pilam99

A laptop computer has TONS more engineering than your motorcycle yet it only costs $500. Does that mean the motorcycle should only cost $500? The engineering of the laptop is amoritized over many more units. Think of cellphones, considering the tower infrastructure, my FREE cellphone involves TONS more engineering than a motorcycle, it has taken decades to roll out cell infrastructure. Sat TV requires rocket ships and satellites floating around in space but it's cheaper than a motorcycle.

I can understand that a $12k bike seems ridiculous to some because a bike that appears to be similar can be had for $500. You could also argue that a $10k diamond ring is way too similar to a $99 diamond ring and it takes the same amount of effort to dig up the stone.

What you should really be trying to say is that the profit margin on a $12k bike is so much higher than a $1000 bike that it shows that the people that buy a $12k bike are suckers. I would, however, expect the margin may be higher on the lower end bikes... not sure though. Higher volume typically = higher margin but some markets are competitive in a way that this is not the case (i.e. Sony Playstation=loss leader but high volume)

DrPete 

Being someone who can't afford a $12K bike right now, I totally agree that they should cost $3K.

DScott

I'm going out on a limb here, but I'd guess that you'll never become a millionaire if you don't get a better grasp of the modern marketplace. The cost of that bike reflects R&D, production, marketing, distribution and sufficient profit along the line to keep all that going.

The market is not stupid.

Grumpy McTrumpy

My new build is pretty high-end. I am saving as much money as possible on this build by using last year's frame and last year's gruppo. Also the wheels are used. I am under $5k, but not by much. It's pretty kick-ass though. I'm not sure if it could be improved by much, maybe a couple of pounds. At the moment it is in the 15 pound range. It is doubtful that it would double the cost to get it to the UCI limit.

I do all my own work on the bikes though, so that is a cost savings. $3k can get you a really nice bike if you do your own work, but it would be tough to make it strong, light and aero.

Grumpy McTrumpy

by the way: I actually own a gixxer 600. They absolutely shave as many grams off them as possible given the price point. The headers are titanium. As are the valves. There is very little steel on that bike. I think the dry weight is somewhere around 350. Replacing the stock body with a race body and changing out the exhaust system will give you a bike worthy of superstock racing.

eric01

A $12k bike is only silly if it doesn't sell and the company loses money.

If a company can manufacturer a product and sell it successfully at a certain price point, who are we to judge? Doesn't matter if you or I agree with the perceived value.

If there is demand, $12k bikes will sell will continue to be made. If there is no demand and no sales, the company loses money and stops making $12k bikes.

I for one, am happy for free markets. I don't want to participate in an economy where arbitrary caps are placed on goods.

roy5000x2

I think we're all looking at this the wrong way. The $12,000 we have isn't silly. The $12,000 bike isn't silly. We're silly

andr0id

The part that bothers me is at what point in time did quality made products become a luxury?

I see the scale as follows.

Poorly made junk that barely accomplishes the goals of the product. Breaks quickly, go buy another one. Walmart is full of this kind of stuff. It is the American way to be penny smart and dollar foolish because instead of buy one that costs twice as much that lasts a lifetime, we'll buy a new one every year when the one we have breaks.

Quality goods. Well made stuff that does what it is supposed to well, lasts a long time and has replacement parts available for wearing parts.

Luxury goods: Stuff that you buy because of brand marketing to boost your ego or to be recognized as a consumer of product X. MAY be a quality good, but in this day and age, could easily be junk that a brand has slapped their label on to make a buck.

I shoot for quality goods with most of my purchases and I am willing to spend a few more dollars on stuff that is well made and will last. Especially tools, kitchen tools, bicycles equipment, camera and scuba stuff. For the most part I abhor cheaply made crap, although I will sometimes get something in this category for a one time use or when I know it will be expendable.

substructure

My very expensive bike got eated by the road. Let's hope that road doesn't eated this new (not as expensive) one. Both way over 3000.

DrPete 

This is a completely arbitrary distinction, but I see what you did there. It leaves you an out to own luxury goods but claim that it's only because it's high-quality, thereby making you seem like a discerning consumer and not ego-driven. Nice.

MONGO!

I think it's ridiculous that a bike can cost one thousand dollars, but that's just me.

UGASkiDawg

UGASkiDawg

All that and it reflects mostly what the people will pay.....the demand side is much more important......

umd

When I was a kid, my parents would buy me shoes at Payless. They weren't particularly comfortable and they didn't last very long so they had to constantly buy me new ones. One day at a mall I fell in love with a pair of Nikes. They looked really cool and they felt good but they were over $100 (20 years ago), probably about 4x the price of the payless shoes. I begged and begged my parents and eventually got them to buy me a pair. And gosh darn if they didn't last nearly a whole year instead of a month or two like the payless crap. When it was time to get new ones they didn't have any problem with spending a similar amount of money again. And as a bonus, I found out that the Payless shoes had no arch support and were destroying my feet, which is why they were so uncomfortable.

A lot of bike stuff is expensive because it is hand made or made in limited production runs. Sometimes that means it is more expensive to produce but usually it just means they have to charge more to recover their costs and make some profit. Oh noes, profit... nobody should make any profit selling stuff!

Of course there is a lot of rebadged generic stuff (cue lazyrider rant) that is sold for much more money than the same item with the generic name but I don't think any of that is in the $12K territorry. Really though, there aren't many bikes in that price range and you have to really get into the tricked out components to get there.

sced

Quality and luxury are different concepts. Quality is functional and luxury merely describes relative price. People expect a luxury good to be of quality, but there are many examples to the contrary that obviate this generalization, e.g., an expensive high performance car that breaks a lot such as recent Mercedes versus a less expensive Toyota that's rock solid reliable. The quality of some luxury goods such as perfume, liquor, and designer clothing can't even be defined because the rationale for their purchase is completely subjective - how it smells, tastes, or looks.

MIN 

$12K FRAME anyone?

rooftest

Wait a second - a GSXR 600 costs 10 grand these days? I think what offended most people is that you compared the "little gixxer" to a high-end bicycle. I think the gsxr 600 is better compared to a $3,000 bike, and something from MV Agusta or Ducati would be along the lines of a $12,000 one.

(cue the gsxr 600 owner, who will now tell us how his bike does 7 second 1/4 miles, 350 mph, and gets 200 miles per gallon.)

fauxto nick

patentcad

Correct.

What's your point?

patentcad

You are from NC, aren't you?

umd

Where are all the $12,000 bikes anyway? seriously, I doubt anyone here has one...

DrPete 

Nobody who can afford one will be found on the interwebs calling it silly. I think WideAMG's Super Record-equipped Pinarello is right up there...

oilman_15106

Good reply. A $30 Timex watch pretty much keeps good time. So why do they sell watches upwards of $100,000 that pretty much can accomplish the same goal?

shabbasuraj

$12000? meh.. dime a dozen nowadays.

$17000-$20000 is what gets me out of bed for bikes.

I am NOT joking.

duckbill

Mass-produced Bicycles could be compared to mass-produced Motorcycles but top shelf hand built Bicycles should then be compared to hand built sport bikes like the Ducati Desmosedici RR at $75,000.00.