Rootman

Last night I nearly got nailed. I was on the 'super sidewalk', the city put 8' wide sidewalks on either side of a 5 lane street that has a speed limit of 50MPH. No shoulders, it's curb to curb, always busy and traffic can get up to 60+mph on it most times. Years ago when riding with a friend one early Saturday morning traffic was a bit lighter and he insisted on riding in the street. A cop going the other direction did a 'U'ie and pulled up behind him and told him to use the sidewalk, he actually said "No cop in this city will ever tell you to ride on this street, it's too fast and too dangerous - ride on the sidewalk". But I digress.

I was headed EAST on the north side of the street - going opposite traffic (I live on that side). A car also heading east decides to make a left hand turn onto an upcoming intersecting street and had to cross the westbound traffic to make the turn. I too was already was crossing the intersecting street continuing east. He evidently didn't even look and just made the turn. I didn't see him because he was decelerating from ~50 mph and 4 lanes over - and made the turn with a wide sweep, crossing into the turn lane (I checked before I started to cross the turn lane was empty) without stopping and with NO turn signal. There was no walk signal on the street for the sidewalk users.

He came up on me in the north bound lane, brakes screeching and him screaming at me. He came withing a few inches of hitting me before he stopped. I have to say I was a bit pissed and flipped him the bird and vocalized the gesture as well. This was the fastest and closest call I've had in quite a while.

So, wasn't he supposed to yield, for the first reason because he was crossing traffic? And secondly because they was a pedestrian / bike in the street? I know s@!t happens, but this was just him not even looking, seeing his turn at the last moment with a hole in traffic and gunning through the turn. When I heard the tires screeching and actually felt the heat of the vehicle on my leg a brief instant I though I was a goner. I typically avoid this street, but it was getting on towards dusk and I needed to get home rather than take the 4 mile longer safer route.

So, was I over reacting?

KraneXL

Your pronouns are confusing. I have to read that 3 times and I'm still not sure of your point. Anyway, just take a photo next time. Remember, "one picture is worth a thousand words." (super sidewalks?).

As for the turning vehicle, always yield to oncoming traffic, except when they have the arrow. However, if you're going against traffic you're are in the wrong and the fault is all yours.

Maelochs

This, and this again.

First off .... short, simple sentences. Second, make sure that you use either just one system of location/direction throughout, or use both everywhere. "I was going east on the north side and turning left while he was turning left on my right" needs a diagram .... which is another good plan.

Krane XL is right this time---the driver should always yield and check ahead before and while turning---but if you were making an illegal turn ...

were you in a crosswalk? Were you jaywalking? Were you coming off a sidewalk and onto a a road?

But the meat of the nut is this---You Were Going the Wrong Way---or so you say. Your explanation is so convoluted it is not worth it to me to figure it out.

I am not trying to give you a hard time.

I got hit once by a lady in similar circumstances---I saw her coming and couldn't believe what she did. This lady was in the far right line of oncoming traffic on a six-lane road with tun lanes. I was on the far right going the other way----so there were about eight lanes between us. She was hauling butt when I saw her, going the other way, but in this particularly dangerous stretch of road I was swivel-necking and saw her---in the periphery of my vision---make a high speed U-turn across four lanes of traffic on her side and then cross three lanes on the other side of the road.

I don't think she hit the brakes at all---and if she hadn't taken seven lanes to make the 55-mph turn she would have never made it.

Unfortunately that put her coming up behind me at 55 mph while I tried to negotiate a maze of turn lanes and driveways on my right, trying not to get trapped by cars trying to pass me and turn right in front of me, or trying to pull out from the right without looking and run me over.

This lady cut right across me and clipped me in passing---I saw her coming enough to hit the brakes, but i don't think she ever saw me. She was bent on entering a particular driveway and no obstacle was going to stop her. Apparently she had been in such a daze she had steamed right past her turn at 55 mph, then, instead of going to the next light, decided to do a full-speed U-turn which would deposit her right at the driveway she wanted.

