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Training Status??? (IV)

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Training Status??? (IV)

Old 10-18-18, 11:01 PM
  #12476  
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I like the weightlifting discussion. Right now is just general fitness and I'll transition to cycling specific in a few weeks. Once I finish that I'm thinking about keeping at least a day or two a week in the gym where I'll do higher rep stuff. Two reasons.. Aesthetics.. It's kinda nice to have what looks like the semblance of an upper body and having better general strength will help me to do my job better.

Right now I'm doing 4x6 full body ( I can link the actual plan if anyone cares). And once I go to cycling specific it'll be something based around the FASCATS plan they have on their website. In a nutshell, hypertrophy, strength, then power. The power segemnt has jump squats in it which I've never done. I try to accelerate through the top of a squat anyways, even if it means I'm not getting quite as deep. Right now my knee is still partially ****ed up so i can't go all the way down anyways.

Bike training.. Still low volume, but planning a cx race this weekend and I'm taking a friend out on a test ride of my road bike that I'm considerring selling. I did ride the alpe de zwift the other day and was surprised at my power tbh. Legs were good, lungs weren't. No surprise there but the numbers weren't as bad as I was expecting. Sweetspot should be right around where it was end of last winter iirc.
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Old 10-19-18, 08:57 AM
  #12477  
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Did a second day of my entry into lifting weights yesterday. 5x10 barbell only squats, 3x10 each of very easy leg curls, push ups, seated rows, shoulder press, pull downs. Still a bit sore today despite the light weights.
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Old 10-19-18, 09:03 AM
  #12478  
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@Ttoc6 I like box jumping and use the plyosafe padded platforms that my gym has. I do multiple sets and pick a box that is not too high but focus on getting max elevation versus picking a high box and lifting my legs to my chest. There are several formulas for calculating average power wattage required for a vertical jump. For me, using the Harmon formula, to jump 24 inches vertical requires 1697 watts. So my typical vertical jump is about 12 to 14 inches which is about 1000 watts average power per jump. So if I do a lot of these things, it is fatiguing but does improve explosive power and has the added benefit of loading up the skeleton and using muscles in eccentric fashion on the landing.

Last edited by Hermes; 10-19-18 at 02:11 PM.
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Old 10-19-18, 10:10 AM
  #12479  
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I'd love to know how you calculate wattage for your jumps.
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Old 10-19-18, 02:03 PM
  #12480  
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Originally Posted by topflightpro View Post
I'd love to know how you calculate wattage for your jumps.
I used the Harmon formula https://www.topendsports.com/testing...jump-power.htm and relied on memory for my post. Looking at the formula again and recalculating, 12 inches of vertical would require 1051 watts of average power and 24 inches would be 1697 watts. So my memory was a little off and I revised my previous post. And some believe the Harmon formula and others are not that accurate.

When I started box jumping, I tried to correlate jumping power to power on the bike. The bike is different in that one uses one leg at a time for a standing start and there is a lot of other differences. However, I think that 1000 watts of jumping power with two legs will translate over to the bike. I jump onto the box and land like a cat and step off the box. I do not jump on and off the box and preload my Achilles tendon.

Last edited by Hermes; 10-19-18 at 02:12 PM.
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Old 10-19-18, 02:10 PM
  #12481  
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I have bad memories of box jumps when I used to do them on concrete blocks in High school. So many bashed up shins lol. A squat jump is weighted with a barbell where you justaccelerate to jump at the top. I've never done them before, but I think as long as I keep the weight low they shouldn't be too bad. I should try to incorporate some boxjumps in. They look cool and I can see how it builds good explosivity.

This morning I hit the gym again, Another OHP/DL/Lat/OAR day. I hat overhead press. It's just so hard. Everything shakes and my back gets tight. Not damaging tight but just stressed. And to top it off I'm not really pushing that much weight. C'est la vie.

After getting home went for a ride with a buddy who is interested in buying my road bike. Set him up on my allez and I rode the gravel bike for a chill two hours. A bit chilly out there. Long sleeve jersey, and a neck warmer.
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Old 10-19-18, 02:43 PM
  #12482  
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#realmenboxjumponconcreteblocks

Jumping risk is all about the landing and sometimes the preloading of the Achilles. One can box jump on one leg and land on one leg, jump on two and land on one and jump on one and land on two. Jump on two with weights into the air and land on the ground. The box enables one to land softer and not take as big a hit on the landing.

