Road Fan

I'm interested in a set of 5 bolt/nuts for a TA Cyclotourist chainring/drive side arm, where the nuts lie flush next to the BB cup. I'm trying to use a TA 314 spindle, made for TA cups on a 68 mm BB shell, on an old Raleigh Super Lenton frame to have the single front chainring, but on the Raleigh frame with a 70 mm BB shell. The spindle middle shoulder to shoulder distance is 54.5 mm, nearly identical to the Raleigh design of 55 mm. If I can work this all out, it will match the gearing of the original, preserve the low-Q fit of the original, replace a cotter pin installation with square taper, and weenie out a lot of weight. But I need to get bolts that fit closer to flush, by about a millimeter. I'm trying to get a slghtly longer spindle as well, no more than 3 mm on the drive side. The non-drive side fits well. When I tighten it to the common "hand-wrench" standard, the bolt heads on the drive side interfere with the drive side cup. The original Raleigh cups have some steel dogs which engage with a specialized wrench to enable setting the fixed cup into a fixed position. I have the next size up TA spindle, the 334, but it throws off the chain alignment front to back.

Has anyone seen a set of nuts like this, or remember a resolution to this problem?

thumpism 

I might have a NOS set but I'll have to dig for them. PM your contact/shipping info.

oneclick 

Those screws have pretty thin heads to start with, so much so that a normal socket will round the corners. I doubt a set with thinner heads is available, or functional.

Road Fan

You're right, the hex heads and screw threads are delicate. I have the hex heads on the outer or cosmetic side of the chainset, not that mine are so beautiful. On the inner side banging into the fixed cup, are the "blind heads" which have those two strange little slots. I want to make those thinner.

jeirvine 

Velo Orange sells dome hex bolts for those, though they may not be lower.
https://velo-orange.com/collections/...0-4-bcd-cranks

oneclick 

Don't.

They are as thin as the mfr dared make them already.

You need a different axle or cup to get the end of the crank further out.

Are you using the Raleigh cup or a different one?

Road Fan

I think my postings say I'm using the Raleigh cups. That's key for two reasons.

First, the frame is a 1952 Rudge Aero Special, an alternate branding of the 1952 Raleigh Super Lenton. In those days the BB shell threading was the Raleigh proprietary threading, which has a thread pitch unique to Raleigh of these early years. So I have to stick with the Raleigh cup, unless I want to spend +++ $$$ for special Phil Woods cups. And the bike fits up like a track bike, but wih a 3 or 4 speed Sturmey hub in the back. It came with an AW and I could lace a rim around a FW or FM, or even a 5-speed if I had one.

Second, with that cup it isn't possible to slip a 1.5 mm spacer between a cup flange and the BB shell face (as one can with vintage Campy), because the cup has no flange. I may be able to try smaller balls. And the TA 314 (single) and 344 (double) spindles both have a "B" dimension of 54.5 mm, where the original Raleigh Industries cottered spindle is 55.0 mm. That B-dimension match is the key to this wild scheme working. I also checked the Stronglight spindle I have, and it's dimensions are about the same as for the TA. To fix this with a spindle choice alone I would need about three more millimeters on the drive end and no change to the non-drive.

The ultimate goal here is (like a track bike) to make the chainline as clean as possible as well as lightening the bike and getting square taper rather than cotter pins. I could go to the 344 TA spindle, about 5 mm wider on the drive side, and maybe spacer the SA hub over to match chainline, possibly cold-setting the rear triangle and aligning the dropouts. Then I have to do spoke work to restore dish.

oneclick 

Maybe it's just that the gods decided we have to suffer for art.

nlerner

If you’re really intent on transitioning from cottered to cotterless and getting the chain line dialed in, I think you should spring for the 26pti Phil Wood cups rather than end up with a handful of spindles and ground down chainring bolts.

Road Fan

Well, I already have the spindles (TA 314 and 344), and I think I'm going to focus on re-positioning the chainset or the rear sprocket, rather than taking material off the pin bolts and nuts. If I had machining chops to cut out new seats for the nuts and make them stand less proud, that might be worth trying, but I don't think I'll be comfortable removing metal from this key drivetrain coupling, and I doubt I can remove more than maybe ½ mm before exposing the end of the bolt. I suspect I need to change the chainset position by about 1.5 mm if not more. The root cause of my first problem, interference between chainset bolts and the dogs on the Raleigh cup outer face, is because the cups stand proud, and the BB shell is 70 to 71 mm wide, rather than 68 mm wide. The TA 344 has some extra spindle length on the drive side, so I can use that.

There is a possibility of modifying the Sturmey-Archer sprocket attachment, thus equalizing the F/R chainlines. If these simple options work well together I don't have to worry about spacing over the whole wheel and redishing the rim.

I'll have to take a look at the Phil capabilities in custom cups. As it is I don't think it will do me any good, but I should look.

3alarmer 

...used to be you could buy only the rings (which are not nearly as expensive as the spindle sealed unit), and then use them to hold in the spindle unit of your choice. Nowadays, it's way harder to find a sealed unit BB assembly that doesn't have the drive side cup firmly attached to the unit. You might be able to scrounge up an older BB unit that is cupless. I always thought that if I had to do this again without the Phil official unit, I'd try to find something in a cheaper sealed unit BB that used nylon cups on both sides, and just figure out a way to remove the drive side one.

oneclick 

There are dished sprockets for Nexus hubs, looks as though it's more than 1.5mm of dish, but not much more. One of those (they fit Sturmey) could be useful.

EDIT: Think I have one on a bike, will see if so and measure how much.

oneclick 

Dished sprocket is 1.20 thick, with dish 1.90, dish = .70 (inches); 1.8mm, more or less.

(new one, was pulled and replaced with a 3/32 sprocket)