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Tubular Wheel Set - What to do ??

Old 12-09-18, 10:13 AM
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Tubular Wheel Set - What to do ??

Hello All. I have a bit of a dilemma. Fiamme tubular wheels, with Shimano 600 Tri-color hubs (7 Speed). Had them trued a few (2 Yrs.) ago. I noticed that the rear, now has a flat spot, They were ridden once since truing (LBS) 25 mi. They have been hanging on a wall rack , so I don't understand what happen. Anyway, I love the hubs, and I don't think I'll ever ride tubulars again. Just getting too old, to deal with the hassle.

I trying to determine the best(low cost) route to go with the hubs.

1. Remove the hubs, and build a clincher wheel set around the hubs. (Myself)

2. Have my LBS build a wheel set around the hubs (That was a $350 cost on the last set of Shimano 600 hubs, and I still use those)

3. Remove the hubs, discard the rims/spokes, and store the hubs, Forget the whole project.

I'm looking at option 1. But, I have never done this. I'm sure I could lace the wheels, front probably the easiest , but trying to dish the rear , not so much. If I lace it all up, I could have my LBS , finish the project. Also, trying to figure out spoke length.

What do you pros, think I should do ? Thank you . KB
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Old 12-09-18, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by kcblair
I'm looking at option 1. But, I have never done this. I'm sure I could lace the wheels, front probably the easiest , but trying to dish the rear , not so much. If I lace it all up, I could have my LBS , finish the project. Also, trying to figure out spoke length.

What do you pros, think I should do ? Thank you . KB
I think you should go with option 1. Use this article as a reference, all of your concerns and questions are addressed and fully explained.

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/wheelbuild.html
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Old 12-09-18, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by well biked
I think you should go with option 1. Use this article as a reference, all of your concerns and questions are addressed and fully explained.

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/wheelbuild.html
+1

I'm not a pro, but I sometimes pretend to be one at the bike co-op . Even if you have difficulty with the truing, you can take them to be checked and finished at the LBS (or better yet, your local bike co-op).

-Will
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Old 12-09-18, 01:04 PM
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If cost is an object, option 3 is probably the least expensive as good quality wheels are pretty reasonable these days.

If you like the work and can get the rims and spokes at an acceptable cost, do option 1.

Only if you absolutely love the hubs and can't bear to part with them and don't trust yourself to build the wheels, do option 2.

BTW, what's the rear spacing on your frame? If it's 126 mm (7-speed) you will have some problems finding matching new wheels since the road standard is now 130 mm. If your frame is steel, it's easy to cold set (bend) it to 130 mm or just struggle a bit on rear wheel changes.
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Old 12-09-18, 01:09 PM
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re ... cycling

Just getting too old, to deal with the hassle.
take off cassette / freewheel first, then once its off go around the wheel
and either progressively de tension the spokes,
(maybe someone can use the rim, stretching new tires an extra rim is handy)
or just cut the spokes, only save the hub..






..

Last edited by fietsbob; 12-09-18 at 01:24 PM.
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Old 12-09-18, 01:22 PM
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What I would do is to try to find a clincher rim with the same ERD as your tubular rims and do a rim swap: Tape the 2 rims together, loosen the spoke nipples on your current rims a few turns, then one by one disconnect each spoke, transfer the nipple and spoke to the new rim until they are all done and then gradually tighten the spokes equally after the transfer is complete. I have done this dozens of times over the last 45 years and have rebuilt dozens of wheels this way

Last edited by alcjphil; 12-09-18 at 01:25 PM.
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Old 12-09-18, 01:25 PM
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You don't appear to have much use for the wheels or the hubs. Maybe sell them (or give them) as-is to someone who might use them?
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Old 12-09-18, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by AnkleWork
You don't appear to have much use for the wheels or the hubs. Maybe sell them (or give them) as-is to someone who might use them?

That sounds like another useful option. Only downside is that it is becoming hard to find people who want to use a hub/rim/ tire combination like this
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Old 12-09-18, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by HillRider
If cost is an object, option 3 is probably the least expensive as good quality wheels are pretty reasonable these days.

If you like the work and can get the rims and spokes at an acceptable cost, do option 1.

Only if you absolutely love the hubs and can't bear to part with them and don't trust yourself to build the wheels, do option 2.

BTW, what's the rear spacing on your frame? If it's 126 mm (7-speed) you will have some problems finding matching new wheels since the road standard is now 130 mm. If your frame is steel, it's easy to cold set (bend) it to 130 mm or just struggle a bit on rear wheel changes.
I was using the wheels on 2 bikes, one with 126mm and one with 130mm. (both 7 speed) The hubs are 126mm.I already have a spare set of 126mm (OLD) I use on my trainer . KB
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Old 12-09-18, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by alcjphil
What I would do is to try to find a clincher rim with the same ERD as your tubular rims and do a rim swap: Tape the 2 rims together, loosen the spoke nipples on your current rims a few turns, then one by one disconnect each spoke, transfer the nipple and spoke to the new rim until they are all done and then gradually tighten the spokes equally after the transfer is complete. I have done this dozens of times over the last 45 years and have rebuilt dozens of wheels this way
Now that sounds like a plausible idea. What is an ERD ? KB
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Old 12-09-18, 03:55 PM
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I think I like @alcjphil idea. Probably, the least expensive, as I only need rims. Need to determine ERD. If I botch it up, LBS can finish. KB
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Old 12-09-18, 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted by kcblair
What is an ERD ?
Effective Rim Diameter.
There are two different opinions about what this exactly means, and the currently ”winning” idea is that it’s the diameter that the spoke nipple flange rests against.
You need the ERD to be a very good match to get away with replacing a rim while keeping the spokes.
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Old 12-09-18, 04:31 PM
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What is the Shimano 600 rear hub.. 7-speed Uniglide only, or 7-speed Hyperglide compatible?

If the former, then these wheels or hubs are not worth much. Also keep in mind that even if they are the more usable latter, then the freehub will not accept an 11-tooth cog (Hyperglide-C), so 75% of the Shimano cassettes being sold new right now won't fit.

I work at a high-volume big-city bike Co-op. No offense, but if a set of 7-speed Shimano 600 wheels/Uniglide hubs/tubular rims were to come in the door as a donation, I would immediately relegate them to the $10 wheel bin. We drown in this type of stuff, especially this time of year.
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Old 12-09-18, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Mayer
What is the Shimano 600 rear hub.. 7-speed Uniglide only, or 7-speed Hyperglide compatible?

If the former, then these wheels or hubs are not worth much. Also keep in mind that even if they are the more usable latter, then the freehub will not accept an 11-tooth cog (Hyperglide-C), so 75% of the Shimano cassettes being sold new right now won't fit.

I work at a high-volume big-city bike Co-op. No offense, but if a set of 7-speed Shimano 600 wheels/Uniglide hubs/tubular rims were to come in the door as a donation, I would immediately relegate them to the $10 wheel bin. We drown in this type of stuff, especially this time of year.
The Shimano 600 is or was originally 7 speed , uniglide only. Few years back, I installed hyperglide free-hubs. so I could use hyperglide cassettes and continue to use the wheels. I have some low mileage cassettes , still in use on 2 bikes. I have no use for the rims, as the rear has a flat area, and I'm done with tubulars. The Tires have 25 miles of use.

I though about just pulling the hubs and building a set of clincher rims. For what reason, I'm not sure. Just to say I build some wheels. I have a nice set of Campy rims (7 Speed) on my Campy equipped Concorde. And a rebuilt set of wheels (from Shimano 600 hubs, by my LBS 6 yrs. ago) on my BS500. A 3rd set (Shimano 600), is in use for my trainer.

Everything else I own is 8, 9, and 10 speed. Maybe I should suck it up, and pitch the wheel set, shame, the hubs are nice and been overhauled through out the years. KB

Edit: I upgraded all my 7 speeds from uniglide to hyperglide.

Last edited by kcblair; 12-09-18 at 04:58 PM.
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Old 12-09-18, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by kcblair
I though about just pulling the hubs and building a set of clincher rims. For what reason, I'm not sure. Just to say I build some wheels..
I picked up on that sentiment in your original post...these hubs don't have much value, but you like them, and have some attachment to them. It's getting to be winter, and for a lot of folks that's a good time for a project like this. That was my reasoning for recommending "option 1" and following Sheldon's instructions, the article is written with the intent of helping people build their first set of wheels.
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Old 12-09-18, 09:22 PM
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The instructions on Sheldon's site are pretty decent, but unfortunately the illustrations are all shown from the drive side, and you don't actually lace the wheel that way. If you can follow the text and mentally turn the illustrations around, then you can follow it and should be well on the way to a nice set of wheels.

