Pedals - flat pedals for road bike
#76
Blamester
What is the benefit of being clipped in?
Stop your feet from slipping?
Faster?
Your feet cannot move?
I have been cycling for over forty and I can't see a benefit for a regular cyclist.
I wear whatever shoes I like and I can walk if I want too.
I can position my feet where I like and where it suits for my pedal speed.
No freezing feet.
Cycling shoes are also idiotic. Stiff as possible. I think cycling shoes should be supple just like my feet are.
I regular ride a 100k solo and fast.
Stop your feet from slipping?
Faster?
Your feet cannot move?
I have been cycling for over forty and I can't see a benefit for a regular cyclist.
I wear whatever shoes I like and I can walk if I want too.
I can position my feet where I like and where it suits for my pedal speed.
No freezing feet.
Cycling shoes are also idiotic. Stiff as possible. I think cycling shoes should be supple just like my feet are.
I regular ride a 100k solo and fast.
#77
Senior Member
I would only consider flat pedals (probably mixed flat on one side and clipless on the other) if you're mostly planning to use the bike with "normal" clothes and shoes. In which case, a road bike isn't the best tool for the job IMHO.
I'd just buy Shimano M520, as they are really cheap and durable. Probably not ideal if you're weight-obssesed or want to use SPD-SL though (I like being able to walk, so SL's are a no no).
I'd just buy Shimano M520, as they are really cheap and durable. Probably not ideal if you're weight-obssesed or want to use SPD-SL though (I like being able to walk, so SL's are a no no).
#78
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If you want to pedal in the most efficient manner - pedaling full circles, including pulling back at 6 and pushing forwards at 12 - it is easier to do that when your feet are attached to the pedals and you dont have to exert any force or effort to maintain contact between the foot and the pedals - especially at higher efforts and when your legs are a little tired, and your form isnt perfect.
#79
Blamester
If you want to pedal in the most efficient manner - pedaling full circles, including pulling back at 6 and pushing forwards at 12 - it is easier to do that when your feet are attached to the pedals and you dont have to exert any force or effort to maintain contact between the foot and the pedals - especially at higher efforts and when your legs are a little tired, and your form isnt perfect.
Pushing down on the pedal with good timing is what it is about.
There is no effort involved in keeping your foot on the pedals. The foot pushes down on pedal not across it.
Tiredness reduces your form not the pedals.
For a regular cyclist there is no benefit.
When was the last time you cycled forty or fifty k in soft thin soled runners?
I have done both.
Toeclips are probably the best but everyone thinks that's somehow archaic when it does exactly the same thing.
Easy to use and cheap. Wear any shoes you like.
We have been conned
Last edited by blamester; 05-26-20 at 01:32 PM.
#80
Senior Member
No matter if you are clipped in or not, the power to propel the bike at a certain speed is the same. The EXACT same. There is NO free lunch. You Might be able to exert more torque by using both legs at the same time being clipped in, tho. Still, at a red light, flats are usually faster as there is no clipping out and in. And you are less likely to slip off of the pedals (Not likely anyway with a good flat pedal, but hey!)
#81
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Just not true.
Pushing down on the pedal with good timing is what it is about.
There is no effort involved in keeping your foot on the pedals. The foot pushes down on pedal not across it.
Tiredness reduces your form not the pedals.
For a regular cyclist there is no benefit.
When was the last time you cycled forty or fifty k in soft thin soled runners?
I have done both.
Toeclips are probably the best but everyone thinks that's somehow archaic when it does exactly the same thing.
Easy to use and cheap. Wear any shoes you like.
You have been conned
Pushing down on the pedal with good timing is what it is about.
There is no effort involved in keeping your foot on the pedals. The foot pushes down on pedal not across it.
Tiredness reduces your form not the pedals.
For a regular cyclist there is no benefit.
When was the last time you cycled forty or fifty k in soft thin soled runners?
I have done both.
Toeclips are probably the best but everyone thinks that's somehow archaic when it does exactly the same thing.
Easy to use and cheap. Wear any shoes you like.
