Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

Torelli Stainless Columbus Frame - $4k

Notices
Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Torelli Stainless Columbus Frame - $4k

Old 08-05-19, 08:58 PM
  #26  
Reynolds 
Passista
 
Reynolds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,644

Bikes: 1998 Pinarello Asolo, 1992 KHS Montaña pro, 1980 Raleigh DL-1, IGH Hybrid, IGH Utility

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 476 Post(s)
Liked 34 Times in 28 Posts
I'd rather get a good old Colnago/De Rosa/Pinarello frame for a fraction of that price.
Reynolds is online now  
Old 08-05-19, 11:54 PM
  #27  
Dean V
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,453
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 848 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 51 Times in 34 Posts
Originally Posted by Abe_Froman View Post
Are you saying you would PREFER the bikes be made somewhere with inferior manufacturing infrastructure? I've never understood the anti Chinese production thing.
I have nothing against Chinese frames but it just rubs me the wrong way to pay an absolute premium for a product that you know is being manufactured at a tiny fraction of the cost.
Dean V is offline  
Old 08-06-19, 06:40 AM
  #28  
Road Fan
Senior Member
 
Road Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 14,325

Bikes: 1980 Masi, 1984 Mondonico, 1984 Trek 610, 1980 Woodrup Giro, 2005 Mondonico Futura Leggera ELOS, 1967 PX10E, 1971 Peugeot UO-8

Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 849 Post(s)
Liked 31 Times in 28 Posts
Originally Posted by shelbyfv View Post
I don't understand the attraction of stainless for a bike frame. For the price, you could have Ti. It's not like regular steel frames are rapidly rusting away. Is there some ride quality beyond regular steel?
I agree this price is too high, surprising for Torelli. If it was Mondonico branded I would not be surprised, but I still wouldn't go for it. I have two Mondonicos but I bought them from private parties. I don't know who actually makes this XCR, but I'm sure it's not Mondonico since they closed. I would put Mondonico up there with DeRosa and Cinelli, but the Mondos up to the end of production 2005 were shop-made by Antonio Mondonico, and Cinelli and DeRosa today are ... what? Chinese carbon factory? I expect stainless tubing to be more $$ than other tubesets, but this seems over the top. Still, I'd probably go for a good used one.

Regular steel frames are painted, to protect the steel tubes against rusting away. Have your favorite steel bike sandblasted clean and buy a painted duplicate. Lock them up by the ocean to see how this works. Stainless resists rust corrosion without the added weight of a paint job. Admittedly, so does Ti.

It's the design of the tubeset - very thin walls, rather large diameter with butting profiles that are specific to each tube. It's supposed to be very supple, very responsive, and a good ride. I have a Mondonico in ELOS, one of Columbus' earliest thinwall oversize tubesets. If you read here a lot you might know that ELOS is thought to ride a step up from standard Columbus SL (as well, some say it doesn't matter). I have a Mondo in "plain Columbus" and one in ELOS, and the ELOS is certainly better IMHO. XCR is a more developed frame on that theme, thinner walls and larger diameter. So while it's lighter than an ELOS, it should be a better ride and performer than ELOS. The tubeset design is around 10 years old, but I expect these frames are near state of the art for lightweight steel, comparable to Reynolds 953 or the discontinued TrueTemper S3. The data panel says 1690 grams for a 56 cm frame. I think that's pretty light. The stainless alloy has the strength to withstand the dings and dents of riding while still having super thin walls.

The geo chart seems to match the old Mondonico geo, which Torelli used to import when "Chairman Bill" owned the company. Torelli also imported a lot of frames from other builders who were rarely specified. But one thing they usually did was to match the Mondonico geometries. This is obvious if you can find a Torelli catalog from 1981 through 2005, with all levels of road frame having the same geometry at least in the earlier years. It's not the way the product line-up works today, after checking one of the other road frames.

I think the chart they show was incompletely re-arranged. I checked one of the other ones, and I think it works like this:

The sizes should actually read looking down the first column. First column of numbers should be head tube angle, second is seat tube angle, third is seat tube length, fourth is head tube length, fifth is chainstay length, sixth is BB drop, seventh is fork offset (aka rake). The sizes should be labelled running down the left with 51 at the top. I don't think they are giving geo data for 48, 49, and greater than 54 for this frame model, and they don't give data for wheelbase, front center, stack, or reach.