Crazier still, there were a bout four driveways to the particular parking lot/access road she was aiming at. She could have Not come across traffic at a right angle to the traffic flow, and simply entered the complex several hundred yards further downstream and driven back. But she was determined to use the drive way she wanted .... obstacle be damned.

Luckily my bike wasn't ruined but I lost a good chunk or two of flesh form my knees and various other parts of my body.

So yes ... I understand the kind of driver you encountered. it can certainly suck hard when people decide where they are going to go without checking to see who else might be there.

However ... if You were also breaking a few traffic laws .... ?? Can't tell form the story you told.

jimincalif

Same issue could have occurred with a pedestrian crossing the street and a pedestrian can walk on the sidewalk and cross the cross street in either direction. Yes the driver is obligated to see that the direction he points his car is clear, so in that sense the driver was in the wrong.

I don't know that you were legally in the wrong, but this is just one of those situations where we as riders have to understand where a driver is likely to be looking and likely to not be looking. Same thing could have happened if you were on the south side, riding on the sidewalk with traffic and a car turns to cross your path. You are on the sidewalk, so you are out of the driver's view and consideration. And with the speed difference this can happen, the car was not turning when you checked the traffic.

This is why groups like Cycling Savvy recommend more taking of the lane than edge/sidewalk riding. But like anything it is situational. Taking a lane as a solo rider on a 50 mph five lane street presents its own risks. I've done it with a group, especially when we can get in the lane while traffic is stopped at a red light.

No great answer here IMO, glad you are already. The driver should have been relieved that it was a miss also.

wphamilton

That is exactly the scenario that worries me the most about riding "wrong way" even on the sidewalk. It's not even reasonable to expect that driver to be aware of you, on the far side of the divided road going the "wrong direction" when he begins his turn. He should see you and wait, but you really are "shooting out of nowhere" coming from that direction and just about nobody crossing you by turning left will. So I have to say that you did over-react, and the driver had a reason to be upset.

You didn't ask, and I don't know the specifics of that street, but regardless of what that cop thinks about safety he was wrong as a matter of law and should have kept his opinion to himself rather than giving you an unlawful order.

Rootman

Sorry, it IS confusing. I was on the 'super sidewalk" - no other explanation can do it justice, instead of being 4' wide, it's 8' wide. A guy I know who worked for the city explained they did it to get cyclist off the fast street, and they didn't want to invest in the infrastructure of adding it to the cities MUP system and having to add signage and controls. So, in essence, a cheat to get cyclists OFF the road and not call it a trail or MUP.

I was going opposite traffic while riding on the sidewalk, so I'm on the north side of the street, headed east along the main roads length. Nothing wrong with that, especially since riding on the other side would entail crossing this street twice, since I was starting and ending on the north side I stayed there. I wasn't IN traffic, but riding facing traffic on a sidewalk next to the street.

The rest is convoluted because it is. Me and the driver were going the same direction, he on the road headed east and, me on the sidewalk headed east. He was on the southern side of the street, right of center, me on the sidewalk on the NORTH of the street. I was crossing an intersection with no control (no walk light, no signage) he swept across the turn lane and both WEST bound lanes into the street I was crossing nearly hitting me. No way I could see him as he was approaching from behind me and deep to the right, and like I said, was not in the left turn lane. I managed to catch him out of the corner of my eye as he made the turn at speed.

Guess I'm still shaken by it. Like I said, I could actually feel the heat from the guys radiator on my leg and I jerked away and he screeched to a stop inches from me. I just needed to vent and maybe let others know again that oftentimes drivers don't look much past the hood of their car, and crazy crap like this can happen in an instant - and you're dead or injured.

trailangel

You were riding on the wrong side. What was your speed?
What time of day? Did you have lights?
Blacked out bike... black spokes?