You have been conned
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#82
Blamester
I've been cycling for forty years and I do a hundred miles a week at least. Never mind short trips to the shops or town.
120k fast group rides. I'm on my bike every day in the drops.
I have tried both ways and I know which is best for me.
And sorry I didn't mean to write you have been conned. I meant to write we have been conned. And we have been on a lot of bike stuff.
I will edit that post.
120k fast group rides. I'm on my bike every day in the drops.
I have tried both ways and I know which is best for me.
And sorry I didn't mean to write you have been conned. I meant to write we have been conned. And we have been on a lot of bike stuff.
I will edit that post.
#83
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Just not true.
Pushing down on the pedal with good timing is what it is about.
There is no effort involved in keeping your foot on the pedals. The foot pushes down on pedal not across it.
Tiredness reduces your form not the pedals.
For a regular cyclist there is no benefit.
When was the last time you cycled forty or fifty k in soft thin soled runners?
I have done both.
Toeclips are probably the best but everyone thinks that's somehow archaic when it does exactly the same thing.
Easy to use and cheap. Wear any shoes you like.
We have been conned
Pushing down on the pedal with good timing is what it is about.
There is no effort involved in keeping your foot on the pedals. The foot pushes down on pedal not across it.
Tiredness reduces your form not the pedals.
For a regular cyclist there is no benefit.
When was the last time you cycled forty or fifty k in soft thin soled runners?
I have done both.
Toeclips are probably the best but everyone thinks that's somehow archaic when it does exactly the same thing.
Easy to use and cheap. Wear any shoes you like.
We have been conned
If they work better for you, that's cool. I am not really trying to convert you.
#84
Senior Member
I bought some Crankbrothers Doubleshot 3s last month, these are a dual-sided option with flats on one side and clipped on the other.
I love 'em, they clip in / out very smoothly, and the platform side has the adjustable-height pins you can raise or lower according to what kind of sole your shoe has, etc.
They were on sale (selected colors) for about $75 on Competitive Cyclist, also available in several other colors at Crankbrothers site (at full price).
I love 'em, they clip in / out very smoothly, and the platform side has the adjustable-height pins you can raise or lower according to what kind of sole your shoe has, etc.
They were on sale (selected colors) for about $75 on Competitive Cyclist, also available in several other colors at Crankbrothers site (at full price).
#85
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I've ridden platforms and clipless on my old school steel road bike, and my early '90s Trek OCLV for a week or two before settling on SPL-SL rather than Look Delta pedals.
Checking my ride data, no significant differences in speed. Some of my fastest Strava segments were set with platform pedals on those bikes, while I was wearing Merrell shoes (not nearly as stiff soled as Five Ten). Those include flat terrain, rollers, climbs and downhill segments.
But I tend to have a choppy cadence and mash more than spin. That might matter.
Back in the 1970s, when men were etc and blahblahblah, I used Detto Pietros and toe clips, strapped in and snugged down. Frankly, it was awful. The cleats were way too far forward for my feet, on the balls of the feet per the Conventional Wisdom of that era. I had arch spasms, shin splints, etc. I swore off foot retention after several years of that mess. But it was mostly a bike fit problem (nobody seemed to know anything about bike fit back then, other than what they memorized from Saint Eddy) and my physiology, not a knock against foot retention in general.
When I resumed cycling in 2015 I got oversized platform pedals and whatever walking shoes I already had and was perfectly happy for a couple of years.
Until I got my first road bike in 30+ years in 2017. Then the old competitive streak flared up again.
Main reason I eventually switched to clipless on the road bikes was for better support for my feet. My feet are terrible, bony with high arches. Since I was a kid I've had problems with painful cramps in my arches and legs from running or cycling. Boot camp was miserable with those cheap gym shoes -- I ran better with boots, a trick I learned from watching Muhammad Ali train. He jogged in high top military boots, including running backward. Worked for me as well, just because of the stiffer soles and better arch support.
