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new campy gravel group 1x13 9x36

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new campy gravel group 1x13 9x36

Old 09-24-20, 09:37 PM
  #26  
Russ Roth
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Originally Posted by dunkleosteus
That's amazing LOL. So there were four shifters on the bars?
gripshift for the hub, thumb shifter for the crank and a lever on the right side for the BB.
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Old 09-24-20, 09:47 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by 79pmooney
I'm going to wait on 1X until they get to 17 and I can have my usual gaps. Only 4 more cogs to go.

Isn't there a law, like the computer memory doubling very so many years that applies to cogs?

Just for fun, does anyone have the dates of the start of the next cog? I just make a graph of year-cog number from 1900 to present. When as the 1st 2-speed derailleur, 3-speed FW? Etc. I'll toss them in the graph and see if I can derive the law.
OK, here we go:

1: pat. 1869 William Van Anden https://www.jimlangley.net/ride/bicyclehistorywh.html
1895 first derailleur patent Jean Loubeyre https://www.bikeradar.com/features/w...ears-invented/
2: pat. 1899 The New Protean: Whippet derailleurs
3: pat 1904 Edmund Hodkinson's Gradient Terrot derailleurs
4: pat 1912: Terrot Cycle Company Terrot derailleurs
5: marketed 1912: Boizot Boizot derailleurs
6: marketed c. 1960 ... Regina? Velo-Retro: Campagnolo Timeline
7: marketed c. 1979 by SunTour
8: marketed 1991 by Shimano
9: marketed 1997 by Campagnolo
10: marketed 2000 by Campagnolo
11: marketed 2008 by Campagnolo
12: marketed 2018 by Shimano and Campagnolo
13: marketed 2020 by Campagnolo

Data:

Year Speeds
1869 1
1899 2
1904 3
1912 4
1912 5
1960 6
1979 7
1991 8
1997 9
2000 10
2008 11
2018 12
2020 13
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Old 09-24-20, 10:17 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes
There’s math.
No one said there’d be math.

13 is unsafe for so many reasons.
You have to look down twice as long to guess your gear.
The fingers go to ten, the extra one is a risk now with 11.
I’m already skipping cogs.
The whole 13 thing...

Just another waypoint en route to all 1x all the time.
I love mine but a Cat 4 climb last Saturday, 21% at 98 miles in: a double bailed me out or I’d have fallen over.

While a compact crank with 11-32 is getting me by across the board, a 52/36 with 12-36, a Roadlink and a clutched RD. may be my huckleberry.

That’s just the gearing thing. I still can’t wrap my head around brake fluid on a bike.
People said the same thing for 10, 11, 12, and now 13. The concern will always be there, but the industry will continue evolving. I have a friend that has done insane touring on his 2018 Kona Sutra LTD with a 1 x 12 SRAM drivetrain in the middle of nowhere. His chain is still going strong over 4000km later (overdue for a change, but still). Additionally, his hydro brakes and been holding up fine as well, no issues.

I still have my doubts over contemporary cycling. I'm still getting used to the idea of having a carbon fork. Time will tell.
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Old 09-24-20, 10:34 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Roll-Monroe-Co
OK, here we go:

1: pat. 1869 William Van Anden https://www.jimlangley.net/ride/bicyclehistorywh.html
1895 first derailleur patent Jean Loubeyre https://www.bikeradar.com/features/w...ears-invented/
2: pat. 1899 The New Protean: Whippet derailleurs
3: pat 1904 Edmund Hodkinson's Gradient Terrot derailleurs
4: pat 1912: Terrot Cycle Company Terrot derailleurs
5: marketed 1912: Boizot Boizot derailleurs
6: marketed c. 1960 ... Regina? Velo-Retro: Campagnolo Timeline
7: marketed c. 1979 by SunTour
8: marketed 1991 by Shimano
9: marketed 1997 by Campagnolo
10: marketed 2000 by Campagnolo
11: marketed 2008 by Campagnolo
12: marketed 2018 by Shimano and Campagnolo
13: marketed 2020 by Campagnolo

Data:

Year Speeds
1869 1
1899 2
1904 3
1912 4
1912 5
1960 6
1979 7
1991 8
1997 9
2000 10
2008 11
2018 12
2020 13

A Poisson count model works ok, though the relationship is nearly linear. I get:
G = number of gears
Y = year
G = exp(-22.6028+0.0124Y)
Sorry fellas, but science don't expect a 14-cog cassette before 2033.

