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Vaporware (continued)

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Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Vaporware (continued)

Old 05-07-10, 09:13 AM
  #76  
gsteinb
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Originally Posted by Homebrew01
You must be getting pretty bored to get sucked into these 41 troll threads !
No not really. Just waiting to see another doctor.
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Old 05-07-10, 09:14 AM
  #77  
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Psimet has it right.

There are so many factors in bringing a product to market beyond the concept and even the engineering of a product that many truly great products never make it.

This is true in any industry.

It is also true, based on my experience, that the first generation to make it to market may not be the best one to buy. Off the top of my head I am thinking about the first generation DA STI, various boutique wheels, early carbon frames (Vitus anyone?) electronic shifting, Record carbon cranks, Sram missing tooth cassettes, MANY CnC cranks (like Kooka) and I could go on. This doesn't mean these didn't eventually become standards in the industry it's just harder than most people realize to design, produce and successfully market a new product.

Cut these guys some slack. They seem to be hard at work. They could have just as easily released stuff before it was cooked and let the hapless early adapters do their product testing for them. Lets hope that won't be the case and that this product will see the light of day whenever it is ready.

Until then you all have options so do what you need to and quite *****in'.

iCaddy you can continue *****in' because it seems like that is what gets you out of bed in the morning.
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Old 05-07-10, 09:16 AM
  #78  
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Originally Posted by patentcad
Incorrect.

Apple has a long track record of holding price (particularly on laptops) and bumping the memory, processor speed, etc. In other words they add value, but at the same price. That's a long standing practice with Apple. Price drops are very slow compared to other tech companies, that's how Apple sustains profitability in a business that is notorious for tight profit margins.

MacBook Pro prices have slowly edged down, but a 15" version still lists for $1700, 2-3x the price of a decent Windows machine (if there is such a thing).

But let's not let reality and simple facts stand in the way of a perfectly good 41 Flame Out.

Bull****. Look at the history of just the iPhone.
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Old 05-07-10, 09:16 AM
  #79  
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Originally Posted by gsteinb
No not really. Just waiting to see another doctor.
You do know what "on the DL" means, right?
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Old 05-07-10, 09:21 AM
  #80  
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Originally Posted by roadiejorge
Amen. I've become really selective as to what technology I spend my money on and the criteria is all based on functionality in my day-to-day rather than novelty.
Same here. Although you do get great build quality with Apple. I recently bought a new laptop, a Thinkpad- a big part of my decision was the build quality of the machine. It sucks shelling out > $500 for something that feels like it was made from recycled milk jugs and cardboard.
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Old 05-07-10, 09:26 AM
  #81  
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I think there are too many variables that they can't overcome.
If I have my shoe shimmed so that it presses on the inside of the pedal, that is going to flex the shaft differently than if I have it shimmed to press on the outside. Will I have to buy one for each type of shaft? CM, stainless, and Ti will all flex differently. And as asked earlier, how do you account for flex without drive torque?
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Old 05-07-10, 09:28 AM
  #82  
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Originally Posted by NickDavid
You do know what "on the DL" means, right?
Err?
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Old 05-07-10, 09:30 AM
  #83  
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Originally Posted by Tulex
I think there are too many variables that they can't overcome.
If I have my shoe shimmed so that it presses on the inside of the pedal, that is going to flex the shaft differently than if I have it shimmed to press on the outside. Will I have to buy one for each type of shaft? CM, stainless, and Ti will all flex differently. And as asked earlier, how do you account for flex without drive torque?
I think the flex without drive torque will be handled by measuring force and direction, at least i thought i saw an allusion to that in the newsletter.

ETA: It's going to be integrated with the spindle. They'll know what material the spindle is made of.

Last edited by wens; 05-07-10 at 09:35 AM.
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Old 05-07-10, 09:36 AM
  #84  
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
Looks like the best F1 time is 5:58. https://www.roadandtrack.com/racing/h...the_green_hell And it sounds like if an F1 team set out to beat that time, with appropriate tires and gear ratios, they could do better than that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ceX5...eature=related and the corvette https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6mEirkQN8o
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Old 05-07-10, 09:41 AM
  #85  
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Originally Posted by gsteinb
Err?
He's probably thinking "Dirty Lesbian".
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Old 05-07-10, 09:41 AM
  #86  
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Having machined various metals for the last 30 years, I just don't see how this is going to work. Machining any metal stresses it. The cutting conditions determine the stress added. Stressed metals behave differently based on how much they are stressed. You can work harden parts just through machining.

When machining batches of parts, we can't even rely on the material coming in to be consistent. When sending machined parts out to be hardened or stress relieved, we can't be sure how they will move.

