Old Fashion Pedal Power -- No More
03-11-18, 07:27 PM
#76
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03-12-18, 05:37 AM
#77
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I'm good with anything that presents an alternative to get people out of cars. And thankfully electric bikes aren't an unregulated mess with kilowatt rockets capable of 30 mph or more here, if you have more than 250W of assist (another person's worth of power goes a long way) or it propels you beyond 25 kph / 15.5 mph it's legally treated like a scooter in the EU and you need to get it plated, install the necessary safety parts, have a license, wear a motorcycle helmet and take it on the road instead of the bike path. To pessimists an electric cyclist is one more "false" cyclist, to optimists it's one less driver.
03-12-18, 12:48 PM
#78
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Unfortunately we have to cater to the lowest common denominator so long as certain modes of transportation are essentially seen as a "right." And that normally means dumbing things down to the point that even an idiot can get by and not cause too many problems for other people.
That's why I say the limits for e-bikes should be very low/strict on any bike paths. Too many fools to leave it up to chance.
03-16-18, 04:18 PM
#80
Senior Member
In my city there are speed limits on MUPs, regardless of what you are riding. That seems fair to me. I've never seen problems with pedal-assist bikes - the guys to watch out for are the roadies going way too fast!
I think it is inevitable that the E-Bikes will eventually be regulated. 10 to 15 is the typical bicycling speed, but 20, or just over 20 isn't uncommon for bikes. And, thus likely why many e-bikes are regulated at 20 MPH.
Should bicycles also have a speed limit imposed on MUPS?
I suppose many cyclists find E-Bikes annoying as one is huffing
as the e-biker appears to be simply sitting on the seat and twisting a knob.
But the regulation should be driven by how the e-bikes (as well as bicycles) interact with other trail users in the case of MUPs and street users in the case of roadside bike lanes.
It is quite possible that an e-biker cruising at 20 MPH can better pay attention to his or her surroundings than the cyclist pumping hard, head down, and the same 20 MPH
Or, perhaps the e-biker will be oblivious to his or her surroundings... concentrating on getting those extra watts to the motor. No stopping, no matter what.
There is no reason a 1000W e-bike can't safely ride a trail at 10 MPH.
Anyway, I'd encourage the governments to stand back and watch and observe until there are either accidents, injuries (e-bikers, cyclists, pedestrians on trails/streets), or complaints of actual near misses. And what may be necessary in one community may entirely superfluous in another community.
Perhaps sponsoring street savvy and trail savvy training for e-bikers would help prevent the need for regulation.
Smart Bikes?
Algebra Classes, Geometry Classes, English Classes, History Classes, French Classes, and perhaps a little Physical Education thrown in?
Should bicycles also have a speed limit imposed on MUPS?
I suppose many cyclists find E-Bikes annoying as one is huffing
as the e-biker appears to be simply sitting on the seat and twisting a knob.But the regulation should be driven by how the e-bikes (as well as bicycles) interact with other trail users in the case of MUPs and street users in the case of roadside bike lanes.
It is quite possible that an e-biker cruising at 20 MPH
can better pay attention to his or her surroundings than the cyclist pumping hard, head down, and the same 20 MPH Or, perhaps the e-biker will be oblivious to his or her surroundings... concentrating on getting those extra watts to the motor. No stopping, no matter what.
There is no reason a 1000W e-bike can't safely ride a trail at 10 MPH.
Anyway, I'd encourage the governments to stand back and watch and observe until there are either accidents, injuries (e-bikers, cyclists, pedestrians on trails/streets), or complaints of actual near misses. And what may be necessary in one community may entirely superfluous in another community.
Perhaps sponsoring street savvy and trail savvy training for e-bikers would help prevent the need for regulation.
Smart Bikes?
Algebra Classes, Geometry Classes, English Classes, History Classes, French Classes, and perhaps a little Physical Education thrown in?
03-16-18, 06:51 PM
#81
Junior Member
Seems like most, if not all of the suggestions for rules are coming from people who have never ridden and used an e-bike. It's a little like drivers who think bicycles should be on the sidewalk. I use one for a 20 mile commute that I would otherwise need to drive or spend an extra hour and a half riding. It makes it harder to not ride due to rainy weather since 65 minutes in rain or a 20 mph headwind is tolerable. It also makes it fun to ride the real bicycle on weekends again.
