Fast REchargeable battery pack
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: QC Canada
Posts: 1,972
Bikes: Custom built LHT & Troll
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 846 Post(s)
Liked 149 Times
in
106 Posts
Fast REchargeable battery pack
My battery bank (16Ah) takes several hours to recharge.
Something can be done? (Would probably require a smart regulator)
[edit]
The critical factor is how many Wh/h a bank can absorb. It looks like Qualcomm Quick Charge provides the best options. Anker sells a Power Core that can recharge at 27W, almost three times as fast as a typical bank.
Unfortunately it is huge (26Ah), possibly in order to spread the load across several batteries.
But it's a step in a promising direction.
Something can be done? (Would probably require a smart regulator)
[edit]
The critical factor is how many Wh/h a bank can absorb. It looks like Qualcomm Quick Charge provides the best options. Anker sells a Power Core that can recharge at 27W, almost three times as fast as a typical bank.
Unfortunately it is huge (26Ah), possibly in order to spread the load across several batteries.
But it's a step in a promising direction.
Last edited by gauvins; 08-14-19 at 06:28 AM.
#2
Full Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Seattle
Posts: 327
Bikes: Litespeed, O'Brien, Specialized, Fuji
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 15 Times
in
9 Posts
What model battery pack is this, and how do you charge it now?
Very generally speaking, faster charging decreases the life of rechargeable cells, and can make detection of a full charge more difficult. This can be an increased fire hazard.
Very generally speaking, faster charging decreases the life of rechargeable cells, and can make detection of a full charge more difficult. This can be an increased fire hazard.
#3
Non omnino gravis
I doubt the cells could handle a charge rate higher than 4 or 5 amps, meaning as the best case it's going to take 3.5 to 4 hours to charge that battery from dead to full. And as mentioned, charging at high rates decreases cell life. Unless they are egregiously expensive, I would look into having two packs and just cycling them.
Now if you have a charger that's only putting out like 1 or 2 amps, yeah, you can absolutely charge it faster. The chemistry of the battery is going to determine what charger you need. Most of the DC-powered R/C chargers can handle all cell types, and several sub-$100 chargers will go up to 10A charge rates.
Now if you have a charger that's only putting out like 1 or 2 amps, yeah, you can absolutely charge it faster. The chemistry of the battery is going to determine what charger you need. Most of the DC-powered R/C chargers can handle all cell types, and several sub-$100 chargers will go up to 10A charge rates.
#4
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: QC Canada
Posts: 1,972
Bikes: Custom built LHT & Troll
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 846 Post(s)
Liked 149 Times
in
106 Posts
My current bank is a 16A (62Wh) RavPower. Rated 5V/2A input (as is usual).
Is it possible to accelerate the process? How?
Is it possible to accelerate the process? How?
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Down Under
Posts: 1,936
Bikes: A steel framed 26" off road tourer from a manufacturer who thinks they are cool. Giant Anthem. Trek 720 Multiroad pub bike. 10 kids bikes all under 20". Assorted waifs and unfinished projects.
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1188 Post(s)
Liked 1,154 Times
in
640 Posts
Next step is to get a power bank with a USB C input, especially ones with "Power Delivery" and use a minimum 18W USB C power pack. That will halve the charge time roughly.
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 11,214
Bikes: 1961 Ideor, 1966 Perfekt 3 Speed AB Hub, 1994 Bridgestone MB-6, 2006 Airnimal Joey, 2009 Thorn Sherpa, 2013 Thorn Nomad MkII, 2015 VO Pass Hunter, 2017 Lynskey Backroad, 2017 Raleigh Gran Prix, 1980s Bianchi Mixte on a trainer. Others are now gone.
Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3462 Post(s)
Liked 1,468 Times
in
1,145 Posts
If it is 62 watt hours, that is a pretty big power bank. I can't imagine you would be able to push a lot of current through the electronics in that one unit for charging regardless of how big your USB supply is.
If you had two power banks, you probably could cut your charging time in half by having separate chargers for each.