Last edited by Roll-Monroe-Co; 09-24-20 at 10:36 PM. Reason: typoe
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Old 09-24-20, 10:46 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by Roll-Monroe-Co
A Poisson count model works ok, though the relationship is nearly linear. I get:
G = number of gears
Y = year
G = exp(-22.6028+0.0124Y)
Sorry fellas, but science don't expect a 14-cog cassette before 2033.
Get a hold of @nlerner. He needs some math help. But in case you're not 100% sure about past participles, he's your guy.
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Old 09-24-20, 10:58 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by Roll-Monroe-Co
A Poisson count model works ok, though the relationship is nearly linear. I get:
G = number of gears
Y = year
G = exp(-22.6028+0.0124Y)
Sorry fellas, but science don't expect a 14-cog cassette before 2033.
Uhoh, exponential growth implies we'll reach a point where cogs outnumber humans!!
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Old 09-24-20, 11:01 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by dunkleosteus
Someone set this up with a triple and grab the high score for number of gears!
Not so fast there. Back in 1973 or 1974, a friend and I made a barn find - literally - of what I eventually found out was a c.1961 Bianchi Competizione. As found, it had a triple crankset with a five-speed freewheel mounted on a 3sp IGH. 5x3x3=45 distinct gears. Beats 3x13=39. They may both be equally ridiculous, though.

I still have the frame. In fact, it was my ride at the first Eroica CA and the last they held in Paso Robles.
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Old 09-24-20, 11:11 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by bikingshearer
Not so fast there. Back in 1973 or 1974, a friend and I made a barn find - literally - of what I eventually found out was a c.1961 Bianchi Competizione. As found, it had a triple crankset with a five-speed freewheel mounted on a 3sp IGH. 5x3x3=45 distinct gears. Beats 3x13=39. They may both be equally ridiculous, though.

I still have the frame. In fact, it was my ride at the first Eroica CA and the last they held in Paso Robles.
My old recumbent trike had a Sachs 3x7 in the back and a Schlumpf internally geared bottom bracket with two chainrings, giving me 3x7x2x2=84 gears. It did have three shifters and a heel-kick button though. Pulled some stumps out with that Schlumpf.
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Old 09-25-20, 12:24 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by nlerner
it's 13 total gears, right? And that the touring bikes of old ... had more total gears ... 3 x 5 = 15 ... but I'm a mere English teacher, so someone check my work.
I view vintage 3x5 gearing as offering some 8 or 9 different gears, and you have to work a little harder to find them with that setup versus these new 1x1 designs. An old "ten speed" (2x5) has only 6 or 7 usable gears, and adding a granny gives the bottom 2 or 3. Just the way I see/use it, considering efficient chainline and gear chart.

As an aside, I really don't understand (nor want to understand) half-step plus granny gearing like on the Miyata 610 I just refurb'd. Half-step seems so bizarre to me. "No sir. I don't like it."
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Old 09-25-20, 01:38 AM
  #35  
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2x9 speed was more than I needed & 2x7 works well.
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Old 09-25-20, 04:14 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by iab
Not silver.

I was hoping.

Not only not silver, not made of metal.

Count me out on anything "1x", the jumps in gear changes are just too big.

Last edited by nomadmax; 09-25-20 at 04:17 AM.
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Old 09-25-20, 04:52 AM
  #37  
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Classic & Vintage ? ?
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Old 09-25-20, 05:01 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by nomadmax
Not only not silver, not made of metal.

Count me out on anything "1x", the jumps in gear changes are just too big.
+1

My 1x11 jumps an avg of 3/cog. You and I have discussed that.

Having Campy, Shimano, and SRAM is a bit of a shifting transition issue when riding different bikes. It’s only seconds of time to worry about, but it’s there.

Add in the 3-cog jump with my 1x SRAM, the need to use the FD with my Shimano, and the limited range of my Campagnolo? There are moments of doubt and panic while I flail around the cogs and rings, trying to remember what gear I’m in, what system I’m using, and what’s available. All that on top of “who am I; what am I doing here?”

Comic relief for fellow riders, perhaps. I tend to consider simply riding a 2012 Sportster often during these moments, but the tools and riding gear cost a lot more.
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Old 09-25-20, 05:15 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by gugie
Get a hold of @nlerner. He needs some math help. But in case you're not 100% sure about past participles, he's your guy.
I try not to dwell in the past.

Oh, wait, this is C & V.
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Old 09-25-20, 07:07 AM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by Munny
Classic & Vintage ? ?
Arguing for future classic & vintage status in 2045. Besides, it's raining today, so I'll be damned if I'm taking one of my vintage bikes out.
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Old 09-25-20, 07:57 AM
  #41  
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Welp, this thread is going exactly as expected..
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Old 09-25-20, 08:17 AM
  #42  
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I've got Shimano GRX 800 on my Stigmata.

I run a compact double.

