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First e-bike and can't decide on these two

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First e-bike and can't decide on these two

Old 04-23-19, 04:23 PM
  #1  
Nebell
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First e-bike and can't decide on these two

Hello

I love biking and do it on a daily basis (work-home), and last summer I did 75km per day and quite enjoyed it, although at the end of the day I was very exhausted. So I was thinking, maybe this summer I will try a longer commute over a longer period of days without getting exhausted

I'm not going for those expensive bikes with a brand on them. I want both style and performance. I believe that with careful analyzing, some of those $2000 Chinese bikes would be a great alternative. Some people will probably advise me against that, but the branded bikes I like are all $5000+ and I don't have the budget for that

What I can't decide between is this:

Bike #1:
1500W hub motor
Lithium batteries 48V15Ah + 48V30Ah
12 MOSFET 48V 26A Ī1 Controller, Includes cruise and Support Regenerative Function
About $2000

Bike #2:
1000W BBSHD Bafang motor (160 n.m torque)
Lithium battery 48V26.4Ah
30A controller
$1300 + $700 shipping

Both have fat tires and throttle.
I can't post links but you can search for bike #1 on aliexpress by entering this text Custom 26inch Fat tire ebike 1500W 48V45ah Li-ion snow electric mountain bicycle Hydraulic disc brake Double lithium battery
The second one is on alibaba, you can search by entering this text Lithium cell mid drive BBS HD 1000w electric bike (should be #2 on the search list).

#2 is quite cheaper and it has BBSHD motor, but I calculated shipping and it's at $700, so the end price will be similar to #1.
I did my research on the internet and I read that mid motors are the best for hills and especially that BBSHD. The area where I'm at is not very steep, but I plan for the future. While #2 has a hub motor, it's at 1500W which should be powerful enough for steeper hills?
I also like the looks of #1 better. And it also has 2 batteries ending with 45Ah which is quite a bit more than #2. And having 150+km range sounds very appealing to me. I could easily bike those 150km, find a hotel, sleep and charge the batteries and continue next 150km, repeat.
Also, #2 includes getting through Alibabas tedious process. They are geared towards companies, not individuals (even though it's not impossible for individuals to buy there).

So, what do you guys suggest?
Thanks in advance!
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Old 04-23-19, 05:25 PM
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a 48V 26AH battery pack is going to be massively heavy. and so are 1000W hub motors, never mind 1500 watt. I built a ebike with a 1000W hub motor and a 48V 18AH battery, and it has a nasty habit of overheating both the motor and electronic controller if I actually use that level of power. most of the time, I find that if I'm pedaling lightly, its using no more than 200-300 watts while I'm cruising at 20-ish MPH.

That 48V 18AH battery weighs 12 lbs, which is half the weight of light weight hybrid bike, the 1000W hub motor has to weigh at least that much... I just weighed it, the whole thing weighs 63 lbs now. eeeeeeek. if anything goes wrong and you have to pedal that any distance, you're gonna really hate it.

~300 watts and light pedaling in a medium high gear carries my 225 lb carcass up a 8% grade at 10-15 MPH on this 60 lb beheamoth.



a mostly out of shape human can probably sustain 100 watts, so adding 300W to that is quadruple the power.



ok, googled your first bike
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Cust...950009297.html

um, that hub is half the size of my 1000w, it looks like a 500W, not 1500W. that rear rack battery is the same size as my 18AH, I seriously doubt its 30AH. that second battery on the seat tube looks like a 48V 10AH. And, wow. 37 kg, that's 80 lbs. that's a effin' HEAVY bike.
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Old 04-23-19, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by pierce View Post
a 48V 26AH battery pack is going to be massively heavy. and so are 1000W hub motors, never mind 1500 watt. I built a ebike with a 1000W hub motor and a 48V 18AH battery, and it has a nasty habit of overheating both the motor and electronic controller if I actually use that level of power. most of the time, I find that if I'm pedaling lightly, its using no more than 200-300 watts while I'm cruising at 20-ish MPH.

That 48V 18AH battery weighs 12 lbs, which is half the weight of light weight hybrid bike, the 1000W hub motor has to weigh at least that much... I just weighed it, the whole thing weighs 63 lbs now. eeeeeeek. if anything goes wrong and you have to pedal that any distance, you're gonna really hate it.

~300 watts and light pedaling in a medium high gear carries my 225 lb carcass up a 8% grade at 10-15 MPH on this 60 lb beheamoth.



a mostly out of shape human can probably sustain 100 watts, so adding 300W to that is quadruple the power.



ok, googled your first bike
(edit, still can't post urls)

um, that hub is half the size of my 1000w, it looks like a 500W, not 1500W. that rear rack battery is the same size as my 18AH, I seriously doubt its 30AH. that second battery on the seat tube looks like a 48V 10AH. And, wow. 37 kg, that's 80 lbs. that's a effin' HEAVY bike.
Hey Pierce, thanks for the reply
The advertised 30Ah battery is probably the one in the middle as you can choose between two bikes and the largest battery (in specs) appears in the middle if you click on the second option. The back one is most likely 15Ah.
Is the middle battery really 30Ah? I don't know. I know pretty much nothing about electric vehicles.
But the seller has been online for 5 years and has rather good feedback and I'd be surprised if he/she's lying to people.