When relying on such small amounts of flex to measure power, I don't see how they will be able to control the quality of the product it is going in to a close enough spec to create accurate results. Maybe each person will have to calibrate it, but how, or to what?
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Old 05-07-10, 09:49 AM
  #87  
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Originally Posted by Tulex
I think there are too many variables that they can't overcome.
If I have my shoe shimmed so that it presses on the inside of the pedal, that is going to flex the shaft differently than if I have it shimmed to press on the outside. Will I have to buy one for each type of shaft? CM, stainless, and Ti will all flex differently. And as asked earlier, how do you account for flex without drive torque?
1) Supposedly, the sensor(s) can measure the shear of the pedal spindle, not just its bending. (???)

2) If you're standing up and stretching (while softpedaling)... since you know the direction of the pedal force, you know the positive torque from one leg and negative torque from the other leg. You add them up for a net torque of zero. (I always wondered how Ergomo dealt with this, by the way. Not very well, I guess lol)
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Old 05-07-10, 09:52 AM
  #88  
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Originally Posted by gsteinb
Err?
errr
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Old 05-07-10, 09:56 AM
  #89  
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Originally Posted by patentcad
WR is the guy who thinks Corvettes are as fast as Formula One cars. Bear this in mind
First off, the times I posted showed the Corvette slower. 2nd, those were actual times, but it turned out the F1 had been de-tuned for safety reasons. 3rd, there are courses where your Acura would destroy an F1 car.

You go on believing I don't know wtf I'm talking about though in your "the 100th tablet in the world is revolutionary" world
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Old 05-07-10, 10:01 AM
  #90  
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Originally Posted by wens
I think the flex without drive torque will be handled by measuring force and direction, at least i thought i saw an allusion to that in the newsletter.

ETA: It's going to be integrated with the spindle. They'll know what material the spindle is made of.
Yeah, the stresses measured are directional. They know what the radial and tangential components are to the forces. A friend here at work saw the demo in Vegas and he pushed on the pedals, watching the graph change. The pedals system absolutely knows what's going on.
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Old 05-07-10, 10:08 AM
  #91  
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MP3's are for people who don't actually listen to music.
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Old 05-07-10, 10:17 AM
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By the time they hit it big I might be able to be a dealer of theirs....
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Old 05-07-10, 10:20 AM
  #93  
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Ok, just went back to their site. I forgot about the external part that tells it where you are in the stroke. And I see they will be sold with the pedal, pre calibrated. Stainless. Not liking that the unit has to be recharged all the time, max of 20 hours so far.
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Old 05-07-10, 10:21 AM
  #94  
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Originally Posted by Psimet2001
By the time they hit it big I might be able to be a dealer of theirs....
Or retired.
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Old 05-07-10, 10:25 AM
  #95  
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Originally Posted by AMFJ
MP3's are for people who don't actually listen to music.
wrong - audiophiles are people who don't actually listen to music, and audiophiles hate mp3s.
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Old 05-07-10, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Tulex
Or retired.
I derive some of my income from the cycling industry. That implies I will never be able to retire and that I will suffer a heart attack sometime in my 60's anyway.
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Old 05-07-10, 10:31 AM
  #97  
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I'm tired of waiting for Metrigear, I'm getting an Ergomo.
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Old 05-07-10, 10:38 AM
  #98  
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Originally Posted by patentcad
Calling the iPad 'a bigger iPhone' is like calling an F1 car 'a faster Corvette'. I do find all these pronouncements about the iPad from people that have no experience with the device rather amusing. If you don't think it's a revolutionary product, take one home for a couple of weeks. It is indeed, and this will be revealed to you. At some point.
Am with Pcad here. It may SEEM like an overgrown iPhone, but the iPad is a completely different experience.
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Old 05-07-10, 10:40 AM
  #99  
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Originally Posted by waterrockets
First off, the times I posted showed the Corvette slower. 2nd, those were actual times, but it turned out the F1 had been de-tuned for safety reasons. 3rd, there are courses where your Acura would destroy an F1 car.

You go on believing I don't know wtf I'm talking about though in your "the 100th tablet in the world is revolutionary" world
Yeah, when I first saw one of those tablet thing-ies, back in 2003 or so, I thought it was pretty cool.
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Old 05-07-10, 10:41 AM
  #100  
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Originally Posted by Phantoj
wrong - audiophiles are people who don't actually listen to music, and audiophiles hate mp3s.
explain how an audiophile doesn't listen to music. It's kind of the definition and all.


MP3s compress the music. Take out the details. An MP3 is like riding on the trainer.
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