rc5781

I saw this today and said something to the cyclists. If NO cars are coming, fine, cross the crosswalk. If cars are approaching you can't stop traffic that has a green light.

tungsten

I hate cars that stop for cyclists who don't have right-of-way. For instance sitting astride their bikes at a x-walk or stop sign.
I never proceed when a motorist does this to me. Just wave them through or wait them out. lol!

Steve B.

If the cyclist is riding the bike he would be considered a moving vehicle and has to follow the rules for all moving vehicles and would need to pay attention to the red light in his direction of travel. If the cyclist dismounts and is walking a bike in a crosswalk, he "might" have right of way. In some states and I think NY is like this, the pedestrian might not have right of way in a controlled intersection, where there might be walk/don't walk electronic signage, in which case a motorist with a green light has right of way over a pedestrian with a don't walk signage. If not a controlled intersection, with just a crosswalk, a pedestrian gets right of way and often gets run over exercising that right.

rc5781

Yeah that's a thing, too. I just wait for the crosswalk to turn green or there are no cars.

JoeyBike

Exactly. Or causes an accident where the first car stops quickly and gets rear-ended by cars behind them who forgot about the crossing. I've seen this a few times personally at a new Rail-Triail crossing I used twice a day (Lafitte Greenway crosses N. Carrollton Avenue in New Orleans). I saw a woman on a Vespa-like scooter get creamed from behind also. It was so common to witness close-calls that I used to HIDE on my bike a short distance away from the crossing so motorists couldn't see me and wait my turn until I got a natural break in traffic.

rc5781

In uncontrolled crosswalks I just do a 180 turnaround and start circling until the path is clear. I NEVER trust drivers. Right turning drivers with a forward green are the most dangerous.

fooferdoggie 

exactly this happens a lot when we are on our tandem. I am just putting my foot down and they stop. I was coming to a stop on weird section that the cars had the right of way there was a light event the car stopped for me and caused the truck behind to rear end him a little bit.

JoeyBike

No joke about trust! The intersection I mentioned is a 6-lane road, 3 lanes each way. I've seen one car stop and others floor it and go around them. Until all 3 lanes are DEAD STOPPED i am NOT stepping foot (or wheel) in that roadway. I also do not want to be the cause of someone having an auto/motorcycle accident, usually the poor soul doing the right thing gets smashed.

Troul 

That is the safest approach.

I 99% of the time cannot SEE them inside the vehicle due to windshield glare & will not assume that when they came to a stop that they SEE me. I've had drivers pull along side me after the fact tell me they were giving me the hand gestures to go across... Doesn't matter when I cannot SEE them making those gestures. Even the camera recorded footage cannot show it when reviewing it.

Flash the lights all you want, honk your horn until it pops a fuse, rev your engine until it blows, I will not proceed until I determine it is safe.

Calsun

It really comes down to exercising some judgment as to what is safe in any given circumstance. Chiildren are never provided with an education on how to bicycle safely and I often see children and adults riding against traffic.

Traffic signals are designed for use by motorists and by pedestrians and no thought is given to people riding bicycles. Motorists are not inclined to give the right of way to other cars much less to bicyclists.

If you let the little things get to you then how are you going to deal with the big stuff?

Kat12

I was thinking about this just tonight, actually. I was at a four-way stop, turning left (in my car). Across from me was an approaching group of cyclists. I got to the sign well before they did. Debated with myself: are they going to blow the stop sign, should I wait? Decided, nah, they see there are a bunch of cars going this intersection (there were several before me, from both ways), they'll stop. So, I turned. And looked in my rearview mirror and saw several of them yelling at me as they cruised through.

Not having ridden in a group myself (and never having encountered one at an intersection before)-- was I supposed to assume they would not stop? I mean, I'm sure this is most desirable for them and I get it because yes, stopping on a bike sucks, but I don't know if it's "a thing" and I should've waited for them to go through before I turned.


I hate it as a cyclist OR a pedestrian. I'll wave them on (if they hadn't stopped, we all would've gotten through already... and people behind them wouldn't be hating me...). Or, I've also been known to happen to be looking for traffic the other way if I think someone is about to do this, so I "don't see" that they've stopped and then they'll finally just go on (and they don't see how hard I'm rolling my eyes). I might appreciate it if I'm carrying something super-heavy or it's pouring or super-cold out, but otherwise... please just follow the rules of the road and I'll do the same; that's the "nicest" thing you could do for me (and everyone else around you).

(But I think the problem is that some aren't trying to be nice, they think I'm not going to stop. I see it sometimes also at stoplights when I'm in my car waiting to turn left. The opposing traffic going straight takes forever to get going, as if they think I'm going to turn in front of them. I've not seen that happen, but maybe they have too many times. So I sit there and stare at them hoping they'll get a move on so everyone gets through while there's still time for me to turn, too...)

If you could read my lips at either of these times, you'd see me saying something, "GO. *I* have to stop for *you.*"


Rear-ended or honked at, yeah. (Sometimes the honking is by people who don't see the pedestrian so don't know why the person isn't going, but other times they can full well see it and still... I guess expect the person to run the pedestrian over.)