Paul Barnard

If I understood your post correctly, you just learned one of the many hazards of riding the sidewalk and against traffic. If I were a motorist processing the sidewalk, the snapshot I took prior to making the turn would likely only include enough to encompass pedestrians. A bike moving at bike speeds would likely be out of the snapshot I took. I hope this makes sense and that I understand the situation correctly.

Can you give us an address so that we can look at it on google maps.

wphamilton

Yes, that's exactly what I'm talking about also. You don't see him because he's coming from behind you (from your far right). Even if you do, there's no way to anticipate if he suddenly goes to the left turn lane and turns, crossing your path. He doesn't see you, because nobody looks for "traffic" in that area (his far left behind him), when turning left. He's looking for oncoming traffic, cross traffic and just maybe his rear view mirror if he's ultra-cautious. But not across the lanes of traffic for a vehicle going opposite to the traffic flow.

It's as if someone designed a trap to get you hit.

Rootman

I was riding on the 'super' sidewalk (see my second post above) next to the road riding opposing traffic, protected by a high curb. Nothing wrong with this AFAIK. I've been on the other side many times riding WITH traffic and had a few cars do right hooks nearly take me out.

Hi viz jersey, full bike reflectors, riding east away from the setting sun at 6:40 or so. So, still full daylight but heading towards twilight in 20 minutes, no time to take the 5 mile detour on the MUP and slower streets. I was by this point 75% of the way home. Dong maybe 8 mph, taking it slower because I hate this street. Very limited east west corridors in this town. I was getting ansty for a ride and thought I'd sneak a quick one in after work and cut the time too close for a longer and safer return leg on the MUP.

CliffordK

I think the point is that this sidewalk was more of an off-street MUP than a simple sidewalk, or perhaps a merger of the MUP/sidewalk.

You've hit on exactly one of the dangers with sidewalks. If you had been riding with traffic, the vehicle should have seen you. Likewise, any traffic coming up from behind should also be able to see you.

But, by being separated by multiple lanes of traffic, you are in an unexpected place for the vehicle driver, and he was in an unexpected place for you. With obvious dangers.

Not saying I wouldn't have been exactly where you were.

As a pedestrian, one of the things I have learned to do is always look over my shoulder for potential turning traffic including looking at all turn lanes before crossing a street. Sometimes riding on a MUP, it is easy to forget that detail.

However, going counter traffic flow, you should treat every intersection as a full STOP, and specifically look for those blind spots.

CliffordK

If the setting sun was at your back, then it would have been in the eyes of the oncoming traffic, although that would depend on clouds and smoke in the sky.

trailangel

You just have to be careful

Maelochs

Good points raised here.

Al in all, glad you didn't get run over.

CliffordK

It sounds to me like this was a bit of a logistic nightmare for the city.

Adding MUP signage is extremely cheap. A couple of cans of paint and a few sign posts, it probably would cost less to add signage to the whole corridor than it would cost to put in 10 feet of sidewalk.

Many municipalities require left turns to have designated turn lanes (there apparently was one in this case), otherwise left turns are not permitted.

Is there a center median strip where they could put signs?

What I'd probably do is repaint any "Zebra" crosswalks to be an alternating white/green. Designating it as both a bicycle and pedestrian crosswalk. Or, perhaps split like this.



Then add some signs similar to this in the median strip.



Of course, it doesn't mean all drivers will see and respect the signs, but it is a start.

Rootman

Sorry, I said repeatedly, we were BOTH traveling east - that puts the sun and both our backs. Yes, the sun would have been in the eyes of oncoming traffic, and they were not the issue.

Rootman

Been right hooked more time than this traveling on the other side WITH traffic. Many, many drivers just don't seem to look much further than their hood when driving. I really hate this road but I was in a time crunch and took it. I just have to plan better for time, and with the days growing shorter it's getting tougher getting a ride in after a 10 hour work day.

Clyde1820

Hard to visualized the exact spot and circumstances in question.

