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Roadies, not on board with assist - prepare to be C&V'd

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Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Roadies, not on board with assist - prepare to be C&V'd

Old 07-21-19, 06:45 PM
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Wildwood 
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Roadies, not on board with assist - prepare to be C&V'd

The last few days, I've ridden a bunch of trails and roads regularly frequented by 'regular and light enthusiast' cyclists. At the rate of change I see, unassisted 9/10/11/12spd bikes for adults is the next niche of C&V.

Times a 'changing.
Progress devolves many things into relics.
Even when you want to stand tough.

Tour de France: Peter Sagan rides new Specialized e-bike on rest day ? Gallery | Cyclingnews.com
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Old 07-21-19, 08:25 PM
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We should be advocating for a class of vehicles between bikes and motorbikes - unlimited e-bikes.

Imagine controlling serious power with your pedal stroke... Specialized Turbo on roids, anyone?
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Old 07-21-19, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Kimmo View Post
We should be advocating for a class of vehicles between bikes and motorbikes - unlimited e-bikes.
They're already all over the place
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Old 07-21-19, 09:40 PM
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if you have a problem with E-bikes, stay off the MUPs.
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Old 07-22-19, 05:14 AM
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A couple of teams have touted the benefits of the e-assist road bikes in place of a Derny for training. Same tractable power characteristics as a Derny but in a conventional package, so any team member can pace the rest of the team to work on techniques and strategies.

I can see myself considering an e-assist road bike in 10 years if I want to keep up with the club rides. Just a little boost to keep up on climbs or close a gap so the rest of the group aren't waiting for me to lollygag around. It'd be fun to tag along on the A group rides and not be dropped within 5 miles or guilt-trip the younger guys/gals into thinking they need to wait for the old man at the top of every climb.

As long as it's still mostly pedaling, I see no problem.
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Old 07-22-19, 05:24 AM
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Finally a novel thread.
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Old 07-22-19, 06:53 AM
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Italics?? And maybe it won't take 7 pages before this goes to E-bikes.
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Old 07-22-19, 06:59 AM
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I'm scared of everything.
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Old 07-22-19, 07:21 AM
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What is C&V?

Haven't had an e-bike pass me yet, but come to think of it, I don't think I've seen one in the wild yet.
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Old 07-22-19, 07:33 AM
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If finding a sense of accomplishment by achieving a cycling goal (under my own pedal power) relegates me to C&V - Count me in!!!

I've grown apathetic to e-motorbikes.
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Old 07-22-19, 07:48 AM
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I had my piss and moan in the other forum topic already.

I'm down with some more! Bring on the hate.

Just like the sellers of hoverboards and electric scooters, they're responding to the demand after having an idea. Can't fault people in that. That's just smart and good business.

It's just in how society utilizes the toys and tools. They can be both. Both separately or both tool and toy in one. An amazing opportunity.

It can be a wonderful tool to a commuter, to lower vehicle emissions and reduce traffic, to keep medically vulnerable parts of the population physically active and participatory in social circles.

It can be a useful toy. Take that bike tour in the mountains you've wanted to. Allow a friend to keep up on a weekend ride with you to extend a riding friendship some more years.

It can also be an annoying and degenerative toy. It can be used like a motorcycle to race around MUP's over the speed limit while offering zero physical health benefit to the user. It can turn an active exercise group into a "me too" sightseeing tour offering little physical stress.

People going 8mph on a pedal bike on an MUP are already only expending perhaps 100 calories an hour for exercise. Hardly more than sitting still. Outside of a serious physio/heart patient, walking would be more conducive to health already. Then add an e-bike to that and it's nearly zero benefit.

So, a beneficial tool to a heart of physio patient........and a degenerative toy to an otherwise fully able-bodied individual.

An e-bike isn't so you can maintain your place in the faster group exercise rides, it's so you can show up to something or anything at all. Bless groups willing to mix e-bikes for social rides. That's a nice thing to do for a Sunday coffee shop ride. But not all group rides are coffee shop strolls. Some group rides are exercise based.