I watched a guy at the gym jumping onto a 24 inch box from two legs and land on one into a pistol squat with his free leg straight out in from and then stand up and step off the box. It looked really cool. Speaking for myself, I am kind of a weeny and bike racing does not build the type of soft tissue infrastructure that one needs for more exotic jumping. I am a meat and potatoes jumper.
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Old 10-19-18, 02:45 PM
  #12483  
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Social lunch ride today. Not exactly recovery, and not exactly a hard workout, but just right for a sunny day in October.
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Old 10-19-18, 04:06 PM
  #12484  
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Power = work / time. If you're moving 100kg in 1s over 1 meter, that 1kw.
For box jumping, (to make the math easy assume we weigh 50kg, jumping half a meter and gravity is 10m/s^2) one would need to jump all the way up in .25 second to get 1kw of power. Very doable in this rough, perfect world example.
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Old 10-20-18, 02:28 PM
  #12485  
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Tried to race CX today. Rode to the race, made it 15 minutes when I just tweaked my knee wrong going through the barriers. Made it about two more corners before I called it. I was in a lot of pain. I can push through a lot, but this was bad. pedalled back to desk, dnfed and sat down for a long time until I could muster the nergy to get changed. Some real easy walking about to chat and take a few pictures during the proe race and I went home. I think it's time to go see a dr. Been >3 weeks and I still can't run/jump/land on it. Hell, I thought I was getting better, lifting doesn't bug it and normal riding feels normal. Yet here I am limping around again because of one bad movement.
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Old 10-21-18, 03:53 PM
  #12486  
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ugh, hope you get that straightened out soon @Ttoc6
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Old 10-21-18, 06:43 PM
  #12487  
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Got 2nd at the group ride sprint yesterday. Trying to get better at positioning before it. Underestimated the wind and remaining distance, went too early trying to jump a local sprinter to the line, but he got on my wheel easily and came around Looks like positioning is better but timing needs work.
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Old 10-22-18, 09:38 AM
  #12488  
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Visiting Eugene this weekend and went for a beautiful, hilly, 60+ mile ride with very little traffic and just a few stop signs. I could have done the whole ride without unclipping, and in fact only unclipped once and that was to stop and pee. Love the riding around Eugene, OR.
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Old 10-22-18, 11:52 AM
  #12489  
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MCL is healing up so I'll prob be back at it towards the end of this week. Kinda nice having had to take a couple of weeks off, though I still haven't figured out wtf to do with all the extra time!

edit: also got a bike fit! Significantly looooooonger and narrower, takes into account my flexibility issues too. Pretty stoked overall.

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Old 10-22-18, 08:20 PM
  #12490  
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Dr. Appointment for thursday afternoon with a sports med guy. Hoping for an answer. It's so weird. I was able to lift this morning (heaviest squat I've done lifetime, nto all the way a2g) but then I go and sit wrong in a chair at work and get sharp pain that makes me limp around for 5 minutes.. wtf..
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Old 10-23-18, 08:48 AM
  #12491  
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WTH, everyone's hurt. Get better soon @Ttoc6, @TMonk

Planned to start up training after my vacation but I brought home one of Spain's biggest imports; the Spanish Flu. We have 3 CX races within 15 miles of my house this year, and it looks like all 3 are in the next month, so it looks like that's out.
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Old 10-23-18, 10:58 AM
  #12492  
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Originally Posted by Ttoc6 View Post

This morning I hit the gym again, Another OHP/DL/Lat/OAR day. I hat overhead press. It's just so hard. Everything shakes and my back gets tight. Not damaging tight but just stressed. And to top it off I'm not really pushing that much weight. C'est la vie.
because I started lifting with hopes of maybe mitigating the inevitable crash damage I focused a lot on back and shoulders. Then as I started to get shoulders a little bit, I focused on them for vanity as well. I nearly military press what I can bench. Though my bench is weak af.
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Old 10-23-18, 03:03 PM
  #12493  
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More of the same...Coastal ride with VO2 and Camp Pendleton over the weekend and leg strength training today with warmup and low cadence intervals on the Stages bike.

There seems to be some magic in my box jumping. Who would have thought. 18 inches of vertical today that felt easy. I have an idea. At the end of track races, we all box jump for time bonuses..
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Old 10-24-18, 10:33 AM
  #12494  
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I've mentioned previously that my head has not been in the game of late due to multifactorial non-bike life stuff that just needs to shake itself out over time. All that stuff is still going on, inching through making some progress on it though.

Did some volume riding this past weekend over at Catalina, relaxing and hanging out with friends. Then Monday hit at work and come Tues am, I just couldn't bring myself to attempt the seemingly insurmountable workout on my schedule, a harder-yet version of an already-hard workout I've been struggling with for a couple of months. Wound up sending @Racer Ex my data for the week, with the comment that it this workout is what it takes to meet my goals, then maybe I need to rethink my goals. Got a very helpful reply, a little adjustment to the schedule to bring it back to being fun for a little bit, until life shakes out, and the comment that we'll revisit that workout in maybe a modified form down the road. Ahh, felt way better after that.

Then this morning, I met a friend to ride and she mentions she's given notice to her coach after a year. I ask her why, it seemed to be going well. and she tells me life is getting in the way- working two jobs, getting a divorce, needs to help organize her sister's wedding, having eye surgery soon. Sometimes she just can't get the workouts done and then response she got was scolding email from her coach. She understands what her coach is saying but decided its just not worth it to her to continue and feel guilty about what her training. Time to just do it herself for awhile.

