Steel is Real.. Explain?
#76
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I agree that's the point of a lot of people who do it, but I don't think you're justified in calling them idiots for doing so. It's not a definitively wrong use of the word.
#77
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If steel really was "faster", every pro in the peloton would be using steel frames, but they don't. There is at least one "ex pro" who does though, and you gotta respect his steel Paramount. He obviously knows his stuff, and absolutely loves the bike:
#79
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My entire point is that the idea that it is impossible to make light, strong and stiff steel bikes simply isn't true.
-Tim-[/QUOTE]
Only if you weigh no more than 150-160 lbs. To a heavier person, it's like riding a wet noodle.
-Tim-[/QUOTE]
Only if you weigh no more than 150-160 lbs. To a heavier person, it's like riding a wet noodle.
#80
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I just spent a weekend riding 70 miles of gravel, 5000' up and down on my Peter Mooney as a celebration if it turning 40. Sweet ride! Didn't envy the guys riding their new gravel bikes costing far more; jut their legs that were sometimes ad much younger than my legs as their bikes were. Later this summer my bike will hit 50,000 miles.
In that 40 years, it has done fast club rides, long day rides (130 miles + a few times), up and down mountains. It has crashed. Minor crashes, hard crashes. It's fallen over and hit things. Seen less than gentle treatment from movers. And every time I get on it, I get reminded it is a sweet, sweet ride! (I have two custom ti bikes, so it isn't like the rest of the time I ride crap.)
Now, steel does not mean the "magic" is there. Steel can be done badly. Like any material, the details need to be tailored to a good fit for that rider and use. Still, there is a very long history of steel bikes that were that "magic". Many builders and a quite a few big companies regularly did and do turn out those bikes.
Ben
In that 40 years, it has done fast club rides, long day rides (130 miles + a few times), up and down mountains. It has crashed. Minor crashes, hard crashes. It's fallen over and hit things. Seen less than gentle treatment from movers. And every time I get on it, I get reminded it is a sweet, sweet ride! (I have two custom ti bikes, so it isn't like the rest of the time I ride crap.)
Now, steel does not mean the "magic" is there. Steel can be done badly. Like any material, the details need to be tailored to a good fit for that rider and use. Still, there is a very long history of steel bikes that were that "magic". Many builders and a quite a few big companies regularly did and do turn out those bikes.
Ben
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#81
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A frame materials thread gets you guys every time. It's like Lucy with the football.
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#83
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It's a matter of the right material for the job. Many bike parts can be built lighter, far more easily and at lower cost in aluminum. (I don't think I have ever owned an aluminum bike axle. To me, that is a place, like QR skewers, where steel is the right material for the job.) Seat rails - ti has more give in this crucial bike/body interface. I'm light and I ride ti railed seats. CF forks - lighter. (That said, I will never own one and and just stick to good steel forks I trust. I've owned a few with sweet rides.)
Ben
Ben
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It's a matter of the right material for the job. Many bike parts can be built lighter, far more easily and at lower cost in aluminum. (I don't think I have ever owned an aluminum bike axle. To me, that is a place, like QR skewers, where steel is the right material for the job.) Seat rails - ti has more give in this crucial bike/body interface. I'm light and I ride ti railed seats. CF forks - lighter. (That said, I will never own one and and just stick to good steel forks I trust. I've owned a few with sweet rides.)
Ben
Ben
Ritchey claimed:
"So they don't make springs out of aluminum, they barely make springs out of carbon fibre - they do make some springs out of titanium but with some limitations. But in the same way that a spoke is steel and an axle is steel and a chain is steel and other things on the bike that are important are made of steel - a frame is steel for a reason."
BTW, aluminum axles are ubiquitous, especially on high end hubs. Ritchey claims that the carbon forks offer wider tire clearance.
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My steel '97 Colnago is quite light, and it's not their top-grade steel frame by about two or three levels - you can get a steel frame that's just as light as anything else (within a certain budget of course), but also softens rough roads and makes long sportives more forgiving on your body.
