CrimsonEclipse

Yo, TDS!
I have a bike made of card board that doesn't fold located on Mars so you have to get it yourself...
Does that fit your needs?

tds101 

OMG!!! Than's THE ONE!!! Got a link???

Jipe

For those who do not know Ben Cooper owner/founder of Kinetics:

edwong3

I wouldn't dare to ask at what price. I don't take kindly to "sticker shock".

Jipe

The upgrade cost is not huge, the total price depend of the chosen components, with a Rohloff or Kindernay and high end disc brakes it can of course become expensive.

edwong3

Interesting. My point of view is since the Brompton all on its own is quite pricey, these enhancements would no doubt produce an even heftier price tag. Non-the-less, I'm sure there is a market out there with people who have deep enough pockets and plenty of desire for such a rig. Must be nice...

base2 

Aaaarrrrgh! You beat me to it!
I was going to post the same video.

tudorowen1

An update as I started this thread.
I bought a bifold Mint bike in Bangkok. I could have bought a Mint Trifold 9 speed with disc brakes.. very much a Brompton clone ..The Mint bike I bought is light and has 9 speed and cable discs brakes..looks very much like a Fnhon Gust..The fold is small because it has a very short wheelbase..Very impressed with it so far..

Jipe

This bike folds like an Fnhon = bad: its front part folds on the left side of the rear part leaving its transmission unprotected -> risk of chain grease on the clothes, the derailleur is very exposed to shocks and the derailleur or its hanger can easily be damaged.

The short wheelbase and short reach is also a drawback for medium or tall cyclists.

Folding bikes like the Brompton and Birdy have their front side that folds against the right side of the bike with the transmission protected. They both have a wheelbase similar to full size bikes and a reach adapted for average European or US cyclists.

Bleu

I don't have access to most of the folders that you do in Thailand. However the Origami Lotus looks real close to the Mint. Compared to the Brompton, how is the Mint ? Ride ? Folding, can you get it small with little fuss ? Like the Fnhon the Mint and Origami both take a Brompton luggage mount, but does it work well with a Brompton bag/frame attached ?

Duragrouch

No you don't, unless you like spending USD $100+ annually for a teardown and complete relube of an IGH, if you ride in the rain, assuming you have a competent shop in your town that services IGHs, most don't. Also, while generally reliable, try fixing an IGH in the field on a tour. With external gearing, I can fix anything in the field, at least enough to make it to a town.

I was pining for a Brompton with an Alfine 11 IGH (sufficient gear range, over 400%), but a) the rear droput spacing is too narrow, non-standard, a guy in Scotland makes a replacement triangle and conversion, $$$, and b) I found out the Alfine uses friction rollers and not ratchet, so can slip over time (why I never bought a NuVinci hub). Or a car with a CVT; Smooth steel against smooth steel, in the presence of lubricating oil, is a recipe for slippage over time.

Duragrouch

Those are tempting prices!

Why is a rear flat difficult on a Brompton? I don't own one. What I do have is a Dahon, and when it had the original "compact" derailleur forward of the cassette, it was an absolute bear to remove the rear wheel. (I've since fit a conventional rear derailleur.) But I still try first to just dismount the tire on just the non-drive side, snake out the tube, find the leak (pump up, pass tube in front of lips, you can often feel the leak), patch, reassemble.

tds101 

I'll sum it up quickly for you, since you're telling me what I want OR don't want, without knowing who I am, or what I own/ed. I've had, and still have Nexus hubs, I've owned a NuVunci hub, have/had Sturmey-Archer hubs, and I've personally only had issues with a SRAM Automatix hub. I've had my igh's serviced at a bike shop in NYC without incident. The problems you've had aren't what I've experienced, so you do you. I also have different group sets, up to 9 speed. Doesn't change what I want on a Brompton.

Duragrouch

My apologies. I didn't mean anything malicious.

Most folks think IGHs are "maintenance free", but then are shocked when:
- Difficult to find service. There is *one* shop in my town, a major bike city in the USA, that not only services IGHs, but is extraordinarily competent at such. They have a superb website with very detailed info, and people actually ship rear wheels to them for service. Nearly every other bike shop here will either refer people there for IGH repairs, or more likely, say, "You'll need a new rear wheel", which can happen after only one rainy season without a proper lube-prep, which the above shop recommends even when new, and then annually if ridden in rain. USD $100+, but a quality teardown and wash in kerosene, gear lube, and marine wheel bearing grease on the bearings. Gets expensive, more expensive if you don't do. It sounds like you don't mind the cost of that. Glad you have money. No worries. I'm retired and poor.
- Nothing trashes a bike drivetrain more than rain and grit, and IGHs just don't seal both out as well as conventional hubs, because of larger seals, chain or push-linkage hole on the side, etc. My city is cursed with a longer rainy-season than most.
- My city is also cursed with steep hills, which I often negotiate pulling a heavy shopping load; The swiss-watch internals on an IGH are typically not designed for high tractive loads, nor the bearings for heavy payloads (the latter may have improved; my old Steyr (SA copy) 3 speed hub had a large ring of very small balls near the OD of the hub, lubed by internal oil, harder to seal, more play than a smaller bearing; Modern hubs may have bearings more similar to external gear hubs, or cartridge bearings with excellent seals.)
- Cassettes are cheap to replace. IGHs are not, and they do wear out, even with proper service.

Sounds like you have plenty of experience so can disregard my cautions, which were meant for the uninitiated.

I wish the above were not true, because IGHs sure do have advantages, especially with a belt drive, that is one clean setup, a huge advantage on a folder. I grew up on IGHs, that was my first bike for many years. Even pulled it apart to repair, took me all winter to get it back together, but I was 12. (This after a pawl pin sheared when I was 7 miles from home and I had to walk it back.) Shunned derailleur gears for many years. Until my first race bike, and I then realized the greater ease of repair. Like a Jeep with external door hinges; Not as clean looking, but they put the hinges on the outside for a reason, and that reason is, easier to repair in the field.

I've read nothing but great things about the Rohloff 14; I would definitely try on a folder, were the hub alone not approaching the cost of a complete new Brompton. I vagely recall reading about some good competitors (lower cost) that may be coming out soon or have been introduced.

The other thing I am excited about is a transmission called a "Pinion", that mounts immediately forward of the crank, just like an electric mid-drive; 18 speeds, no duplicates, and the gears are larger than can fit in an IGH, so promises great durability. Currently very expensive and offered only on limited brands. But looks very encouraging, it may be superior to everything out there, internal or external.

My sincere best wishes on your future bike projects.