I might be very slightly more consistent over distance with clipless. Occasionally when I feel spasms coming on in my arches, calves or quads, I'll switch to a lighter gear, spin at 90-100 rpm (I'm usually around 60-75 rpm), consciously pulling up on the pedals until the spasms fade. Worked great the other day when I was chasing some hill climb PRs. Seemed to conserve a little energy. But it's only maybe a 1/2 mph difference in average speed over 20-40 miles. I mean, I'll take it. But it's not a huge difference.
Last year I got a pair of iSSi Thump pedals for my favorite hybrid. Love 'em. I'm seriously considering switching my old school steel road bike to similarly wide but lighter weight flat pedals and retiring the old Look Deltas. Occasionally I ride that road bike toward the city, and might use the MUP for a mile or so as a shortcut. I dislike foot retention in traffic (which includes the MUP, since I always defer to the pedestrians). It's just easier to dab a foot when I don't need to unclip or yank free of toe clips and cages.
And if we resume casual group rides after the 'rona virus pandemic settles, I prefer flat pedals since we do some walking, or stops at pubs or for coffee. I like Look Delta, Keo and Shimano SPD-SL for riding, but they suck for walking more than a few feet. It's like walking in high heels designed by Salvador Dali. Nobody takes me seriously when I clippityclipclop on my toes up to the bar for a manly man's ginger ale or kombucha. I'm sure the Lycra and Spandex have nothing to do with it. It's the shoes.
But I'll stick with clipless for my other road bikes. As I said, I don't see any data showing I'm significantly faster with clipless. But it does help minimize my problems with arch and leg cramps. That's good enough.
Checking my ride data, no significant differences in speed. Some of my fastest Strava segments were set with platform pedals on those bikes, while I was wearing Merrell shoes (not nearly as stiff soled as Five Ten). Those include flat terrain, rollers, climbs and downhill segments.
But I tend to have a choppy cadence and mash more than spin. That might matter.
Back in the 1970s, when men were etc and blahblahblah, I used Detto Pietros and toe clips, strapped in and snugged down. Frankly, it was awful. The cleats were way too far forward for my feet, on the balls of the feet per the Conventional Wisdom of that era. I had arch spasms, shin splints, etc. I swore off foot retention after several years of that mess. But it was mostly a bike fit problem (nobody seemed to know anything about bike fit back then, other than what they memorized from Saint Eddy) and my physiology, not a knock against foot retention in general.
When I resumed cycling in 2015 I got oversized platform pedals and whatever walking shoes I already had and was perfectly happy for a couple of years.
Until I got my first road bike in 30+ years in 2017. Then the old competitive streak flared up again.
Main reason I eventually switched to clipless on the road bikes was for better support for my feet. My feet are terrible, bony with high arches. Since I was a kid I've had problems with painful cramps in my arches and legs from running or cycling. Boot camp was miserable with those cheap gym shoes -- I ran better with boots, a trick I learned from watching Muhammad Ali train. He jogged in high top military boots, including running backward. Worked for me as well, just because of the stiffer soles and better arch support.
I might be very slightly more consistent over distance with clipless. Occasionally when I feel spasms coming on in my arches, calves or quads, I'll switch to a lighter gear, spin at 90-100 rpm (I'm usually around 60-75 rpm), consciously pulling up on the pedals until the spasms fade. Worked great the other day when I was chasing some hill climb PRs. Seemed to conserve a little energy. But it's only maybe a 1/2 mph difference in average speed over 20-40 miles. I mean, I'll take it. But it's not a huge difference.
Last year I got a pair of iSSi Thump pedals for my favorite hybrid. Love 'em. I'm seriously considering switching my old school steel road bike to similarly wide but lighter weight flat pedals and retiring the old Look Deltas. Occasionally I ride that road bike toward the city, and might use the MUP for a mile or so as a shortcut. I dislike foot retention in traffic (which includes the MUP, since I always defer to the pedestrians). It's just easier to dab a foot when I don't need to unclip or yank free of toe clips and cages.
And if we resume casual group rides after the 'rona virus pandemic settles, I prefer flat pedals since we do some walking, or stops at pubs or for coffee. I like Look Delta, Keo and Shimano SPD-SL for riding, but they suck for walking more than a few feet. It's like walking in high heels designed by Salvador Dali. Nobody takes me seriously when I clippityclipclop on my toes up to the bar for a manly man's ginger ale or kombucha. I'm sure the Lycra and Spandex have nothing to do with it. It's the shoes.
