Hooked wheel question
#1
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Hooked wheel question
Only been riding for 2 years but soon I'm getting my first "serious" road bike with carbon wheels which I've never used before so please don't laugh if the question is dumb but...
I've read countless arguments between people about why hookless wheels are safe or unsafe and so I've decided to go with the reserve 40/44s and I don't think at this point you can convince me to go hookless so my question is: are tubeless setups all together unsafe or is a hooked rim safe to ride tubeless? As I understood the issue isn't necessarily with the tubeless setup per say but it is with the wheel not being hooked. Therefore it is safe to ride tubeless with a hooked rim is this correct?
Thanks very much for input in advance.
I've read countless arguments between people about why hookless wheels are safe or unsafe and so I've decided to go with the reserve 40/44s and I don't think at this point you can convince me to go hookless so my question is: are tubeless setups all together unsafe or is a hooked rim safe to ride tubeless? As I understood the issue isn't necessarily with the tubeless setup per say but it is with the wheel not being hooked. Therefore it is safe to ride tubeless with a hooked rim is this correct?
Thanks very much for input in advance.
#2
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Only been riding for 2 years but soon I'm getting my first "serious" road bike with carbon wheels which I've never used before so please don't laugh if the question is dumb but...
I've read countless arguments between people about why hookless wheels are safe or unsafe and so I've decided to go with the reserve 40/44s and I don't think at this point you can convince me to go hookless so my question is: are tubeless setups all together unsafe or is a hooked rim safe to ride tubeless? As I understood the issue isn't necessarily with the tubeless setup per say but it is with the wheel not being hooked. Therefore it is safe to ride tubeless with a hooked rim is this correct?
Thanks very much for input in advance.
I've read countless arguments between people about why hookless wheels are safe or unsafe and so I've decided to go with the reserve 40/44s and I don't think at this point you can convince me to go hookless so my question is: are tubeless setups all together unsafe or is a hooked rim safe to ride tubeless? As I understood the issue isn't necessarily with the tubeless setup per say but it is with the wheel not being hooked. Therefore it is safe to ride tubeless with a hooked rim is this correct?
Thanks very much for input in advance.
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#3
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Some tubeless tires are safe on hooked rims, but not all of them.
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/h...road-tubeless/
For example, any Continental tire more than two years old is not hookless-compatible.
Some wheel manufacturers like Zipp make the effort to list all of the tires which are certified with their wheels, and those that are not.
https://www.sram.com/en/zipp/campaig...-compatibility
One needs to make certain that the particular tire in-question is compatible with hookless rims. Also, the maximum allowed pressure of a tire may be different on hooked versus hookless rims, which is another facet to pay your attention to.
Pete, you will want to be more circumspect about providing potentially-dangerous advice, lest you get someone hurt.
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/h...road-tubeless/
For example, any Continental tire more than two years old is not hookless-compatible.
Some wheel manufacturers like Zipp make the effort to list all of the tires which are certified with their wheels, and those that are not.
https://www.sram.com/en/zipp/campaig...-compatibility
One needs to make certain that the particular tire in-question is compatible with hookless rims. Also, the maximum allowed pressure of a tire may be different on hooked versus hookless rims, which is another facet to pay your attention to.
Pete, you will want to be more circumspect about providing potentially-dangerous advice, lest you get someone hurt.
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Some tubeless tires are safe on hooked rims, but not all of them.
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/h...road-tubeless/
For example, any Continental tire more than two years old is not hookless-compatible.
Some wheel manufacturers like Zipp make the effort to list all of the tires which are certified with their wheels, and those that are not.
https://www.sram.com/en/zipp/campaig...-compatibility
One needs to make certain that the particular tire in-question is compatible with hookless rims. Also, the maximum allowed pressure of a tire may be different on hooked versus hookless rims, which is another facet to pay your attention to.
Pete, you will want to be more circumspect about providing potentially-dangerous advice, lest you get someone hurt.
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/h...road-tubeless/
For example, any Continental tire more than two years old is not hookless-compatible.
Some wheel manufacturers like Zipp make the effort to list all of the tires which are certified with their wheels, and those that are not.
https://www.sram.com/en/zipp/campaig...-compatibility
One needs to make certain that the particular tire in-question is compatible with hookless rims. Also, the maximum allowed pressure of a tire may be different on hooked versus hookless rims, which is another facet to pay your attention to.
Pete, you will want to be more circumspect about providing potentially-dangerous advice, lest you get someone hurt.
The OP clearly stated that they are not interested in hookless rims at this point.
Last edited by PeteHski; 12-11-23 at 04:10 AM.
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This non-sequitur from TC1's post was particularly puzzling:
"Some tubeless tires are safe on hooked rims, but not all of them.
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/h...road-tubeless/
For example, any Continental tire more than two years old is not hookless-compatible."
What does the fact that older Continental tires are not hookless compatible have to do with whether tubeless tires are safe on hooked rims?