Really drove home to me how fortunate I am to be working with Ex. We're coming up on 4 years and training/racing is still a positive force in my life that actually helps me when the going gets tough. Not to mention of course results that are way better than I could achieve on my own. #lucky
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Old 10-24-18, 03:10 PM
  #12495  
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2x20 big gear work Monday (it was supposed to be Sunday but it got bumped due to social stuff going on), weights last night, easy commute today. Glutes are super sore!

Happy with my big gear efforts, not because the power was phenomenal (~268w on the first one at HR of 160, a little lower on the second but Strava doesn't show me averages outside of the CP curve for trainer rides for some reason), but because I didn't give myself any micro-breaks like I usually do, even during the 2nd effort. I often will bargain with myself and take a 5s-15s break during these, to drink water sometimes, but usually just because I need to give myself a mental respite. This time I didn't let up for a second. I find that I do this in races during longer efforts and in TT's, and it would be better if I didn't, so might as well practice.

Looking forward to Sunday - schedule says 3-6 hours of z2. I'll try to stretch it as close to the 6 as I can, been a while since I did a real long steady day.

Conversely, not looking forward to Saturday's 4x8's V_V

@Heathpack , I can definitely relate to that feeling. I find that the more I dread a workout, the more I'll procrastinate, and often just end up skipping days and throwing off my whole schedule. Having a coach that is willing to back off without adding any extra guilt (the self-imposed guilt is strong enough in my case), is really nice sometimes. I'll usually go out and do some off-road riding, or social riding, to get back to the 'fun.' Even going out for a group ride and going harder than I should does the trick for me, as it's usually the mental aspect and not the physical that I need a break from.
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Old 10-24-18, 03:55 PM
  #12496  
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One of the reasons I like big gear work is that I go out of my way not to take any breaks from constant force. My brain screams for anything that resembles a micro break. Why not take a drink, eat a gel, stand up or even better yet, stop and recalibrate the power meter. I could go on and on. I think my brain is looking for a dopamine hit from a micro break because from a physiological point, I am fine and there is no reason to stop. My brain loves to generate useless feelings and ideas on training rides. My favorite is...hey remember the last time you did this much power, how bad your legs felt (about the same as now) and could only do it for X amount of time? I dismiss this endless and useless info as rubbish and tell my brain that my legs are supposed to feel like this.
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Old 10-24-18, 06:06 PM
  #12497  
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Mind over matter, dig that.

I set a 20 min record during a FTP test back in May, if only by 4 watts, but still. I remember thinking that I was not going to think about how difficult or uncomfortable I felt, just that I was a machine and I was going to be operating at max output. At moments I was in some state of sadistic glee in the second half. As soon as I stopped pedaling, I puked a little bit on my bib shorts as my mind and body lurched from the effort. At 312 w and 150 lbs it was the fittest I've been since right after college, so for more than a few years.

Good times Oh, and this was on Fiesta of course
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Old 10-24-18, 06:26 PM
  #12498  
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unstructured
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Old 10-24-18, 07:26 PM
  #12499  
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I'm putting in a random 15 hr week (featuring 6 hrs on Sunday) before next week which will be planned unstructured/alternative activity week. Next week I'd like to swim and jog once or twice each, and maybe just commute for my riding. No intervals or long rides.

I'm doing base "for real" starting the week of Nov 5. I'd like to do 12/18+/12 for the block and average 14. In the middle (the big one), I'm taking a week of work to stay in Tucson, Az for 5 days and alternate between riding my road bike and MTB out there. I have family there so lodging is "on the house", and it will end with El Tour de Tucson, a 4 hr flat century ride that should be one of my easy rides if all goes as planned .

As per usual my parents will fly out on Thursday night and I will get to stay with them at the Starr Pass JW Marriot and enjoy the amenities and lovely grounds/scenery out there. Plus, there are (purportedly) kick-ass MTB trails (10+ miles) right next to the hotel, so after my coffee and pastry I can hit the trails, then a cafe in down town, then the convention center for El Tour reg and Platinum meeting. Then another 30 min through town to my Tio's house.

Stoked for some good riding coming up!
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Old 10-25-18, 04:24 PM
  #12500  
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Joined a gym 2 blocks from home. Did some squats, random jumping things, dumbbell deads, rows, curls, pull ups, toe touches (leg lifts to the bar), ab work (hollow holds, twisting crunches, v-ups), stretching. Kept it moderate so I don't get DOMS for 6 days. It's a little weird going to the gym and I should know what I'm doing but it's been so long that I stand around a lot thinking what I might need to do lol.

This gym is awesome. It has all the useful stuff and no more. No rows of useless machines and treadmills, no useless "free" classes. It DOES have free fruit and coffee. And it's only $95 cheap (not bad for SF/2 blocks from home).

If I crash on my left eye while the bone behind is still broken I could go blind so putting off riding for a bit still. Doing a lot of walking and jogging in the meantime to burn some calories and build some stabilizing muscles.

Working on what I put into my body after a long day in the office as well. That should help in more ways than four if I can stick with it.
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