If I recall correctly, you used to use a Forumslager (spell?) for bike touring. My big power bank that I bought for bike touring is 44 watt hours. During a bike tour I assume that on average my Sinewave Revolution puts out 2 watts, thus from empty to full would take 22 hours of rolling time. I learned to be patient.
If you had two power banks, you probably could cut your charging time in half by having separate chargers for each.
If I recall correctly, you used to use a Forumslager (spell?) for bike touring. My big power bank that I bought for bike touring is 44 watt hours. During a bike tour I assume that on average my Sinewave Revolution puts out 2 watts, thus from empty to full would take 22 hours of rolling time. I learned to be patient.
#7
Non omnino gravis
My mistake, I thought this was about batteries, not a USB battery pack. A USB pack is going to charge at 1.5 to 2.0 amps, limited (as mentioned above) by the internal circuitry. There is no way to speed it up, nor should you try.
What you should do is get a USB ammeter to find out what rate the pack is actually charging at, so you can try different chargers and cables to get as close to 2A as possible.
What you should do is get a USB ammeter to find out what rate the pack is actually charging at, so you can try different chargers and cables to get as close to 2A as possible.
#8
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: QC Canada
Posts: 1,972
Bikes: Custom built LHT & Troll
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 846 Post(s)
Liked 149 Times
in
106 Posts
Well... Look at this bank. Looks like it could take 4A (see 4th picture).
Hmmm... the forumslader. I've removed it. Issue with the steerer cap cables. Haven't long toured since and no out-of-the-way plans. So it lays somewhere in a drawer.
I will try to use a smartwatch and see how it goes. Looks like it does its thing on 100mAh per day. At least one order of magnitude better than phones or computer heads. Game changer wrt power management.
Still months away. Several options to consider
Hmmm... the forumslader. I've removed it. Issue with the steerer cap cables. Haven't long toured since and no out-of-the-way plans. So it lays somewhere in a drawer.
I will try to use a smartwatch and see how it goes. Looks like it does its thing on 100mAh per day. At least one order of magnitude better than phones or computer heads. Game changer wrt power management.
Still months away. Several options to consider
#9
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 11,214
Bikes: 1961 Ideor, 1966 Perfekt 3 Speed AB Hub, 1994 Bridgestone MB-6, 2006 Airnimal Joey, 2009 Thorn Sherpa, 2013 Thorn Nomad MkII, 2015 VO Pass Hunter, 2017 Lynskey Backroad, 2017 Raleigh Gran Prix, 1980s Bianchi Mixte on a trainer. Others are now gone.
Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3462 Post(s)
Liked 1,468 Times
in
1,145 Posts
My last bike tour, I planned to be fully self sufficient on electrics from my dynohub and Sinewave Revolution USB charger that was powered by the dynohub. Before the trip I had estimated all my power needs. And I had checked all my cables to make sure that I did not have any high resistance cables.
After about two and a half weeks of touring, my powerbank was nearly empty, some of my camera batteries were nearly depleted and my phone was low. So much for the self sufficiency plan.
While sitting in a laundry room at a campground I started to plug stuff in to an outlet to get charged up. And I had brought an ammeter with me. And I discovered that I had a high resistance cable along that I did not discover before the trip, that cable was limiting how much power was going into my power bank. Changed to a different cable that I had brought as a spare, that solved all my problems. I did not need to plug into an outlet for the next two weeks and finished my trip with a power bank nearly full, camera batteries charged up, taillight spare batteries charged up, GPS charged, and phone charged up.
Shows how one bad cable can really mess up your plans.
#10
aka Tom Reingold
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New York, NY, and High Falls, NY, USA
Posts: 40,509
Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem
Mentioned: 511 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7353 Post(s)
Liked 2,481 Times
in
1,440 Posts
Yes, and cables go bad, so bring spares.
__________________
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 11,214
Bikes: 1961 Ideor, 1966 Perfekt 3 Speed AB Hub, 1994 Bridgestone MB-6, 2006 Airnimal Joey, 2009 Thorn Sherpa, 2013 Thorn Nomad MkII, 2015 VO Pass Hunter, 2017 Lynskey Backroad, 2017 Raleigh Gran Prix, 1980s Bianchi Mixte on a trainer. Others are now gone.
Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3462 Post(s)
Liked 1,468 Times
in
1,145 Posts
Well... Look at this bank. Looks like it could take 4A (see 4th picture).
...
...
But if you get it, you will have two power banks so your worst case scenario would be that you could charge up both of them at the same time with two chargers, doubling how fast you can obtain power. And if the new one charges faster, that is even better.
#12
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 11,214
Bikes: 1961 Ideor, 1966 Perfekt 3 Speed AB Hub, 1994 Bridgestone MB-6, 2006 Airnimal Joey, 2009 Thorn Sherpa, 2013 Thorn Nomad MkII, 2015 VO Pass Hunter, 2017 Lynskey Backroad, 2017 Raleigh Gran Prix, 1980s Bianchi Mixte on a trainer. Others are now gone.
Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3462 Post(s)
Liked 1,468 Times
in
1,145 Posts
My rainy month touring in Iceland, several cables died from corrosion at the plugs, as did one of my two taillights. So, yes, on a bike tour I bring spare cables. And I always bring two taillights.
Photo below is from my Canadian Maritimes trip two months ago, lots of damp days.
Photo below is from my Canadian Maritimes trip two months ago, lots of damp days.
#13
Full Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 235
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 10 Times
in
10 Posts
You can go with a power bank that uses a Quick Charge, USB-C or some other input that needs a special charger to charge fast. The only option I know of that uses a standard USB charger and is faster is https://www.anker.com/products/varia...26800/A1277011 it can use 2 chargers at the same time so charge in 1/2 the time.Or use 2 smaller power banks.
Last edited by mibike; 08-12-19 at 12:18 PM. Reason: spilling
Likes For mibike:
#14
Senior Member
Okay, here you go....This battery bank looks like the fastest "input" recharge I've ever seen. Input current is listed as 5.6A!
30 minutes to full recharge! The downside is looks like it cost twice as much as a normal USB battery bank and output is limited 2A. If you scroll down the page on the link there are other "fast input battery banks" and some that have higher output current listings. Shop and pick what you think would work best for you.
( Note: I'm sure to get that speed you have to use the special included plug-in charger )
30 minutes to full recharge! The downside is looks like it cost twice as much as a normal USB battery bank and output is limited 2A. If you scroll down the page on the link there are other "fast input battery banks" and some that have higher output current listings. Shop and pick what you think would work best for you.
( Note: I'm sure to get that speed you have to use the special included plug-in charger )
Last edited by 01 CAt Man Do; 08-12-19 at 01:03 PM.
Likes For 01 CAt Man Do:
#15
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: QC Canada
Posts: 1,972
Bikes: Custom built LHT & Troll
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 846 Post(s)
Liked 149 Times
in
106 Posts
Okay, here you go....This battery bank looks like the fastest "input" recharge I've ever seen. [snip...]
[edit]
After (too) much searching, I tentatively came to the conclusion that a charger equipped with a USB output is the way to go. Such as this. 4x18650 Lithium batteries would make it a 40Wh bank. It charges at 4A, twice the speed of typical banks, and in a pinch you can drop disposable batteries in the charger and use them as a poor-man's bank. (If I am not mistaken, it'll charge close to 15Wh in an hour. Allowing for inefficiencies, let's assume 10Wh. Not bad)
I've looked into super capacitors, but makes no practical sense.
Last edited by gauvins; 08-13-19 at 11:22 AM.
#16
Senior Member
Interesting, but awful reviews....
[edit]
After (too) much searching, I tentatively came to the conclusion that a charger equipped with a USB output is the way to go. Such as this. 4x18650 Lithium batteries would make it a 40Wh bank. It charges at 4A, twice the speed of typical banks, and in a pinch you can drop disposable batteries in the charger and use them as a poor-man's bank. (If I am not mistaken, it'll charge close to 15Wh in an hour. Allowing for inefficiencies, let's assume 10Wh. Not bad)
I've looked into super capacitors, but makes no practical sense.
