these on ebay.

Here's one:



Or even one similar to this but it would have to be the correct length, shaft diameter and the bolt head diameter would have to fit the stepped recess in either side of the hole in your frame:



Just search Cinelli seatpost binder bolt in ebay.

Best of luck.

3alarmer 

...I would probably replace that with a Sugino post bolt. They seem less prone to breaking than the Campagnolo ones. They do come in a couple of different lengths, so make sure to measure before you buy anything. Problem Solvers also makes one you can buy in the various lengths from these guys.

unterhausen

That's not an original. I thought they just came with the proper diameter Campagnolo bolt

That's pretty much the same seat cluster as a vintage Cinelli

shoota 

It certainly doesn't look original. But the proprietary Cinelli binder bolts do look promising.

Kactus

Could the one you have be a Schwinn bolt? I've seen ones that look like that identified as Schwinn bolts on eBay.

merziac

I vote Schwinn too. Here is an original Cinelli and a Gus Salmon reproduction, all very similar and very likely close to whatever was original. Never heard them called a type, just by brand and style. Merz has some Chater Lea reproductions that he made for sale now on his FB page, very nice and would work very well for these.








https://www.facebook.com/merzbicycles

Gary Fountain

This image is from the Classic Rendezvous site and it sounds like the image was from an old Bicycling Magazine test of a Windsor:

shoota 

Wow good find. That looks really similar to mine.

3speedslow

shoota 

Well, it works, so maybe I should just leave well enough alone.

juvela

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Bolt not original to bicycle.

Made in Japan for Schwinn so "Schwinn Approved."

Maker may have been someone like Primus.

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merziac

Now that you say Primus, it makes sense. Is the nut original to the bolt?

merziac

You can get the rerpo's at Cyclomondo, $$$

Gary Fountain

I still like the Cinelli binder bolt but using it depends on the binder bolt hole diameter on your frame and if the outer ends of the hole are recessed/stepped up in diameter to suit the Cinelli binder bolt heads. Just looking around the photos of Windsor frames, it looks like the Windsor binder bolt hole is larger in diameter that the Cinelli binder bolt hole and it doesn't have that larger diameter step at either end of the hole. It's hard to find a good photo of this part of a Windsor frame - as you know.

The Cinelli barrel nut can be fragile at the two ends but it does work well and looks much neater and cleaner. It has been in use on Cinelli frames for many years on their 'fast back' seat cluster and Cinelli frames are among the best production frames you can get. But, if it doesn't fit, it doesn't fit and it's probably not original. I just know quite a few Windsor frames have been re-identified a Cinelli frames in the past.

There are so many variations to seatpost binder bolts as there are so many variations to the binder bolt holes of the thousands of frame worldwide. I never overlooked buying binder bolts when I came across them.

3alarmer 

....I have one of these earlier Windsor Professional bikes, but I'm pretty sure what's on it now is something I bodged together because I didn't like what was on it when it came to me. It would be a lot of work to go out, take it all apart and measure the diameter and length. IIRC, the holes were not standard Cinelli setup. I have a later one where the cluster is a little different that came with a straight up Campy bolt.

I have a tendency to modify stuff like this when I need to....for example filing or grinding the key off a keyed Sugino bolt if the frame has no keyhole. Stuff like that.

edit: I could be wrong on my memory of the binder bolt holes. If you take yours apart, look for the distinctive recesses that would be good indications that a Cinelli binder bolt might be the original fit.

shoota 

I could easily do that but I don't know what I'm looking for to be honest. Maybe I'll take some pics and see if you guys can tell.

3alarmer 

under where this bolt head is recessed, there will be some kind of step, so the bolt head (and the one on the other side IIRC) has something to push against in closing up the slot to press on the seat post. If there's no step (like the majority of binder bolt arrangements), then it's probably just a regular setup for either a keyed binder bolt or a Campy type.

Or it might have just come with something similar to what's on there now, since it's from the early 1970's.

merziac

Here's a 60 SC with the bolts I posted above. There is a bit of a recess on each side, maybe there were washers originally or the somewhat crude bolts could have carved them out. Probably no way to know for sure this far down the road.

It looks very similar to the setup in question.

steelbikeguy

by chance, I've got that article on the Windsor Pro from the Oct 1975 issue of Bicycling, and I have it scanned and posted to flickr. Let me post the pages here.....

Steve in Peoria

juvela

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Yes, nut original to bolt.

Primus just a guess on me part. Do not know name of maker.

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juvela

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Here are some images of a NOS example of the Schwinn binder -







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Bad Lag

Why not tap one side and clearance drill the other. You can install a stainless steel allen head bolt. It will look as clean as can be and will never look buggered up or rusty.

merziac

Maybe on the Windsor, probably not on the SC.

Bad Lag

This thread is a bout a 71 Windsor, right?

Binder bolts have always been a weak part of the design of bicycles. I see nothing wrong with improving that feature. Tapping would require a solid area on the lug, not a hollow, stamped part.