I switched back to Shimano/SRAM on most of my "new" bikes.

I haven't been a fan of Campy off road/gravel for years.

However, I love the look of Ekar and this might convince me to give Campy another chance.

This looks like a complete "package" from Campy and I would love to give it a shot.

Keep in mind, I ride almost 90% off road at this point.
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Old 09-25-20, 09:36 AM
  #43  
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Not cheap but I would consider this if I got a new bike.

-i prefer Ergo above all other options. I have barend shifters on my current gravel bike but this is awesome.
-i ride 40 x 11-42. Sometimes a not low enough and sometimes not high enough. Sometimes big jumps with 10 speed. So to run 36 x 9-42 between 13 would be amazing. This would mean a non Campy crank.
- gravel bikes are heavy, this is a little lighter than any other gravel/hydro groups.

At $1800 for the group, and the frame I want is $2200, plus wheels and cockpit, I don't know if I'll ever get it. I like it though
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Old 09-25-20, 11:48 AM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by shoota
What's the compromise?
As cog size decreases, the rate of wear increases. If you spend a lot of time on a small cog, it wears out very fast. Also, below 12T or so, the power transfer becomes wavy as the chain engages the teeth one by one. The trend is for smaller and smaller cogs and chainrings. I wish it went the other way, even though that would increase cost and weight.
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Old 09-25-20, 12:16 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by noglider
As cog size decreases, the rate of wear increases. If you spend a lot of time on a small cog, it wears out very fast. Also, below 12T or so, the power transfer becomes wavy as the chain engages the teeth one by one. The trend is for smaller and smaller cogs and chainrings. I wish it went the other way, even though that would increase cost and weight.
A bigger concern for pro's than me. Correct but not too consequential for downhill coasting.
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Old 09-25-20, 12:21 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by noglider
As cog size decreases, the rate of wear increases. If you spend a lot of time on a small cog, it wears out very fast. Also, below 12T or so, the power transfer becomes wavy as the chain engages the teeth one by one. The trend is for smaller and smaller cogs and chainrings. I wish it went the other way, even though that would increase cost and weight.
Gotcha. I guess if you get a big enough chainring you won't spend that much time in the 9t cog anyway. But then at least it's there when you need/want it.
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Old 09-25-20, 12:26 PM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by sykerocker
Besides, it's raining today, so I'll be damned if I'm taking one of my vintage bikes out.
Here in the PNW, that would limit our vintage bike riding to 3 months. Fenders are where it's at.

Some people have a rainy day bike in their quiver. I have a sunny day bike, the rest are all weather. Here's Bob Freeman not afraid to take a show quality Jack Taylor Tour of Britain bike on a 3 day winter tour. He has over 100 vintage bikes in his collection, all in impeccable order. Outside of the ones with wood rims, he'll ride most of them anytime, rain or shine.




Besides, this thread needed more purdy pics of purdy bikes.
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Old 09-25-20, 12:41 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by nomadmax
Not only not silver, not made of metal.

Count me out on anything "1x", the jumps in gear changes are just too big.
Well, I don't want a non-metal silver. I'm not opposed to non-metal materials, I just prefer things in there natural state.

I want to update pinky with a new pinky. I don't care for a pink/black color combination, I find it garish. So I was hoping this groupset would be silver, so I could try something new. I'm fine with 1x11 Potenza or Athena.
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Old 09-25-20, 12:51 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by gugie
Here in the PNW, that would limit our vintage bike riding to 3 months. Fenders are where it's at.

Some people have a rainy day bike in their quiver. I have a sunny day bike, the rest are all weather. Here's Bob Freeman not afraid to take a show quality Jack Taylor Tour of Britain bike on a 3 day winter tour. He has over 100 vintage bikes in his collection, all in impeccable order. Outside of the ones with wood rims, he'll ride most of them anytime, rain or shine.




Besides, this thread needed more purdy pics of purdy bikes.
Now that is a bike. Anyone that looks at that and doesn't "get it", doesn't get it.
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Old 09-25-20, 01:33 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes
There’s math.
No one said there’d be math.

13 is unsafe for so many reasons.
You have to look down twice as long to guess your gear.
The fingers go to ten, the extra one is a risk now with 11.
I’m already skipping cogs.
The whole 13 thing...

Just another waypoint en route to all 1x all the time.
I love mine but a Cat 4 climb last Saturday, 21% at 98 miles in: a double bailed me out or I’d have fallen over.

While a compact crank with 11-32 is getting me by across the board, a 52/36 with 12-36, a Roadlink and a clutched RD. may be my huckleberry.

That’s just the gearing thing. I still can’t wrap my head around brake fluid on a bike.
might have to move to spd sandals without socks
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