Dean V

I would generally be happy with a 12t top, and am disappointed is virtually the complete absence of this choice in the Shimano range. Campag is a bit better in this regard.
Also if the big sprocket, lower chain tension is a thing why are we not seeing bigger chainrings? eg 56/42.

Fiery

Are you comparing Eddy as he was, or Eddy as he would have been if he'd had the same training Froome or Martin have?

Fox Farm

Exactly. I use a 50/34 compact crank because of the 10% and greater grades where I live. I run an 11/27 or 11/29 cassette. Sure, on the fast down hills, I can spin out and want a bigger gear but I make more use of the small gears and my knees are more happy.

Doge

Eddy as he was. We have some data on that. It still required doped/non-doped speculation. AS he tested positive 3 times, well...
The response was about how fast he was then (for gears) vs how fast things are now with modern bikes and modern training. My statement was that current juniors are as fast as Eddy was because I know some TT speeds. That relates to gears in someone saying Eddy would have used bigger gears if they had been available. They were available - from Campy. He, like current juniors ran a 52X14 most of the time.

If Eddy had the same training as today - he would have had to select a specialty. To me he looks to big boned to be a Froome type to climb with the best current climbers. Certainly the ITT but He looks more in the Sagan mold. But he'd also be drug tested more, and say those same 3 positive test showed up, he'd have been suspended 2 years, then maybe life - so he'd be out.
We don't know how much drugs played a part, but I think his big efforts were drugged.
So I'm not thinking I could compare him to a if-he-were-racing today comparison. But we have data on what he was.

Saying the best then is not as fast as kids now is not that off. Without mechanical help we can look at running. Numerous/the top HS runners now break the 4 min mile that no adult could until 1954. The kids now are fitter than the best in the world was then. Add the mechanical bike developments and it is not a big claim juniors are faster than the doped Eddy was.

noodle soup

I use a Shimano 12-25 cassette, but they also offer a 12-28. SRAM doesn't offer any 11speed road cassettes that start with a 12t cog.

Doge

I missed that 12-28 when ordering. Maybe they were out of stock. Maybe I should delete the thread now as I am less bugged - but I still want a 13-28 :-)

CS-R9100 CS-R9100

PepeM

I used the 11t on my ride yesterday a few times. While on my 38t ring.

redlude97

1x or cross chained small-small

PepeM

Small-small.

Am I not supposed to do that?

Maelochs

used to be, that was a forbidden activity. With modern drive trains, it doesn't matter.

So ... in the future, don't do that again in the past.

redlude97

mine grabs at the chain from the pins on the big ring so doesn't work with short chainstains, especialy with 135mm spacing

PepeM

It's a ten speed drivetrain. With downtube shifters. What do I do now?

Racing Dan

In that case get 10sp next time and save on consumables. 12-25 and 12-28 cassettes are the same as the 11sp cassettes except there is no 11t cog. I dont think I ever used 11t or 12t on my road bike.

Voodoo76

Run a 12-25 (52-36). I get much more use out of an 18 than I would the missing 11. Most of my rides are flat, and my natural cadence is high 95+ rpm. So the 1 tooth jumps from 19 down are appreciated.

Edo

I don't know if we need it, but most say that 11T generation is smoother than 10T.

Maelochs

Well, since the bike is already in the past .... don't ride it in the future?

Only in the present.

noodle soup

This is exactly why I use a 12-25 cassette (or 12-23 10 speed).

Doge

I'm trying to save on consumables - and be compatible with all the hand-me-down stuff I can re-purpose from kid. Like his 14-28 steel one piece 11 speed cassette. But - like I said, I wanted 13, and I think the Shimano shifts better.

Doge

You are mixing speeds/number of cogs (another good topic - do we need 12 cogs?) with minimum cog/tooth count.
There are no road 10T cassette setups from Campy, Shimano or SRAM. There are 10T MTB setups.

On a road bike a 10T setup would be so much chain tension and compression on carbon chain stays they'd turn to diamond.

cellery

Novel concept. Take that big front ring on your bike and make it smaller. I bet you will occasionally use that 11t if you go to a 46t font ring. And then you will cross chain less when you climb in the big ring.

stockae92

I have 53/39 crank, and I only used 11T if I cross chain from 39T or on the trainer.

I could live without it for sure. I much prefer 12T or 13T and with closer spacing all the way to 30T or 32T.

redlude97

i think he means x11 vs x10

Doge

I have a new 46/36 front and 11-32 rear. I have not installed/ridden yet. Maybe I'll be less bugged after I try it.

DPV

I ride 52/36 and 11-28... I always use my 11T. Then again, I live in a part of the world where every direction from my house has climbs (and subsequent descents). Also, I enjoy pedalling out of the saddle more than sitting.

KenR

I use the 18T cog often. Glad I switched. The only difference is I run a compact up front.