Kokiafan

Looking to upgrade mine. I am getting mysterious creaks on climbs and the bicycle store mechanic cannot find the issue. My frame is 6 or 7 years old now and feel it might be time to replace it anyway.
Anyone here get one of those knockoff frames from one the Chinese manufacturers?
Please reply with your experience! Thanks!

RoadKill

People have many different thoughts on this, but I feel better on a frame that a major manufacturer feels good enough about to put their name on it. If a Specialized frame fails spectacularly for no apparent reason and you are seriously hurt, they can be sued so they have more reason to sell you a frame that isn't going to fail like that. Knockoff Chinese frame there is no recourse for an injured rider.
Some parts I'm fine with buying cheap junk, but not frames or wheels.

Beachgrad05

this

sdmc530

100 percent spot on!

chadtrent

A guy I ride with has a Chinese Bianchi. He bought the entire bike piece by piece from Aliexpress. The frame looks nice, but has given him a lot of trouble. The seatpost won't stay in place. He resorted to putting a few layers of tape on the seatpost. Similar issues with the stem/bar combination. The knockoff FFWD wheels have been fine for him so far though.

HerrKaLeun

Most people that have bought a carbon bike from most LBS brands have bought a Chinese frame.

Not much is made at the North Pole anymore.

wthensler 

I have a Trek Domane 6.2, a Giant Defy 0, and a Bianchi Infinito CV. Only the Giant frame says ‘made in Taiwan’. The Domane says ‘designed in Wisconsin’. I don’t know about the Bianchi....

chadtrent

This is true. But there can be a big difference in manufacturing quality between the big Chinese brands like Merida and Giant and these smaller companies that just do open mold frames.

HerrKaLeun

"designed in".... just means they want to trick the customer and don't declare it was actually made in a low wage country. you also should look at what year the bikes wehre made. there was a large shift towards production in china, or Asia, in the past years.

I agree, brand matters for QC, design etc. Especially for carbon where layering is so important for the function the design part is important.
But OP implied the country (or the people within it) have an influence on quality. I haven't seen scientific evidence showing how a Chinese person would be less capable than an american person. I think much of the "china made" discussion is more based on xenophobia and fear of being inferior than anything else.

I could turn the china fear around and claim nowadays bicycles are much better than ever (better MTB geometry, material, weight...). so someone could say when bicycles were made int he US they were worse because of that. But that isn't the case, it is all in the engineering, manufacturing processes and QC. and that can be done with any people, regardless of nationality.

chadtrent

I didn't read it that way. He mentioned "knockoff" frames from China. I assumed he meant the fake ones on Aliexpress, DHGate, etc.

fietsbob

ROC is not the same country as PRC, though the C is China in both places.. Taiwan is the Go-To manufacturing of nice bicycles now..


want to buy direct via Alibaba, just to save money ? it happens..

HerrKaLeun

Assuming knockoff is a forged product (uses the very same brandname, but not authorized by that brand) or a slightly altered name to deceive (i.e. Call it Trekx instead of Trek) it would be an inferior and likely dangerous product regardless of what country the knockoff was made in.

I'm sure there are 1,000 like products and some are better than others. OP would be better served to ask about a specific one, than just asking for a blanket opinion. Same like asking if all ebay or amazon products are bad.

groovykincaid

If I could ...

I have been to China a couple of times and my wife goes there quite often as she works for an airline.

I have purchased Items and received gifts that were considered knock offs. Most of these being luxury goods. Most of the knock off stuff will last for a year at the best. Sometimes you will get a good quality knock off that might last longer.

The only thing that we now buy in China is prescription eye wear- glasses and sunglasses, not contact lenses.

I won’t use any electronics that are sold in the markets in China. These are not subject to rigorous QC as they would be if going to the general marketplace. If I were to have a fire or suffered an injury as a result of using a knock off electronic, I doubt my insurance will cover anything.

I would pass on a carbon frame from China or at least, anything sold that is not from a reputable brand. Your only asking for disappointment, potential injuries with no recourse. These knock off manufactures come and go and they will certainly deny ever having made it let alone selling it.

I hate spending a lot of money, but you get what you pay for.

hammond9705

Creaks are hard to diagnose, and often involve a lot of trial and error. Having a creak is not necessarily a reason for a new frame

However if you want a new frame you could look at a bikes direct frame. I’ve had a number of their bikes/frames and been happy with them.

