jpc2001

Thank you all for the perspective.

Here are photos showing the damage. Looking straight down the steerer (1st photo) you can see that the wheel is tilted, with more spoke visible on the right hand side. If I center up the wheel and look straight down across the wheel (2nd photo) the steerer tube is bent to the right.




The pictured wheel is brand new (not crashed) and straight. The wheel sits just about perfectly centered in the crown. That bend in the steerer puts the tire's contact patch something like 12mm off to the right side of the steering axis. This makes the bike want to turn left without constant correction.

The rest of the frame is straight. I'm increasingly certain that the pictures show all the damage.

Kontact 

Than buy a fork and have it installed.

This one is new, cheap, has a long steerer and is chromed:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/39470405559...Bk9SR4KP0IjrYg

Mr. 66

Yes that looks borked. Your pictures are inconclusive as to what is bent. They only show that there is an alignment problem. Have you tried putting your fork on a flat surface? Rolling steertube on it will show you if the steertube is bent if it rolls with a wobble is has a bend. If it roll flat then the bend is in the crown or tines or both. One can also measure the fork offset on a flat surface, do those match?. You also can measure crown to tip. To me the nds has probably lengthen, the drive side is pushed back and both are off to the side. Do you have side shots? Do you have pictures of the frame, side shots, and front end view of both headtube and seat tube in parallel?

With that much damage on the fork you may very well have a twist in the frame.

It may all be fixable, but to pay someone is ridiculous for that model to be fixed. Can you figure out how to do this by yourself?

I probably could but I have space, tools, measuring equipment flat cast iron table with fence and various jigs and rigs for measure and to attempt. I did it all on my 1973 Gitane Tour de France.

If you are confident of yourself fix the fork.

Here is the TdF, headtube massively swung to one side, yellow tape added for contrast compare.
The twist was taken out, seatube and downtube were also aligned perpendicular to the drive side of the bb shell.

Here I lengthened the nondrive side with my furniture clamp.


Rides like top flight, top of the line of its time

maddog34

the shops don't want to put a wad of cash and several hours into a bike that isn't worth $200 in perfect condition, then have the owner abandon it rather than pay up.

it's not "a runaround".. it's Reality.

want your bike fixed to perfection? lay down a $300 cash deposit on the extensive repairs it needs.
they are seeing things you aren't seeing.. that's WHY you brought the bike to a Shop.

as to their being booked up.. part of the reason is that they have to try and explain things to people that won't understand anyway... and the rest of the reason is that they know what they're doing, and doing things right takes time, so lots of people come to them for repairs.

ARider2

No shop wants to take on a job that will cost more to complete than the total value of the bicycle after the repair is finished, and this seems to fit in that category. The bike is worth less than the cost of the repairs. Are you ready to drop $200 or more on a bike that may be worth half that?

DiabloScott

Statistically then - for every 10,000 cluess potential customers with BSO's that get blown off, 1 legitimate customer with wads of cash and a valid reason for wanting to spend it on a BSO repair will be turned away as well. Them's the breaks, c'est la vie, que sera sera.

easyupbug 

I bought a custom for the Dura Ace groupset and the wheels that pulled to the right but not "dump you" so was cheap. Frame string test was off as well (you should at least do that check). He had a Laing fork table to straighten and a Marchetti frame table for the frame and it is now a great ride but that level of work is $$.

choddo

Impressive. What a lovely looking machine.

maddog34

if that's what you got out of my reply,.... Seek professional counseling.

an old schwinn letour II is not, and never was, "a BSO".... and if you've been active on this forum, you also know i don't use that term, EVER.
the Letour II is simply not worth enough to recoup a big repair expense if it gets abandoned. They were great bikes once, but are now only worth under $200, IMO

i once upgraded a Mongoose D100... it had a RockShox Judy fork, and Rockshox Deluxe shock , Deore Ders, and Alivio shifters when done... it even got a set of used Kool Stop pads installed... the wheels remained stock, and the weak point... the customer trash talked me because HE bent the rear axle and wheels i had warned him about when he bought it.
He then parked it outside.. guess what came back to my shop as a "freebie"... his dad dropped it off since the kid had grown up and moved out... it's on the list to be rebuilt again... with a chain, cables/housing, and i'll upgrade the wheels this time..... just because i have extra rim brake double-walls hanging around now....

the person that started this thread is whining because he couldn't convince shops to repair a bent up and dangerousbike that isn't worth the parts on it since they are outdated too. No one "blew him off", they just didn't want to take a chance on someone that now whines on forums about their educated business decision, and obvious abundance of business from more patient people.

wheelreason

Gotta love a rig you can use to straighten forks and collect on non performing loans...

Polaris OBark

They have competent liability attorneys.

Desert Ryder

I've contacted a couple of "big name" bike shops about bleeding the front and rear Formula disc brakes on a near OEM GT STS DH. I sent close up pics of the calipers and brake levers.
One shop flat said no.
The two others both offered to try with no guarantee of success. I have no problem paying the estimated $100 for service.
The problem is the response, "We can try but you'd still need to pay the $100". If I could watch I'd be fine. It's the leave it for 3-4 days that gets me nervous.
Am I wrong to think they may try to bleed it, have trouble, say screw this, and get paid $100 anyway. I contacted a mobile tech but got no reply.

wheelreason

Yeah some Formulas (as well as some others) can be a little fuzzier giving up their air bubbles, and a shop not familiar with that may be reluctant to work on them I guess. I try to only get covered in baby oil when in a wading pool with 2 hotties, so leave the brakes and suspensions to one of the guys, and they know to quote bleeding with the stipulation that it assumes brakes are otherwise working properly, and any parts or additional repairs are extra. If evrything checks out, customers do not get charged for "attempting to bleed". Hydraulics have been around long enough that it shouldn't be spooky to mechanics. Routing road is very cha ching right now...