Last edited by Road Fan; 08-06-19 at 07:28 AM.
Road Fan is offline  
Old 08-10-19, 04:35 PM
  #29  
Jax Rhapsody
Rhapsodic Laviathan
 
Jax Rhapsody's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Louisville KY
Posts: 618

Bikes: Rideable; 83 Schwinn High Sierra. Two cruiser, bmx bike, one other mtb, three road frames, one citybike.

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 80 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 6 Times in 5 Posts
Originally Posted by indyfabz View Post
Stainless steel is real.
Real cheap as a building material.
Jax Rhapsody is offline  
Old 08-10-19, 04:58 PM
  #30  
mstateglfr 
Sunshine
 
mstateglfr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 8,694

Bikes: '18 class built steel roadbike, '19 Fairlight Secan, '87 Schwinn Prelude, Black Mountain Cycles Monstercross V4, '89 Novara Trionfo, '18 Diamondback Syncr

Mentioned: 78 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3183 Post(s)
Liked 284 Times in 196 Posts
I really like the look of the shift cable stops. Neat look- dont see it elsewhere, really.

Decently light for the size.

Absurdly expensive.

Terrible geometry chart. Complete wtf.
mstateglfr is online now  
Old 08-10-19, 04:59 PM
  #31  
mstateglfr 
Sunshine
 
mstateglfr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 8,694

Bikes: '18 class built steel roadbike, '19 Fairlight Secan, '87 Schwinn Prelude, Black Mountain Cycles Monstercross V4, '89 Novara Trionfo, '18 Diamondback Syncr

Mentioned: 78 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3183 Post(s)
Liked 284 Times in 196 Posts
Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest View Post
That's a lot of money for a very heavy frame. If something about it is compelling to you than it's worth it, but for me no way.
What would you expect it to weigh?...its pretty light for the stated size compared to other steel production frames(even including smaller brands).
mstateglfr is online now  
Old 08-10-19, 05:05 PM
  #32  
mstateglfr 
Sunshine
 
mstateglfr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 8,694

Bikes: '18 class built steel roadbike, '19 Fairlight Secan, '87 Schwinn Prelude, Black Mountain Cycles Monstercross V4, '89 Novara Trionfo, '18 Diamondback Syncr

Mentioned: 78 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3183 Post(s)
Liked 284 Times in 196 Posts
Originally Posted by Gconan View Post
But for those really interested in stainless steel WARAKIN FRAMESET
That frame is a full 1 pound heavier than the torelli. Pretty significant.

It is a neat frame though and one I considered for a good bit, but the largest size stack&reach just weren't big enough.
mstateglfr is online now  
Old 08-10-19, 11:05 PM
  #33  
Road Fan
Senior Member
 
Road Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 14,325

Bikes: 1980 Masi, 1984 Mondonico, 1984 Trek 610, 1980 Woodrup Giro, 2005 Mondonico Futura Leggera ELOS, 1967 PX10E, 1971 Peugeot UO-8

Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 849 Post(s)
Liked 31 Times in 28 Posts
Yes it’s a WTF, but you can interpret it in light of the other road frame specs on Torelli.
Road Fan is offline  
Old 08-12-19, 08:15 AM
  #34  
Laifer69
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
Posts: 2

Bikes: Look 486, Ellsworth Truth, Specialized StumpJumper

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
If I had to guess...

If I had to guess, I’d say that stainless steel Torelli is made by Cicli Barco. I have one made by them and the fittings look very similar: removable cable stops on the downtube, the boss for the front derailleur made by Thecno Italy, rear derailleur hanger (also used on the older version of the Cinelli XCr, which Barco also made, I believe.)

I also have similar little Scudetto on the top tube.
Laifer69 is offline  
Old 08-12-19, 11:18 AM
  #35  
Seattle Forrest
Senior Member
 
Seattle Forrest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 19,493
Mentioned: 46 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8554 Post(s)
Liked 467 Times in 274 Posts
Originally Posted by mstateglfr View Post
What would you expect it to weigh?...its pretty light for the stated size compared to other steel production frames(even including smaller brands).
I think everyone would generally prefer things be as light as possible, but everyone is willing to carry extra weight in some cases for things that are important to them. (I splurged 300 grams to have hydraulic disc brakes instead of calipers.) For me personally, having a steel frame isn't worth extra weight.
Seattle Forrest is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.