That's a good idea in a car, too (like if crossing lanes). I know someone who got into an accident that way once. She was a young driver, pulling out of a driveway across two or three lanes of traffic. She wanted to follow her instincts and wait until she knew everyone was stopped. But, the person in the closest lane, who was stopped, kept insistently waving her to go, she felt pressured and did... and got T-boned by someone in the next lane. (And this is why I also never wave someone, even if I can see the other lanes are free when they can't-- because they don't have any reason to trust me.)

I don't pull out until I can see all the lanes are stopped. (Plus, it sucks if one person stops, the person pulling out starts to do so, and the other lanes are not stopped/do not stop, and then the person pulling out is stuck blocking the one lane until they can get into one of the other ones.)

tungsten

No, they're idiots. And one day they will make themselves moot.

FBinNY 

I'm not sure I understand the OP.

If he's talking about riding through intersections without right of way and forcing cars to stop to avoid collision, it's not only inconsiderate, it's also stupid and dangerous.

OTOH - if the OP taking about about situations where drivers are simply trying to be courteous then I don't consider this an issue at all. If you don't create a situation where the driver feels he must yield, then (other considerations permitting) why not accept it as an act of good will. In some cases, I might point up to the traffic signal so the driver gets the point, but otherwise I never make an issue of someone trying to do me a favor.

Also, note that most states require that drivers yield to pedestrians at intersections (double so in marked crosswalks) so if you position yourself in the crosswalk and stop with a toe down, you can't fault a driver for considering you to be a pedestrian who's expecting him to yield.

IMO - like everything else, it's about the situation, and one less thing to get worked up over.

rc5781

Man you guys can argue about ANYTHING. Yes, I'm talking about when a cyclist aggressively tries to cross an intersection with a crosswalk, when the crosswalk light is red, and cars have a green light. You're not a cop, you can't stop traffic with a green light. Unclip your freaking pedals. And NO, it's not ok for you to go if cars with a green light wave you on, because cars who are behind that car assume they don't have to stop since it's a green light and may slam into the back of the car "being nice".

JoeyBike

That's part of the charm of A&S. Check your tender sensibilities at the door. (And don't take anyone too seriously - some here should do more cycling and less typing, including me).

FBinNY 

It seems that you're the one arguing.

Not knowing exactly what you meant, I posited 2 general possibilities.

You confirmed that you meant the first, in which case we agree, so why argue.

You then referenced the second, "nice guy", possibility and argued against my "no harm, no foul" opinion referencing a specific situation that I thought was covered by the " other conditions permitting" qualifier.

So. I can't speak for others, but I'm not arguing, for the simple reason that I don't care what others choose to do. I was simply I feeling an opinion for those who might be interested.

FWIW one of the chief causes of disagreement between myself and many here in A&S is my stated bias to minding my own business, and defining that concept tightly. I limit my issues to those I feel actually matter in the scheme of things, and don't involve myself in the actions of others, unless I consider it both important and meaningful. Lecturing other cyclists about their behavior fails on both counts.

Chuck M 

Please elaborate. Did you stop and have a discussion with them or shout something that they didn't even understand and then post about it on BF? Either way, I doubt you made much of an impact.

rc5781

This makes it seem to me like if a car with a green light waves you to go, then you go.

rc5781

I was crossing 90 degrees from them at the intersection and after I saw them stopping cars with a green traffic light, I told them they can't stop cars with a green light. One of the guys quickly looked at me with a guilty glance and everyone else who had stopped seemed to agree. Are you REALLY trying to tell me that it's okay for cyclists with a red light at a crosswalk has the right of way over car at the same intersection with a green light???

FBinNY 

It's case by case, and depends on the unspoken "conversation", and other traffic. But to confirm your opinion, the one thing I will not do, is stand on ceremony and play "no, you go".

Chuck M 

Where did you get that? I asked how your interaction with them was.

rc5781

I disagree completely. If cars are approaching with a green light at a crosswalk where you as a cyclist or pedestrian have a red crosswalk light. Don't cross. Even if they wave you on. Because now, this driver who waves you on thinks they must yield to cyclists and pedestrians at all crosswalks even when the have a green light. I almost hit a kid recently on a bike in this exact scenario as I was driving. I had a green light at a crosswalk and he must have thought he had the right of way no matter what since it was a crosswalk. Had to slam on my brakes and swerve to the side to not hit him. He and I were both shook.

rc5781

Previous post:
"I was crossing 90 degrees from them at the intersection and after I saw them stopping cars with a green traffic light, I told them they can't stop cars with a green light. One of the guys quickly looked at me with a guilty glance and everyone else who had stopped seemed to agree."

I love how you LITERALLY quoted everything in my post that didn't answer your question.

Chuck M 

I apologize. It is obvious you saved their lives from making the same mistake at the next intersection and have imparted your wisdom upon the forum so others here will not make the same mistake. Thank you for your service.

rc5781

Based on your flippant responses I guess you're OK with this behavior. I am not. It's dangerous. 2 plus 2 doesn't equal 5, no matter how sarcastic you are...