03-16-18, 07:16 PM
#82
Senior Member
Seems like most, if not all of the suggestions for rules are coming from people who have never ridden and used an e-bike. It's a little like drivers who think bicycles should be on the sidewalk. I use one for a 20 mile commute that I would otherwise need to drive or spend an extra hour and a half riding. It makes it harder to not ride due to rainy weather since 65 minutes in rain or a 20 mph headwind is tolerable. It also makes it fun to ride the real bicycle on weekends again.
What works for you...? 
Last edited by 350htrr; 03-16-18 at 07:30 PM.
03-17-18, 06:30 AM
#83
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People with all sorts of vehicles (even pedal bikes) exceed safe speeds for whatever surface they happen to be on all the time. What's your point?
03-17-18, 08:36 AM
#84
Senior Member
I feel like there is a lot of misunderstanding of how powerful ebikes are.
a 750 watt will probably get you to around 30mph give or take
most are 250-500 watts - and max assisted speed of 28mph
mine is 450 watt top speed is no faster than a regular bike 2Oish mph what it does it help flatten the abundant WV hills so my average speed is15/17mph on my country commute vs 10/11mph
there are WATT monsters 1000-7000 watt that can hit 40 plus easily and run on the freeway speed- those do usually skirt the law because how is a cop supposed to know how much power your bike has
the trouble is in nomenclature is it a motor assisted bike
a scooter with pedals or motorcycle with an electric motor
a 750 watt will probably get you to around 30mph give or take
most are 250-500 watts - and max assisted speed of 28mph
mine is 450 watt top speed is no faster than a regular bike 2Oish mph what it does it help flatten the abundant WV hills so my average speed is15/17mph on my country commute vs 10/11mph
there are WATT monsters 1000-7000 watt that can hit 40 plus easily and run on the freeway speed- those do usually skirt the law because how is a cop supposed to know how much power your bike has
the trouble is in nomenclature is it a motor assisted bike
a scooter with pedals or motorcycle with an electric motor
03-17-18, 09:02 AM
#85
Senior Member
My point was that I was trying to establish those things, with another person who actually rides an E-Bike .EDIT; Like nasabiker mentioned, nomenclature, is important in understanding what is a legal E-Bike, or legal E-assist bikes that are legally considered bicycles, not scooters with pedals, or a bike with a motor...
Last edited by 350htrr; 03-17-18 at 09:20 AM.
03-17-18, 10:03 AM
#86
Senior Member
I'm good with anything that presents an alternative to get people out of cars. And thankfully electric bikes aren't an unregulated mess with kilowatt rockets capable of 30 mph or more here, if you have more than 250W of assist (another person's worth of power goes a long way) or it propels you beyond 25 kph / 15.5 mph it's legally treated like a scooter in the EU and you need to get it plated, install the necessary safety parts, have a license, wear a motorcycle helmet and take it on the road instead of the bike path. To pessimists an electric cyclist is one more "false" cyclist, to optimists it's one less driver.
03-17-18, 10:32 AM
#87
Senior Member
I think overall speed limits based on where your riding rather than power limiters cars have a wide range of HP yet are restrained by speed laws. and really only should the speed matter on mups and such where the space is shared with walker and such.
I have hit 57mph down hill on a standard bike so meh. there are just so many variable. eventually as they gain popularity I am sure there will be more defined regs . right now it the wild west
I have hit 57mph down hill on a standard bike so meh. there are just so many variable. eventually as they gain popularity I am sure there will be more defined regs . right now it the wild west
03-17-18, 10:47 AM
#88
Senior Member
I think overall speed limits based on where your riding rather than power limiters cars have a wide range of HP yet are restrained by speed laws. and really only should the speed matter on mups and such where the space is shared with walker and such.
I have hit 57mph down hill on a standard bike so meh. there are just so many variable. eventually as they gain popularity I am sure there will be more defined regs . right now it the wild west
I have hit 57mph down hill on a standard bike so meh. there are just so many variable. eventually as they gain popularity I am sure there will be more defined regs . right now it the wild west
Where as if one was riding a 350 watt assist one would actually still really would need to put out everything one has to go 20 MPH up that hill and definitely would NOT make 28MPH.