Another "bonus" is maintenance and longevity, you don't have to worry so much about transporting on a rack, press-fit bottom brackets, or overtightening a seatpost binder bolt and cracking something.
Another "bonus" is maintenance and longevity, you don't have to worry so much about transporting on a rack, press-fit bottom brackets, or overtightening a seatpost binder bolt and cracking something.
#87
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With all due respect, you simply don't know what you are talking about.
This simply isn't true and your statement illustrates a fundamental lack of understanding about the most basic aspects of steel frames made today.
I weigh 175 and my True Temper S3 steel bike is anything but a wet noodle. It is as stiff as any carbon bike made today.
-Tim-
Last edited by TimothyH; 05-20-19 at 02:19 PM.
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#89
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If you're used to a steel bike with a sport-touring wheelbase and then ride a carbon bike or an aluminum bike with a shorter wheelbase, you're likely to think that the frame material is responsible for the very different feel of the bike, but the material has a much smaller effect than the wheelbase.
I've owned about a dozen high-end steel racing bikes over the years, and I still have one 25-year-old Reynolds 853 bike, but I haven't ridden it more than a couple of times since I got my first aluminum bike, 15 years ago. It's a fine bike; I just prefer my aluminum bikes, especially on fast descents, where the handling is delightfully predictable.
Finally, since this is turning into a lengthy steel-versus-carbon-versus-aluminum thread, including the usual claims about steel's near-invincibility, here's that 1997 German Tour magazine fatigue test of a number of different frames and different frame materials (spoiler: all the steel frames [and both titanium frames] cracked; the frames that did not crack were all either carbon or aluminum).
Last edited by Trakhak; 05-20-19 at 02:34 PM.
#90
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Now? It's been the thing for decades.
If you do a Google search on "steel is real" quote, the first result up is dated 2005.
Plus of course, bicycles have been built out of steel since ... well ... pretty much the beginning. Seriously, read some history!
https://gearpatrol.com/2015/05/20/wh...s-still-great/
And steel doesn't have to be heavy.
If you do a Google search on "steel is real" quote, the first result up is dated 2005.
Plus of course, bicycles have been built out of steel since ... well ... pretty much the beginning. Seriously, read some history!
https://gearpatrol.com/2015/05/20/wh...s-still-great/
And steel doesn't have to be heavy.
#91
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Maybe the word shouldn't be "real" - some of us like steel frames, especially classic ones, for other reasons, like aesthetics (thin straight tubes, horizontal top tubes, lugs) and tradition (with more than 150 years of steel bicycles). Valid reasons IMO.
#92
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Vari-Wall ThermLX tubing.
It rides like a Cadillac.
Steel is real.
The rest of the weight is component selection. I assure you, what Tim says is true. I've ridden their sub 14 pound Outlaw & it's amazing. They have one on display & it's one of their most popular bikes.
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#94
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I sprayed some rust proofing oil inside my steel frames because I ride all year round in all weather conditions...Cro- moly steel is pretty rust resistant and will last a very long time even without rustproofing. I've never seen a steel bicycle rust out.
#95
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#96
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I am 240# and havent found riding steel frame and fork bikes to be like riding a wet noodle. This goes for traditional diameter tubing and OS tubing. I own a lot of steel road, gravel, and touring bikes that are from the 80s, 90s, and present. I am 6'5 too, so the diamond frames are large too, which doesnt help things.
We all ride differently though. Perhaps my output isnt close to yours. Just saying that weight neednt be a reason to not ride a steel frame bike.
#97
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Ill update you in this thread the first time this actually affects me. Dont wait up.
Also- a large % of Taiwan built steel frames are ED dipped to prevent rust. Others are zinc base coated. And then there is just the low odds of a frame being affected by internal rusting. If it is affected by internal rusting, its due to a lack of maintenance.
Also- a large % of Taiwan built steel frames are ED dipped to prevent rust. Others are zinc base coated. And then there is just the low odds of a frame being affected by internal rusting. If it is affected by internal rusting, its due to a lack of maintenance.
#100
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Let's keep it civil, please. I know that's a lot to ask in a frame materials thread, but please try.
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