Reiterating your question: which, if any, hookless-compatible tires are not safe to mount on hooked rims?
On the plus side, I learned from the Bike Radar article that the reason some rim manufacturers rushed into production of hookless road rim designs is that molding hooked carbon rims is more difficult and costly than extruding hooked aluminum rims.
By the way, I enjoyed the part of a DT statement in that article that included a sly dig at other manufacturers:
' However, for road wheels, DT is committed to hooked rims. “For us, a more intensive manufacturing process is not an obstacle and within the R&D of new high-end wheels we have proven in measurements that there are no performance disadvantages in aerodynamics and rolling resistance,” says Eggert. '
Last edited by Trakhak; 12-11-23 at 04:48 AM.
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From the product page
https://reservewheels.com/products/r...-44-road-wheel
“The 40/44 is designed to be your no fuss all round riding and climbing wheel set. There are no weight limits, no tire limitations and can be set up tubeless or with tubes”
https://reservewheels.com/products/r...-44-road-wheel
“The 40/44 is designed to be your no fuss all round riding and climbing wheel set. There are no weight limits, no tire limitations and can be set up tubeless or with tubes”
Last edited by PeteHski; 12-13-23 at 05:01 PM.
#8
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There are tubeless tires that are for hooked/crochet rims. So I'm not certain why the OP seems to pose that going to tubeless tires will require smooth bead or hookless rims.
And the word "safe" always gets thrown around in the mix. At the speed most cyclists ride, a tire rolling off the rim or burping air is just going to result in one having to come to a stop and address the issue. Not a automatic trip to the hospital.
And the word "safe" always gets thrown around in the mix. At the speed most cyclists ride, a tire rolling off the rim or burping air is just going to result in one having to come to a stop and address the issue. Not a automatic trip to the hospital.
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Hookless rims have been around since they were made of stamped steel. High pressure is where the conflict lies.
Tires can and do blow off the rim today, just the same as they did in 1972. Above and beyond all the modern advanced in manufacturing tolerance improvements, over pressurization is the constant. Nothing is user error proof. With due care and consideration, the worst that will happen is a return to the risk profile everybody simply accepted as "normal" 40 years ago.
Hooks didn't come around until everybody tried stuffing 100-120+ psi into a tires on 70 psi rims in the search for free speed.
Tires can and do blow off the rim today, just the same as they did in 1972. Above and beyond all the modern advanced in manufacturing tolerance improvements, over pressurization is the constant. Nothing is user error proof. With due care and consideration, the worst that will happen is a return to the risk profile everybody simply accepted as "normal" 40 years ago.
Hooks didn't come around until everybody tried stuffing 100-120+ psi into a tires on 70 psi rims in the search for free speed.
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Car dependency is a tax.
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1. Didn't read the linked article.
2. Read, but doesn't understand, the linked article.
3. Thinks others won't read the linked article, but merely linking it will bolster his position.
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Only been riding for 2 years but soon I'm getting my first "serious" road bike with carbon wheels which I've never used before so please don't laugh if the question is dumb but...
I've read countless arguments between people about why hookless wheels are safe or unsafe and so I've decided to go with the reserve 40/44s and I don't think at this point you can convince me to go hookless so my question is: are tubeless setups all together unsafe or is a hooked rim safe to ride tubeless? As I understood the issue isn't necessarily with the tubeless setup per say but it is with the wheel not being hooked. Therefore it is safe to ride tubeless with a hooked rim is this correct?
Thanks very much for input in advance.
I've read countless arguments between people about why hookless wheels are safe or unsafe and so I've decided to go with the reserve 40/44s and I don't think at this point you can convince me to go hookless so my question is: are tubeless setups all together unsafe or is a hooked rim safe to ride tubeless? As I understood the issue isn't necessarily with the tubeless setup per say but it is with the wheel not being hooked. Therefore it is safe to ride tubeless with a hooked rim is this correct?
Thanks very much for input in advance.
Tires that are designed to be used tubeless are totally safe to use with hooked tubeless rims.
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While an improperly set up tubeless tire can be dangerous, it isn't rocket science. Enjoy your hooked tubeless setup. If and when you get ready to try hookless, you'll want to similarly note the number of riders on properly setup hookless systems riding without incident.
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Some tubeless tires are safe on hooked rims, but not all of them.
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/h...road-tubeless/
For example, any Continental tire more than two years old is not hookless-compatible.
Some wheel manufacturers like Zipp make the effort to list all of the tires which are certified with their wheels, and those that are not.
https://www.sram.com/en/zipp/campaig...-compatibility
One needs to make certain that the particular tire in-question is compatible with hookless rims. Also, the maximum allowed pressure of a tire may be different on hooked versus hookless rims, which is another facet to pay your attention to.
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/h...road-tubeless/
For example, any Continental tire more than two years old is not hookless-compatible.