Erwin8r

Well, it is well known that there are many Chinese knock off’s of brand name frames. It’s not derogatory towards Chinese, but rather, to the people selling these knock off’s. It just so happens that many of them come from China. The frames are inferior, and may or may not be dangerous. At our weight, I probably wouldn’t go with a knock off. Much better off buying a used namebrand frame. If I weighed 140 pounds, the risk would be different...

tallbikeman

Unfortunately it is not entirely true that a major bicycle manufacture like Specialized can be sued for a broken frame or fork. This is a particularly egregious legal problem that is only now being addressed in courts in Australia and the USA. Bicycle frames and forks are generally reliable products but sometimes a dud gets through and someone is injured or killed by a broken bicycle frame or fork. The suing starts and that is when you find out that these International bicycle manufacturing/sales corporations have shielded themselves very well from product liability lawsuits. The lawsuits almost always end up being thrown out because of jurisdictional disputes about who made what and in which country and by what other company and who sold it. Everyone points fingers at one another and claims innocence for themselves. Other countries may not have laws that cover product liability lawsuits and settlements. This has been a big problem concerning bicycle failure compensation for injured parties. Always inspect your bicycle for safety and mechanical integrity before riding. All frame materials fail and can injure or kill you.

Kokiafan

What qualifies as "fake"? What I am looking for is a quality frame that I don't have to pay a thousand bucks to get.

I would love a Litespeed ti frame, for instance, but I would not like to spend 1800 bucks on one!
Guess I was hoping someone who actually bought something from, say, Workswell would have a word here.

chadtrent

To me "fake" is something like this - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001...archweb201603_

It's a Chinese frame that says Pinarello on it, but not an actual Pinarello. In all honesty that does not mean it's a bad frame. I've seen a lot of people riding similar frames and they love them. But to me a frame painted to be something it's not is a fake.

vespasianus

I go to China at least 6-8 times a year and have seen fake Apple iPhones to full on fake Ferrari's and Ford Mustangs. I have been to Apple stores that are completely 100% fake. They are selling laptops and iPhones and everything but are all fake. Business ethics are few and patents and intellectual property mean zero. I am in the biotech space and the corners that are cut for manufacturing biologics would terrify you. If you are not on top of them all the time, they will cut corners. And this is for things that are going to be used to treat people!

For a bike, unless some guy is there that knows 100% what a bike is going to be used for and the standards that need to be met, I would not trust some guy to make an honest part.

Chad991

I'm with the OP, I wonder about the carbon frames on ebay by BXT...looks good but who knows, price almost makes it worth a shot,lol.....

PDKL45

China (The People's Republic of China; Mainland China; "Communism with Chinese Characteristics;" the CCP etc) is a different place to Taiwan (The Republic of China; Formosa; Asian Tiger economy, etc.).

If you have bought a carbon bike or frame from a major company, chances are it was made in Taiwan by a company like Giant. Giant has been really innovative over the years and lead the way with making carbon frame technology widely available to consumers. They also have a generous carbon frame replacement offer and coverage for manufacturing defects. In general, carbon frames made in Taiwan have the carbon fibers carefully laid by hand in molds--it's one of the most highly paid jobs in the Giant factory and often performed by very skilled women--to achieve optimal strength and frame safety. I trust carbon products made in Taiwan as I have ridden them for years without mishap.

The carbon frames OP is talking about are the ones you see on eBay, Aliexpress and Alibaba. They're made in Mainland China and lack all or almost all of the features that make Taiwanese carbon frames reliable. The carbon fibers often aren't laid carefully, and their orientation, based on frame axis, etc, may be off. The vacuum machines for removing all air bubbles from the resin are not as good in some cases and can potentially leave voids within the frame, creating weak spots. Those frames also used to break down under UV light exposure and were weak around the junction of the head tube and the downtube in some cases, leading to failures where the front wheel "dived" under the downtube. There is a small but often vocal minority of Chinese carbon frame defenders who will say that all of the above points are either exaggerated or have been solved, and it may be somewhat accurate, but on the whole, they just can't be trusted. The whole "think light, cheap and durable, now choose two" comes into play, as they're cheap and light. I just don't trust carbon products from Mainland China.

Kokiafan

Bikes direct only has one frame for less than a couple of thousand right now.
Anyone else have a place they could recommend?

hammond9705

Check bikeisland.com which is related to them to see if there is anything there

squirtdad

back to basics

first is the famous economic fact of TANSTAAFL (There aint no such thing as a free lunch) you do get what you pay for always

Define upgrade: new frame and move parts? or ??? If you are getting new parts it is almost always cheaper to buy a whole new bike.

If you can find the creaks you can't be sure it is not the parts....just be aware of that

What type of bike, what type of riding?

What is your budget?

What is your wrenching skill and tool box size?