Kontact 

You want them to figure it out, but you want to sit and watch them do research on your brakes and 'try stuff'?

Kai Winters

Few shops have frame alignment tools and if some do it is likely they don't have anyone that knows how to use them.
Cold adjusting an old steel frame is not easy.
Shops should post a "diagnostic fee" similar to an automobile repair shop. Many customers expect free service in this area and bike shops lose a lot of money/time evaluating bikes that never get serviced.
The insurance companies 'pay out' for this bike will be interesting. Usually the IC wants to pay the 'worth/value' of the bike and a bike like this is worth a few bucks. Whereas they should pay equitable value of a similar replacement bike which may not be much more. The rider takes a beating in such a case.
My shop does not have alignment tools. I have used them in the past but not for such a long time I'd dequalify myself from using them if available. I'd visually inspect the frame and if I felt it should not be ridden as it is I'd state so in the service estimate giving the reasons it should not be ridden and stating thus in very plain language. In such cases we always have another set of eyes review the estimate and also state so. This service is done at no charge and further devalues the shop mechanic's time and effort.
I've been in this person's situation a couple of times and also lived in the Boston 'area' and worked in a bike shop when it happened to me. At first the IC wanted to replace the bike with its 'today's value'...basically a used bike cost...but I had all the receipts for the bike, I built it from the frame up, and told the IC if they didn't pay the full value of the bike I'd go the attorney route and let them sort it out. I received full replacement value and later, knowing an agent, was told cases like mine are considered "nuisance cases" and often go to people new in the biz who are trying to make a name for themselves as 'hard case adjusters'. It's not fun and I sympathize with this person but in the end the bike should be replaced and the damaged frame hung on a wall as a treasured reminder.

Desert Ryder

I know the brakes need to be bled. I tried and got the front to build pressure after multiple squeezes. The rear I had issues with. I removed the caliper and injected air into the caliper to make sure the caliper wasn't seized in the bore. Full extension of the caliper piston.
I've worked on cars and motorcycles. I was a mechanic and this brake bleed has driven me crazy. Hence, take it to a shop to have it "professionally" done. Again, I have no issues paying the money.
In todays work enviroment and seeing how some people work. This is what concerns me. I mean, there is no real incentive to really work at bleeding the brakes to earn the money. That is my issue.

Kontact 

If that is your issue, throw away those brakes. Because no mechanic wants a complex job that will be full of trial and error to take place under the eye of the customer.

And, you essentially would be stealing their technique in the process. Or you would be howling at paying $100 when it turns out you just forgot to open a bleed port and the process only takes 5 minutes.


If you have a brake system that no one wants to work on with a guarantee of success, why aren't you on the phone with Formula to find out where they want you to take it?

Desert Ryder

The technique is readily available on youtube. I am looking for something better than the OE Formula brakes but they have an odd bolt spacing. Formula IS not the standard IS spacing used on current calipers.

Kontact 

And you followed that technique and it didn't work, so I assume you want a shop to come up with a different technique.

jpc2001

Thanks for that link! I have one on order. Good find, that looks like it should do. The rake is a match and it looks like it should have clearance for a fender.

If this goes well I might even order a 2nd one, for a Miyata 310 that has survived fork damage in the past and has some scary rust around the crown. It might be time to refresh that one too. On the Miyata I bent the fork blades while working on a seized stem. I bent them back, and eventually used lye to get the stem out. The lye ate the paint, and now rust is eating through my halfhearted repaint. It's by far the weakest point on an otherwise solid and good looking bike. If this Sunlite fork fits, in hindsight I needn't have bothered with any of that! Live and learn.

Calsun

A used replacement bike can be bought for less than $300. How much do you want to spend to try to fix your bike?

Dictatokerr

I can see why you're frustrated! Sometimes shops may be hesitant to work on older bikes due to the potential for complications, especially with vintage components. The uncertainty about the problem might also play a role.

You could try approaching them with a clear description of what you think needs fixing, like requesting a fork replacement or upgrade. That way, it's a more defined job, and they might be more willing to help. If you're comfortable doing some work yourself, consider seeking advice from online bike communities or tutorials to determine if you can tackle the issue. Good luck with getting your Schwinn back in shape!

Desert Ryder

I don't know why I need to explain this to you but, I want a shop that has the correct equipment and, hopefully, experience. I did the bleed with the tools I have on hand which are not specific to bicycles.
I don't feel the need to buy more tools. I have already admitted defeat with these hydraulics and am willing to have a shop do the work.The part of my reply that you didn't address, I am researching options for the rear caliper by adding a IS 51mm spacing to Formula 48mm spacing adapter and newer rear caliper. A cable actuated caliper would be more desirable and easier for maintenace with no new tools needed.

Why the need to take the stand you're taking. Never mind...I honestly don't care.

Kontact 

You only need to explain yourself if you want help and someone is asking you for more information. But is doesn't sound like that.

Desert Ryder

I don't recall asking for help. You made many presumptions that were all false.
I just posted my experience with bike shops, TREK and Giant, who didn't either want to try or didn't instill confidence in the service offered, hence, my hesitation.
The biggest reason for wanting to keep the brakes is because the vintage DH bike is almost completely original.