Some wheel manufacturers like Zipp make the effort to list all of the tires which are certified with their wheels, and those that are not.
https://www.sram.com/en/zipp/campaig...-compatibility
One needs to make certain that the particular tire in-question is compatible with hookless rims. Also, the maximum allowed pressure of a tire may be different on hooked versus hookless rims, which is another facet to pay your attention to.
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There are tubeless tires that are for hooked/crochet rims. So I'm not certain why the OP seems to pose that going to tubeless tires will require smooth bead or hookless rims.
And the word "safe" always gets thrown around in the mix. At the speed most cyclists ride, a tire rolling off the rim or burping air is just going to result in one having to come to a stop and address the issue. Not a automatic trip to the hospital.
And the word "safe" always gets thrown around in the mix. At the speed most cyclists ride, a tire rolling off the rim or burping air is just going to result in one having to come to a stop and address the issue. Not a automatic trip to the hospital.
And no, it wasn't a trip to the hospital. I had a bystander call a cab that took me to an urgent care.
Edit: And yes, I came to a stop (lying on the road) and addressed the issues. (With my body; concussion? boken bones? The bike got the attention a few weeks later.)
Last edited by 79pmooney; 12-11-23 at 11:07 AM.
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As someone who dealt daily with seating tires on hookless rims, with the hearing loss to show for it, I was happy to not have to deal with that garbage. But like all things in the bike tech world, knowledge doesn't get passed to the next generation, who have to experience the crappy technology of the past when it reemerges as the "next great thing".
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This is the only reply that matters for the OP, and it is 100% correct.
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#17
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Thanks very much all of your answers I was not expecting this much feedback. I should have known it would start an argument lol my apologies.
I feel much better knowing I can safely descend which I love. If it wasn't for being able to fly down the hills at 55mph I would still enjoy riding but not as much as I do. That is why I was scared to even go tubeless because of all the stuff I've read about the dangers of descending with a hookless rim.
Appreciate all the input, once again.
I feel much better knowing I can safely descend which I love. If it wasn't for being able to fly down the hills at 55mph I would still enjoy riding but not as much as I do. That is why I was scared to even go tubeless because of all the stuff I've read about the dangers of descending with a hookless rim.
Appreciate all the input, once again.
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If your tubeless tires are set up properly and you keep the sealant topped up, they are SAFER than running tubes, as small punctures will be non-issues. That's true whether you're running hooked or hookless, assuming you're using compatible tires with the latter. And as others have noted, ANY tubeless tires are compatible with your hooked rims. So you are good-to-go.
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For belt and braces you might want to consider adding run-flat tubeless tire liners like these:-
https://www.bicyclerollingresistance...oria-air-liner
I haven’t used them personally, but I might give them a try next year. If you did ever get a sudden blow out on a fast descent these could make all the difference. But tubeless sealant takes care of most small punctures pretty effectively.
https://www.bicyclerollingresistance...oria-air-liner
I haven’t used them personally, but I might give them a try next year. If you did ever get a sudden blow out on a fast descent these could make all the difference. But tubeless sealant takes care of most small punctures pretty effectively.
#20
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These are safe tubed or tubeless. They are not hooked rims.
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https://reservewheels.com/products/r...-44-road-wheel
These are safe tubed or tubeless. They are not hooked rims.
These are safe tubed or tubeless. They are not hooked rims.
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#22
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https://reservewheels.com/products/r...-44-road-wheel
These are safe tubed or tubeless. They are not hooked rims.
These are safe tubed or tubeless. They are not hooked rims.
#23
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https://reservewheels.com/products/r...-44-road-wheel
These are safe tubed or tubeless. They are not hooked rims.
These are safe tubed or tubeless. They are not hooked rims.
#24
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And a little fun with the thread title. Hooked wheels in bike races almost always end up a bad situation. Hooked wheels - what happens when a rider in front but not clear of the bike behind moves over to directly in front; placing his rear wheel where the front wheel of the bike behind is. Tires touch, perhaps hard, QRs can rip out spokes. End result is very frequently the following rider crashing; often taking out the next 1-5 riders. Now if we could just get novice racers to ride "hookless wheels", ie wheels that always ride straight in their proper lanes, racing would be much safer!
I managed to pull out an upright stop after having that hooking wheel's QR take out 8 consecutive spokes on that side. With hookless Weinmann Concave rims. (1979) The grace - those were perhaps the stiffest side-to-side rims ever made. The wheel still went through the fork (just barely; taking the brand new Imron to pare metal)
Now, back to the regular programming ...
I managed to pull out an upright stop after having that hooking wheel's QR take out 8 consecutive spokes on that side. With hookless Weinmann Concave rims. (1979) The grace - those were perhaps the stiffest side-to-side rims ever made. The wheel still went through the fork (just barely; taking the brand new Imron to pare metal)
Now, back to the regular programming ...
#25
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I have gravel rims. I should have refrained from commenting. The FAQ further muddies the waters: