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[Pictures] 135mm or 130mm rear spacing

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[Pictures] 135mm or 130mm rear spacing

Old 11-26-18, 10:22 PM
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raria
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[Pictures] 135mm or 130mm rear spacing

Hi,

So I bought this frameset

Which the listing says has a 135mm rear dropout spacing and the seller said he *measured* as 135mm.

But the first picture below shows that its actually 131mm and the second shows that a 130mm hub flush on the left hand side has a little bit of space on the right hand side (pictured) barely 1-2mm and with a tiny bit of chain stay flex it will close.

So which is it 135mm or 130mm? Its a CF frameset so is the chainstay supposed to flex even a little?



Last edited by raria; 11-26-18 at 11:06 PM.
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Old 11-26-18, 10:29 PM
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135
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Old 11-26-18, 11:05 PM
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Why?

But Wont a 135mm hub spread the chain stays? A 130mm hub barely has 1 or 2mm of space.

Originally Posted by trailangel
135
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Old 11-26-18, 11:17 PM
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Using the end of the tape measure that way "can" give false results. They get bent etc.
Line up the 100mm mark as your zero point and measure your 23?mm length.
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Old 11-27-18, 12:09 AM
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And don't expect a production frame to hold closer then a mm+ per side of intended alignment. Andy
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Old 11-27-18, 12:21 AM
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Good point.

Tried your way and it comes up as 231mm.

Originally Posted by Bill Kapaun
Using the end of the tape measure that way "can" give false results. They get bent etc.
Line up the 100mm mark as your zero point and measure your 23?mm length.
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Old 11-27-18, 04:31 AM
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Originally Posted by raria
Hi,

So I bought this frameset

Which the listing says has a 135mm rear dropout spacing and the seller said he *measured* as 135mm.

But the first picture below shows that its actually 131mm and the second shows that a 130mm hub flush on the left hand side has a little bit of space on the right hand side (pictured) barely 1-2mm and with a tiny bit of chain stay flex it will close.

So which is it 135mm or 130mm? Its a CF frameset so is the chainstay supposed to flex even a little?


What brand/model of frame is it? What is it’s intended use?

It looks like 135 to me as well. A metric dial caliper is much butter to obtain an accurate measurement than a tape measure. I use an inexpensive nylon one and it is accurate down to 0.1mm. You can also use inexpensive digital 6” dial calipers like the one from Harbor Freight - I believe they cost ~$20. The readout toggles between thousandths of an inch and mm easily.

If it is a 135mm frame I’m curious if it is a disc or cyclocross frame?

edit: I just clicked the link on the frame & see where it is cyclocross. I’d say high likelihood that it is 135 mm spacing.
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Old 11-27-18, 06:27 AM
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132 so you can run 130 or 135 hubs
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Old 11-27-18, 07:51 AM
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This shouldnt be so hard ....

Raleigh own website has no informatiion!

But this review website says 130mm for the canti version i have

Why do you say 135mm when it measures much closer to 130mm?

Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart
And don't expect a production frame to hold closer then a mm+ per side of intended alignment. Andy

Last edited by raria; 11-27-18 at 07:57 AM.
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Old 11-27-18, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by raria
Raleigh own website has no informatiion!

But this review website says 130mm for the canti version i have

Why do you say 135mm when it measures much closer to 130mm?
Well, why do you quote me as though I said it was 135? I never said such. My reply was about a manufacturer keeping to an exact dimension on a production run. Whatever the intended dimension might be. Andy
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Old 11-27-18, 09:03 AM
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It was the "royal" usage of the pronoun as they refer to! You meaning the general audience.


Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart
Well, why do you quote me as though I said it was 135? I never said such. My reply was about a manufacturer keeping to an exact dimension on a production run. Whatever the intended dimension might be. Andy
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Old 11-27-18, 09:24 AM
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I bought a frame to build up for my son, and it's 132.5, so it will fit either a disc or a non-disc hub.

But that Raleigh is almost certainly 135.
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Old 11-27-18, 09:33 AM
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Thanks

Your comment that it's almost certainly 135 is based on the fact it's a cyclocross right? Then I agree, but the tape measure says something different. If you see the last picture you can see I am required to squeeze the frame a millimeter or two to get a snug fit with a 130mm hub is that better than splaying the chain stays 3-4 millimeters to fit in a 135 millimeter rear hub?

it's a carbon fiber frameset

Originally Posted by DrIsotope
I bought a frame to build up for my son, and it's 132.5, so it will fit either a disc or a non-disc hub.

But that Raleigh is almost certainly 135.

Last edited by raria; 11-27-18 at 01:07 PM.
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Old 11-27-18, 09:40 AM
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My guess is that it's intended for 130mm hubs. Yeah, you've measured the spacing at 131mm, so that does suggest 130 over 135, but my main reason for thinking 130 is that it's a cantilever brake cx frame. The canti brake element of that is the main clue, most rim brake cx bikes were designed for 130mm rear hubs.

Surly Cross Checks come with 132.5 for versatility (steel frame, quite easy to fudge 2.5mm either way when installing the rear wheel). But my shop sold a lot of canti-equipped cx bikes, and other than the Cross Check, I'm pretty sure all of them came with 130mm rear spacing (and this is from three different mainstream brands I can think of).

Some of the early disc-equipped cx bikes also came with 130mm rear spacing, and unfortunately, that became a PITA for the owners of those bikes within a year or two, because the common disc brake rear spacing for cx and road bikes quickly became 135 (the mtb standard at the time), and 142 for thru axle equipped bikes.

Also, I just read the description in the link you posted, the frameset is described as "new old stock," I imagine it's several years old. And it's a cantilever brake frame. Categorically, race-oriented canti brake cx frames from several years ago almost always had 130mm rear spacing.

Last edited by well biked; 11-27-18 at 10:05 AM.
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Old 11-27-18, 10:52 AM
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That makes more sense ...

Correct its the 2014 model see here

I did find one review of it see here which says
"The RXC Pro Disc bike uses 135mm rear spacing, while the RXC and RXC Pro remain with 130mm rear spacing."

But that's for the 2013 model not the 2014 model.

Originally Posted by well biked
My guess is that it's intended for 130mm hubs. Yeah, you've measured the spacing at 131mm, so that does suggest 130 over 135, but my main reason for thinking 130 is that it's a cantilever brake cx frame. The canti brake element of that is the main clue, most rim brake cx bikes were designed for 130mm rear hubs.

Surly Cross Checks come with 132.5 for versatility (steel frame, quite easy to fudge 2.5mm either way when installing the rear wheel). But my shop sold a lot of canti-equipped cx bikes, and other than the Cross Check, I'm pretty sure all of them came with 130mm rear spacing (and this is from three different mainstream brands I can think of).

Some of the early disc-equipped cx bikes also came with 130mm rear spacing, and unfortunately, that became a PITA for the owners of those bikes within a year or two, because the common disc brake rear spacing for cx and road bikes quickly became 135 (the mtb standard at the time), and 142 for thru axle equipped bikes.

Also, I just read the description in the link you posted, the frameset is described as "new old stock," I imagine it's several years old. And it's a cantilever brake frame. Categorically, race-oriented canti brake cx frames from several years ago almost always had 130mm rear spacing.
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Old 11-27-18, 10:53 AM
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I don't see a bike problem ..132.5 is a good middle ground offering 135 and 130 ..




this forum does often show obsessive issues... from many..


*sigh*



....
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Old 11-29-18, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by fietsbob
I don't see a bike problem ..132.5 is a good middle ground offering 135 and 130...
But he wants to know (and I don't think anyone has specifically responded yet) if it's a bad idea to bend carbon fiber even a couple of mm's. Is it?
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Old 11-29-18, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by robertorolfo
But he wants to know (and I don't think anyone has specifically responded yet) if it's a bad idea to bend carbon fiber even a couple of mm's. Is it?
My thoughts on this: no, I've never heard of a carbon frame that was manufactured with the type of "versatile" dropout spacing that, say, the Surly Cross Check has (stated spacing of 132.5 for either 130 or 135 hubs), and I don't think it would be a good idea to try use a hub in a carbon frame that is more than a couple of millimeters different in regard to spacing. I don't think Raleigh was trying to create a "130 or 135" option with this frame. As stated already in the thread, production frames are rarely EXACTLY spaced to match the intended hub's OLD. Being within a millimeter or two is normal and is good enough.

As I said in my earlier post, this one really doesn't seem to be all that mysterious to me, I sold dozens of race-oriented CX bikes from a few different brands that had cantilever brakes over the last ten years or so, and I believe they all had 130mm rear spacing. The fact that the OP has measured the frame using two different methods and come up with 131mm spacing both times tells me that the frame is intended for 130mm rear hubs and that is what should be used with it. The fact that it is a carbon, race-oriented CX frameset designed for rim brakes certainly makes the measurment the OP got make sense to me.
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Old 11-29-18, 01:19 PM
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Re carbon frames and drop out widths- Carbon fiber frames are not like glass where they are so brittle that even a tiny bending causes them to crack and fail. My previous comment about production frames not being perfectly aligned includes carbon too. We see minor offness all the time and don't see any significant number of failures involving the mm or two of stay/blade width movement when a wheel is clamped down. Even the drop out to tube bonding, where the stress of non parallel drop out faces being clamped to an axle would focus, doesn't fail at any rate to consider this to be a concern.

Not that I am recommending one purposely uses un designed for dimensions, just that a small amount of tolerance does exist and can be accommodated for. Andy.
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Old 11-29-18, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by well biked
...As stated already in the thread, production frames are rarely EXACTLY spaced to match the intended hub's OLD. Being within a millimeter or two is normal and is good enough...
Oh, can we have a discussion about Chinese bike manufacturing? Just kidding... just kidding...

Originally Posted by Andrew R Stewart
Re carbon frames and drop out widths- Carbon fiber frames are not like glass where they are so brittle that even a tiny bending causes them to crack and fail. My previous comment about production frames not being perfectly aligned includes carbon too. We see minor offness all the time and don't see any significant number of failures involving the mm or two of stay/blade width movement when a wheel is clamped down. Even the drop out to tube bonding, where the stress of non parallel drop out faces being clamped to an axle would focus, doesn't fail at any rate to consider this to be a concern.

Not that I am recommending one purposely uses un designed for dimensions, just that a small amount of tolerance does exist and can be accommodated for. Andy.
OK, I assumed as much, but thanks for the comprehensive response. I know CF generally does have some small degree of ability to flex, I just wasn't sure what would happen if slightly flexed CF was then subject to significant forces in other directions. If this were really a big concern, however, I'm sure the tolerances would have to be much tighter than what you have mentioned.
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