But I'll stick with clipless for my other road bikes. As I said, I don't see any data showing I'm significantly faster with clipless. But it does help minimize my problems with arch and leg cramps. That's good enough.
#86
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i have similar toe clips I picked up years ago but in plastic and go farther back over the toe. Still use them depending on bike, even on the road bike. Foot comes out easily in emergency, can pedal with lifting stroke, etc. I like my Speedplays on the road bike, except with a bad knee on one leg, stiff foot on the other. Now I am running SPD on the CAAD 9 using Shimano Mtb shoes and much prefer the cleat recessed.
But then I am no longer young, don’t do group rides, compete against myself, only ride up to 50 miles a session and don’t care what others think. Ride in what you like.
But then I am no longer young, don’t do group rides, compete against myself, only ride up to 50 miles a session and don’t care what others think. Ride in what you like.
i have no need to compete, just need to shut up and ride with no complications. also don't care much about tires, derailleurs, brakes, frame material, chain oil, well not toooo much..........but it's fun reading about people who are worried about such things. it also amazes me how some can tell the difference in frame metal, etc as if bicycles are like sport cars. i mostly wanna know if your bicycle fits, seat height, air in tires.
my guess is that newbies should be staying away from clipless pedals, let them drift naturally over to them. most don't need them anyway, they are nice i spose, but so is a kick stand on a bicycle.
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nice metal clips, best of all bicycle worlds. i use a cheap pair of plastic clips from nashbar and very tough for years, doesn't wanna break. thanks for the picture, thought i would have to drum one up because i know these kinds of clips would not be popular here. but if your into hassle free bicycling, then this is smooth city.
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I agree. Folks need to develop a little skill and comfort on the bike. Until they can consistently stay upright they are just as well off with flats. Progress to clipless as their skills progress. Some never develop that level of control and confidence. Better for them to stay with flats.
#89
Senior Member
I like my FUNN Mambas. They are flat on one side & cleated on the other. I think they make some models w/o cleats entirely. I think they are considered mountain bike pedals but I like them on my road bike. I use them w smooth, flat soled, cleated, MTB shoes w recessed cleats so either side works for me depending on conditions. on my hybrid & mountain bike I use mini cages aka 1/2 cages. good luck w/ your choices!
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I agree. Folks need to develop a little skill and comfort on the bike. Until they can consistently stay upright they are just as well off with flats. Progress to clipless as their skills progress. Some never develop that level of control and confidence. Better for them to stay with flats.
I don’t think clipless really takes much of a learning curve. Most are comfortable with them after a few rides and virtually all of them prefer clipless once they make the switch. In MTB, it has a lot to do with stability on the downhills, as well. For road, I find stiff shoes and clipless pedals to be much more comfortable and efficient. It’s not the most important thing in the world for a beginner, obviously.
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#91
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Really, any of the mountain bike style flat pedals with pins are going to work fine. I put some VP-001 on my wife's bike and she likes them a lot. The pins (really little grub screws) can tear up the bottom of your shoes, but they do provide a nice secure connection to the pedals.
I know this is the road forum and the majority of the people here ride clipless pedals and love them (myself included), but they aren't really necessary. A grippy flat pedal provides most of the performance of a clipless system, and you don't have to buy new shoes, either
If you decide to go clipless in the future, well then you can just put your nice flat pedals on your hybrid.
Yes, you will have less clearance when leaning the bike over, but like MinnMan said above, I doubt you will have any issues. You have to get to some pretty extreme lean angles to start having to worry about pedal strike.
I know this is the road forum and the majority of the people here ride clipless pedals and love them (myself included), but they aren't really necessary. A grippy flat pedal provides most of the performance of a clipless system, and you don't have to buy new shoes, either
If you decide to go clipless in the future, well then you can just put your nice flat pedals on your hybrid.
Yes, you will have less clearance when leaning the bike over, but like MinnMan said above, I doubt you will have any issues. You have to get to some pretty extreme lean angles to start having to worry about pedal strike.