I don't mind heavy stuff. I have hauled my airboard which is about 15kg on my back for a couple of hours after its battery died. It's not something I enjoyed
Sure if something happens I'll have to walk with it (if one battery dies I have the second one).
I will also load some gear on it, mostly camera equipment. But it could add another 10kgs.
So I need something stable. I'm not a big guy (73kgs) but with a backpack and camera equipment loaded on the bike, the total load on it would be around 100kg.

I hear your warning. This is why I'm here, to hear experienced people's opinions.

I'm still hesitant to order that bike. If you're right and it's 500w and two batteries for around 25Ah, then I would be better off buying a similar bike for about half the price.
But if it really is a 1500W 45Ah bike, then cool.
If it does somewhere in the forest, well, I'll just call someone to pick me and the bike up
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Old 04-23-19, 06:49 PM
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another point... If you ever plan to carry your bike on a rack on a vehicle... even the most heavy duty bike racks are max 65 lbs each bike, many are less than that. you'd practically need a motorcycle rack to carry this thing.
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Old 04-23-19, 08:48 PM
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Just a couple considerations. Real world usage: divide watt hours by 20. That will give you a very realistic range. Weight matters because heavier bikes use more power faster. Unless you can do electric work on your bike yourself, consider getting something with a warranty that will actually be fulfilled by a reputable vendor and one where you aren't shipping a heavy bike back to the manufacturer. You might save some money now, but it could cost you dearly later. Of course, if you can rip apart battery packs, solder, and have all kinds of electric tools, then no problem. Personally, based on your stated needs, I would suggest you consider a good cargo bike and fit a quality electric kit to it.
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Old 04-23-19, 10:18 PM
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If you're used to riding 75 km per day, it must be on a relatively light road bike. Seems like a heavy fat bike is the opposite direction for longer distance travel. Assuming SE is Sweden; look at Stromer and build a similar bike which will be possible for much less with a DIY conversion.
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Old 04-23-19, 11:41 PM
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Originally Posted by 2old View Post
If you're used to riding 75 km per day, it must be on a relatively light road bike. Seems like a heavy fat bike is the opposite direction for longer distance travel. Assuming SE is Sweden; look at Stromer and build a similar bike which will be possible for much less with a DIY conversion.
I'm not used to it. That was a few times back in summer 2018.

Originally Posted by linberl View Post
Just a couple considerations. Real world usage: divide watt hours by 20. That will give you a very realistic range. Weight matters because heavier bikes use more power faster. Unless you can do electric work on your bike yourself, consider getting something with a warranty that will actually be fulfilled by a reputable vendor and one where you aren't shipping a heavy bike back to the manufacturer. You might save some money now, but it could cost you dearly later. Of course, if you can rip apart battery packs, solder, and have all kinds of electric tools, then no problem. Personally, based on your stated needs, I would suggest you consider a good cargo bike and fit a quality electric kit to it.
I'm pretty sure that the vendor would either send me a new part or refund me.
I have bought a lot, a lot of stuff from both Aliexpress and Ebay and this is how it usually went.

Correct I'm from Sweden. And talking about Swedish design, what do you guys think about Stark bikes?
I still can't post links, but I found a nice bike on Ebay.co.uk
Search for Stark Drive City Fat Tire Folding Electric Bike 36V 500W EU 45kph Hidden 17AH
No throttle on that one though. But I'm somewhat fit considering I bike about 5km each work day and am active besides that. But it would be nice to sometimes just go lazy mode.
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Old 05-01-19, 11:28 PM
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What do I suggest? Going to a real bicycle dealer and getting a quality bike with a warranty!

BTW- I am a dealer, but I'm different. I can actually fix the cheap bikes people bring in.

-SP
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Old 05-05-19, 02:05 PM
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I opted for the bike 1 (link to it is in the second post).

It's heavy, it has a big battery and it does have rear hub motor and I was assured that it's a 1500w motor (and my guess after looking at the seller's other offerings, is a 75 torque motor). Also, some other things like hydraulic disc brakes which are usually in more expensive bikes and regen function.
I decided also based on the looks of the bike and that rear hub motors tend to have that "push" feeling just like cars with rear-wheel drive (which I own and love driving). My area does not have steep hills at all for hundreds of kilometers so I'm not that worried about overheating and Sweden doesn't have very hot and long summers.

In computers, if you buy a power supply that is rated at 1000W, you get the best effectiveness at 50%, which is 500W. Does this apply to motors as well? My guess is that a 1500w rated motors wouldn't overheat at 500W as much as a 500W motor would overheat at 500W, because it's rated for higher wattage. Generally speaking, I'm pretty sure motor quality makes a difference.

Last edited by Nebell; 05-05-19 at 02:12 PM.
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Old 05-05-19, 06:46 PM
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If thereís is anything Iíve learned is middrive middrive middrive.Forget hub motors Iíll never go back to a hub motor.
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