[edit]
After (too) much searching, I tentatively came to the conclusion that a charger equipped with a USB output is the way to go. Such as this. 4x18650 Lithium batteries would make it a 40Wh bank. It charges at 4A, twice the speed of typical banks, and in a pinch you can drop disposable batteries in the charger and use them as a poor-man's bank. (If I am not mistaken, it'll charge close to 15Wh in an hour. Allowing for inefficiencies, let's assume 10Wh. Not bad)
I've looked into super capacitors, but makes no practical sense.
Now about the reviews on the battery bank I previously linked to. If you are referring to the bad Amazon reviews, sometimes you have have to read what the people are actually complaining about in order to see if they are making a fair assessment of the product. Seems the nonexistent customer service was the biggest complaint ( which is probably actually true ). However there are only 40 - some reviews to judge from ( a rather small consumer base ) but from what was said the product did actually charge in 30 minutes. Some of the complaints I felt were nit-picky but if you are using Amazon Prime you should have no problem returning an item or arranging for an exchange if something goes bad on the product.. If I had one of those and if the button came loose or the USB output port came loose I would just return it to Amazon ( if still under the warranty guidelines ). Then again I'm not into fast recharge of a battery bank so if I bought a battery bank I'd likely buy one of the Anker products. That said if I was into bike touring and needed to charge my battery bank fast while at a pit stop I'd likely roll the dice on one of these 30 minute recharge battery bank...AND...while I'm at it plug in my Samsung S9 wall charger which charges my phone pretty fast all on it's own.
#17
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 11,214
Bikes: 1961 Ideor, 1966 Perfekt 3 Speed AB Hub, 1994 Bridgestone MB-6, 2006 Airnimal Joey, 2009 Thorn Sherpa, 2013 Thorn Nomad MkII, 2015 VO Pass Hunter, 2017 Lynskey Backroad, 2017 Raleigh Gran Prix, 1980s Bianchi Mixte on a trainer. Others are now gone.
Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3462 Post(s)
Liked 1,468 Times
in
1,145 Posts
If you buy some Li Ion batteries, there are a lot of counterfeit ones out there and there are lots of ones that claim great power which they do not have. I have bought several that were worthless.
I got lucky and got some from a seller on Amazon that appeared to have their rated capacity but I just checked and that seller no longer sells Li Ion batteries, so I have no suggestions on where to buy.
I got lucky and got some from a seller on Amazon that appeared to have their rated capacity but I just checked and that seller no longer sells Li Ion batteries, so I have no suggestions on where to buy.
#18
Senior Member
Best place ( IMO ) to buy loose 18650 cells is from the Orbtronic website. They have the best brands and are a USA based seller. They sell Panasonic, Sony, Samsung, LG....all the best brands, both protected and unprotected. I've bought both LG and Sony 18650's and also some 26650's. All rated ( and tested by myself as well ) at the highest capacity. They even sell the newer 21 and 20700 type cells. All products shipped from Fla. Fast shipping too. Every order I placed arrived within 4 days ( east coast ). The protected cells they sell use their own protection circuit which then get the "Orbtronic label" regardless of the actual battery manufacturer. Otherwise you get the basic manufacturer's label if buying unprotected cells. Personally, I won't buy li-ion batteries from any other place.
#19
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: QC Canada
Posts: 1,972
Bikes: Custom built LHT & Troll
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 846 Post(s)
Liked 149 Times
in
106 Posts
Best place ( IMO ) to buy loose 18650 cells is from the Orbtronic website. They have the best brands and are a USA based seller. They sell Panasonic, Sony, Samsung, LG....all the best brands, both protected and unprotected. I've bought both LG and Sony 18650's and also some 26650's. All rated ( and tested by myself as well ) at the highest capacity. They even sell the newer 21 and 20700 type cells. All products shipped from Fla. Fast shipping too. Every order I placed arrived within 4 days ( east coast ). The protected cells they sell use their own protection circuit which then get the "Orbtronic label" regardless of the actual battery manufacturer. Otherwise you get the basic manufacturer's label if buying unprotected cells. Personally, I won't buy li-ion batteries from any other place.
OTOH, if you have suggestions for a fast charger with USB-out capability, let me know. I don't really care about output Amps since most devices could charge all night. It's the input that I want to maximize.