I'm not calling myself an expert but have built more than a few sets and I'd be happy to spend some time on the phone with you if you get stuck. It's not rocket science, but it is a good feeling riding on wheels you laced, trued and tensioned. Building a set of wheels seems like a bicycle mechanic's senior thesis.
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Old 12-09-18, 10:46 PM
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I don't understand what your objective is. You don't need another pair of wheels. You're not restoring a vintage bike. You don't want tubulars. If you want to learn wheel building there are some good suggestions here. If you just can't bare to throw them away, offer them for free to someone.
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Old 12-10-18, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by well biked
I picked up on that sentiment in your original post...these hubs don't have much value, but you like them, and have some attachment to them. It's getting to be winter, and for a lot of folks that's a good time for a project like this. That was my reasoning for recommending "option 1" and following Sheldon's instructions, the article is written with the intent of helping people build their first set of wheels.
Thanks, that's what I'm going to do, remove the hub and save it for a winter project. I need to shop around for some cheap rims, and figure out the spoke length and have fun. KB
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Old 12-10-18, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by DiabloScott
I don't understand what your objective is. You don't need another pair of wheels. You're not restoring a vintage bike. You don't want tubulars. If you want to learn wheel building there are some good suggestions here. If you just can't bare to throw them away, offer them for free to someone.
My objective, is to move this wheel set. Some way. The hubs are worth keeping, but what to do with them, so I'm going to remove them and try and build a wheel set , just for the fun, this winter. CO-OPs don't want them, I understand that , also the Conti tubulars are brand new. Maybe some one on this forum could use them, once I remove them. KB
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Old 12-10-18, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by speedevil
The instructions on Sheldon's site are pretty decent, but unfortunately the illustrations are all shown from the drive side, and you don't actually lace the wheel that way. If you can follow the text and mentally turn the illustrations around, then you can follow it and should be well on the way to a nice set of wheels.

I'm not calling myself an expert but have built more than a few sets and I'd be happy to spend some time on the phone with you if you get stuck. It's not rocket science, but it is a good feeling riding on wheels you laced, trued and tensioned. Building a set of wheels seems like a bicycle mechanic's senior thesis.
Thank you for the offer. After I get the wheels broke down, I'll contact you. Only issue I see, is getting the correct spoke length. I've read Sheldon Browns instructions, ad looked at several youtube videos.
I don't want to invest money in tension gauges or dishing equipment, other than ruffing it in. I have a truing stand. I have a great LBS, that fine tunes wheels for me, so they could put the finishing touches on for me. KB
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Old 12-10-18, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by kcblair
Thanks, that's what I'm going to do, remove the hub and save it for a winter project. I need to shop around for some cheap rims, and figure out the spoke length and have fun. KB
Cool. If you think about it, revive the thread when you get the wheels done and let us know how the project went. Good luck-
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Old 12-10-18, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by kcblair
My objective, is to move this wheel set. Some way. The hubs are worth keeping, but what to do with them, so I'm going to remove them and try and build a wheel set , just for the fun, this winter. CO-OPs don't want them, I understand that , also the Conti tubulars are brand new. Maybe some one on this forum could use them, once I remove them. KB
pretty sure you would get takers in C&V..... I just got a new set or I would be PMing you
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Old 12-10-18, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by squirtdad
pretty sure you would get takers in C&V..... I just got a new set or I would be PMing you
Thanks, as some as I get them off, I'll post it KB.
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Old 12-10-18, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by alcjphil
What I would do is to try to find a clincher rim with the same ERD as your tubular rims and do a rim swap: Tape the 2 rims together, loosen the spoke nipples on your current rims a few turns, then one by one disconnect each spoke, transfer the nipple and spoke to the new rim until they are all done and then gradually tighten the spokes equally after the transfer is complete. I have done this dozens of times over the last 45 years and have rebuilt dozens of wheels this way
This...You saved me typing the exact same thing.
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Old 12-10-18, 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Homebrew01
This...You saved me typing the exact same thing.
Thanks, that'd what I'm going to try first, if I can accurately get the ERD. If not, I'll get a cheap generic set of rims and calculate the spoke length. KB
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