Last edited by 350htrr; 03-17-18 at 11:02 AM. Reason: add stuff
03-17-18, 01:08 PM
#89
Senior Member
that is where speed limits based on situation- just like on hwy vs back road. in the case of ebikes on mups even bikes have a speed limit. and if its a busy mup or rail trail probably shouldn't be motorized at all, - I don't disagree really with you assumption either
personally I wouldn't want that much help on my ebike anyway it starts to become pointless to pedal if its to powerful. the you have a slow motorcycle
personally I wouldn't want that much help on my ebike anyway it starts to become pointless to pedal if its to powerful. the you have a slow motorcycle
03-17-18, 03:26 PM
#90
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DH looked at ebikes while I was ordering my trike today- power assist types... he would like one that charges when pedaled and then can be ridden completely on battery without pedalling, but the reason is medical. He CAN'T walk with me already due to leg joint issues, he CAN bike, but uphill only for a short period and not the mileage even I can most of the time before the joint issues start causing him severe pain... for him power assist isn't the answer because what he needs is a rest period when the pain gets too bad, and that isn't an option... that way he's not limiting the distance of my rides when we go out together. I think he was also shocked at the prices. I was surprised as how many e bikes were mixed in with the other bikes at the LBS we were at (they are re-arranging displays so things weren't set up neatly like normal and it was interesting to see).
03-17-18, 03:55 PM
#91
Senior Member
DH looked at ebikes while I was ordering my trike today- power assist types... he would like one that charges when pedaled and then can be ridden completely on battery without pedalling, but the reason is medical. He CAN'T walk with me already due to leg joint issues, he CAN bike, but uphill only for a short period and not the mileage even I can most of the time before the joint issues start causing him severe pain... for him power assist isn't the answer because what he needs is a rest period when the pain gets too bad, and that isn't an option... that way he's not limiting the distance of my rides when we go out together. I think he was also shocked at the prices. I was surprised as how many e bikes were mixed in with the other bikes at the LBS we were at (they are re-arranging displays so things weren't set up neatly like normal and it was interesting to see).
Last edited by 350htrr; 03-17-18 at 06:27 PM. Reason: add stuff
03-17-18, 06:29 PM
#92
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oh I know.. and I don't think he's going to get one at all for the time being.. we can just keep rides short when together or in places where stopping and sitting for a bit won't be a problem... he can sit on my trike and I can get sit on the ground while his bike stands... long run that may need re-evaluating... but for now, we'll cope without it... I was just laughing when he said that in the shop today.
03-17-18, 07:35 PM
#93
Senior Member
oh I know.. and I don't think he's going to get one at all for the time being.. we can just keep rides short when together or in places where stopping and sitting for a bit won't be a problem... he can sit on my trike and I can get sit on the ground while his bike stands... long run that may need re-evaluating... but for now, we'll cope without it... I was just laughing when he said that in the shop today.
03-19-18, 08:56 AM
#94
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03-20-18, 05:35 PM
#96
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E bikes take nothing away from cycling if they create an in-road for people who would not otherwise ride =OR= create an alternative way for avid cyclists to go COMPLETELY car-free by offering really neat cargo-bike options (see Rad Bikes in Seattle)
03-20-18, 07:35 PM
#97
Senior Member
Originally Posted by davei1980;20235631[U
]E bikes take nothing away from cycling if they create an in-road for people who would not otherwise ride[/U] =OR= create an alternative way for avid cyclists to go COMPLETELY car-free by offering really neat cargo-bike options (see Rad Bikes in Seattle)
Having said that, there IS, Are, different type of E-Bikes. and, some are closer to mopeds than others... as I understand them...
03-21-18, 09:07 AM
#98
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I told my wife she should consider an ebike. She almost slapped me.
03-21-18, 10:11 AM
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Ebikes are just like golf to me. I suppose I will take it up whenever I get too old to do anything strenuous.
03-21-18, 11:41 AM
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You live in BC - Have you heard of Rad Bikes in Seattle? Their cargo bike LOOKS AWESOME. If I had an urban lifestyle I would TOTALLY have that as my grocery-getter/kid hauler.