I have them on two of my bikes, and I love them.
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#92
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GIRO Chamber I’ll add a photo later. I wish they were grey for when I wear them w shorts. I had another brand/model but I had a hot spot I couldn’t eliminate. these have a nice wide toe box not as pointy as the last pair. got them on Amazon so I can post a link but I think I got them on clearance cuz they were discontinued. sometimes that’s a bad sign but they had my size & the reviews were good enough for me. they have laces & a Velcro strap. not sure if the purpose of the strap but I use it to hold the laces from flying into the bike but I don’t need it for that. they are vented so not a great shoe for cold rain unless you cover them &/or use toe warmers, etc
got them 4/22/19 size 48 for $57.78 looks like they still have some (only size 5 & 6.5 tho) (5.5 in bright blue?)
got them 4/22/19 size 48 for $57.78 looks like they still have some (only size 5 & 6.5 tho) (5.5 in bright blue?)
Last edited by rumrunn6; 05-29-20 at 06:37 AM.
#93
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I don't think you'll get a lot of advice about platform pedals here because they're not very common in road. Its ok to use them, but it's not a subject this forum probably has a great deal of knowledge in.
Anyway, when you turn, you want your pedals at 6 and 12 o'clock, for the reason you mentioned. No matter what kind you use, having the pedal hit in a turn could be bad.
Anyway, when you turn, you want your pedals at 6 and 12 o'clock, for the reason you mentioned. No matter what kind you use, having the pedal hit in a turn could be bad.
https://www.rockbrosusa.com/pedals
Last edited by joesch; 05-29-20 at 06:15 AM.
#94
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For those who are convinced that clipless pedals make a huge difference, this will be worth a few minutes of your time.
There are a lot of opinions on clipless out there and not a lot of testing to support beliefs one way or another.
There are a lot of opinions on clipless out there and not a lot of testing to support beliefs one way or another.
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For those who are convinced that clipless pedals make a huge difference, this will be worth a few minutes of your time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNedIJBZpgM
There are a lot of opinions on clipless out there and not a lot of testing to support beliefs one way or another.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNedIJBZpgM
There are a lot of opinions on clipless out there and not a lot of testing to support beliefs one way or another.
#96
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If you're used to clipless, flat pedals are a great workout for the glutes - all the ass-clenching sketchiness will firm up your bottom right quick.
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Right now I'm using flats on the new mountain bike, but as soon as the Sidis arrive, I'm going to SPD pedals. I couldn't imagine using them on a road bike.
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I bought some of those Shimano dual-sided SPD/flat pedals for the gravel bike, which is also used for grocery/liquor store runs - I figured that it'd be nice to be able to hop on with whatever footwear I had on. I did that a couple times annnnd.... nope. I'll take the 30 seconds to throw on my SPD shoes, thanks.
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I see your one old video and raise you 2 more recent ones.
https://youtu.be/AkMCYYNTWUY
https://youtu.be/CVUnngkENeA
https://youtu.be/AkMCYYNTWUY
https://youtu.be/CVUnngkENeA
Thanks for sharing those. Some of it surprising, like up to a 30% gain in sprint. It would have been interesting to have found riders who were accustomed to riding flats and put them in clipless to see how they do. It stands to reason that you going to do best doing things the way you always do them. My road bike has clipless. All of my others used to. One of the stated concerns many posters here voiced was that they were worried about their foot slipping off the pedal. I have ridden extensively with clipless and flats and have had far more clipless related issues than flats related issues. I am not exactly a model of grace so take that for whatever that is worth!
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I see your one old video and raise you 2 more recent ones.
https://youtu.be/AkMCYYNTWUY
https://youtu.be/CVUnngkENeA
https://youtu.be/AkMCYYNTWUY
https://youtu.be/CVUnngkENeA
That second video is utterly useless, as they are using a TERRIBLE shoes pedals for the flats. I really can't wrap my head around why they did that. What a waste of bandwidth.
Last edited by Kapusta; 05-29-20 at 03:45 PM.