Sounds like you were in the special "bike" lane and this vehicle crossed four lanes without warning or signalling across this "bike" lane, nearly hitting you. If it was that simple, it sounds to me like the vehicle was clearly in the wrong, given that he was crossing an active traffic lane, did so rapidly and without signalling and apparently without looking.

I've got a large parking garage structure where I live, which I use frequently. When it has the green light to exit the parking garage, several cars begin moving across the sidewalk and into the cross street. Invariably, pedestrians disregard the red light they have, disregard the don't-walk sign they're given ... and they continue walking anyway, right into the oncoming vehicles. Same sort of insanity, I'd say, in terms of disregard for right of way, safety and looking for oncoming folks legitimately using the lane in question.

As for your reaction: Was it reasonable? Nope. These days, there's only one way it's going to be taken. And that's badly. No upside. Very great risk of a severe downside. IMO, it's never worth it, no matter how good it might feel at the moment. And if push comes to shove (which it might), a resulting violent altercation might well come down to how egged-on whom. Obviously, it gets much tougher to disclaim such fingering and shouts when one has done those things, and harder to claim one was in the "right" for getting into that situation. (The whole aspect in the statutes related to assault/battery, where a co-combatant who contributed to starting the situation not having much of a leg to stand on, legally, if attempting to claim it was all the other person's fault.)

Leisesturm

I'm literally weary from all the confusion. As I read it. The o.p. and the car were going IN THE SAME DIRECTION. The car in the road, the o.p. on the sidewalk. They both got to the intersection at the same time. The car made a right turn just as the o.p. was also entering the intersection. Over 5,000 pedestrians were killed last year in just this fashion. Only 813 cyclists were killed from any kind of motor vehicle collision. The majority of cyclists do not ride any significant distance on the sidewalk. Peds have no choice, however. IF you must, then the onus of responsibility for avoiding cars is on you! Expect that cars will turn into intersections. If they don't, yay, but if they do you are prepared. It is not reasonable to expect drivers to scan sidewalks predicting pedestrian movement as they navigate intersections. It is very reasonable and prudent for pedestrians (or cyclists acting like pedestrians) to monitor the road(s) adjacent to the intersections they approach for moving hazards. This is nothing more (or less) than one of them there 'teachable moments'. The best kind, since no bones were broken or skin (or blood) left at the scene.

bikecrate

The "super sidewalk" you mention is the kind of "cycling" infrastructure I hate the most. Pseudo MUP without any benefits. I avoid them. Is there any safer side streets that would get you off this route?

As far as legal fault...not sure. I would think that if you are entering the intersection the driver has the responsibility to yield (just like they should for a pedestrian crossing).

If you can't find a safer way to go then my only advice is you almost have to treat every intersection as a stop and make sure there aren't any vehicles coming your way before proceeding.

wphamilton

Left turn. Just as if a car in the next lane to your right turns left crossing in front of you. Except that he's several more lanes over and on the sidewalk.

It's worse than the right hook because it's harder to avoid. And the car is likely coming head on at you.

Maelochs

Leagl issues aside ... the sane cyclist has a reasonable responsibility to maintain his r her personal safety.

We always hear drivers saying "I didn't see you," to which we reply, "You didn't look."

Not that I never mess up ... but after enough close calls, i generally look .... and when traveling against traffic on a road i deem Too Dangerous to ride on ... I certainly and going to Stop and Look before enterign said roadway or any major tributaries .....



i hope.

CliffordK

One thing.

If there are traffic lights at some intersections, but not others. Perhaps they should be no left turn at intersections without lights. No driveways?

nomadmax 

In Ohio, if you were riding your bicycle in a place/direction that a car was not legally allowed to travel you were in the wrong (this of course excludes dedicated cycling paths). Legally speaking, walk on the sidewalk and ride on the road. There are times where it may be safer to travel on a sidewalk for a short period but you have to understand that the potential for vehicle conflict goes up at intersections and if it occurs, you will probably be judged wrong.

Paul Barnard

Can you give us an address or a google screen shot of where this occurred?