I don't think it'd be a good use of an e-bike for me to use it to show up to the local weeknight pro/1/2 group ride just because I've always wanted to meet some pros or because a friend of mine can ride in that group but I can't. It would be a good use of it if my friend has a training ride he's doing and I can join along and perhaps even enhance their training.

My opinions are harsh, but they're my own. I just want people to judiciously utilize the devices appropriately as tools and toys.
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Old 07-22-19, 07:55 AM
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Not to worry. The pedal drive system will become vestigial over time and eventually fall off, leaving a lightweight electric motorcycle.
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Old 07-22-19, 07:56 AM
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I think it's the new $17,000 road ebike. That's too much money.
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Old 07-22-19, 08:00 AM
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Millions of people ride e-bikes every day.

A pro rides and e-bike and it is news.

Someone pass the cream and sugar.


-Tim-
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Old 07-22-19, 08:10 AM
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Originally Posted by burnthesheep View Post
It can be used like a motorcycle to race around MUP's over the speed limit while offering zero physical health benefit to the user.
One of my concerns with regards to this is the unearned speed thing. Not in the sense that they don't deserve to go that fast, but in that it didn't take them time to get that fit to go that fast; that time usually provides some learning experience - a bit a bike handling and common sense/courtesy in the process. I've already seen some ebike buffoonery and I suspect that it'll get worse. But, as noodle soup says, I generally avoid the MUPs.

That said, I think that the applications are pretty cool. I saw a mom out yesterday on something like a pedal assist Big Dummy - her daughter was riding in the rack and they had some panniers for groceries and whatnot. I'd *love* to see more of that as opposed to the 4,000lb SUV status quo.
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Old 07-22-19, 08:18 AM
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Yes.... WHYFI....Unearned speed......
I think this is major concern with ebikes.... not that people don't like or want them, but all of a sudden less experienced riders are going faster than their skillset.
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Old 07-22-19, 08:23 AM
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This is exactly the issue I’ve seen with ebike riders on the local trail. Not knowing how to handle a bike at 27.
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Old 07-22-19, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by caloso View Post
Not knowing how to handle a bike at 27.
27? Woof. I have a feeling that many ebike makers aren't putting in too much effort to lock down the max speed dictated by jurisdiction. "Yes, Mr Customer, the assist tops out at 20 mph and we really discourage people from cracking that with the easy-to-follow-instructions found at theneeedforebikespeed.com *wink-wink*"
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Old 07-22-19, 08:41 AM
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I'll buy an E-road bike, no doubt in my mind. It's hilly where I live so that means I can only ride three days a week and get proper recovery. However, I can't see myself taking it to one of the group rides I frequent. For me and the folks I ride with the whole idea is to beat on each other to get fitter, an e-bike isn't going to help do that. But, by myself on a recovery day or a commute where I don't want to arrive drenched in sweat or tapped out, absolutely.

All of that said, I won't pay more than 6K; it'll have to be a mid drive that has no resistance when the motor isn't engaged (but for the weight). I see this as something that will become a big part of bicycle sales overall and if it gets someone out there, all the better. Right now we have thousands of men and women that have injuries from serving our country that preclude them from cycling on an "analog" bike. An e-bike could provide them a chance to cycle again or start for the first time. Especially for that reason, I say bring the technology on.

Last edited by nomadmax; 07-23-19 at 03:18 AM.
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Old 07-22-19, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by trailangel View Post
I think it's the new $17,000 road ebike. That's too much money.
Trek's Domane+ is $7000 and will go 28mph.

FTR, it's an absolute blast to ride.
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Old 07-22-19, 09:07 AM
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Old 07-22-19, 09:28 AM
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A few people misunderstand my initial post.

I'm neither pro or anti e-bike.
I will ride both MUTs or roads, given my preference and destination.

I merely think that e-bikes are growing rapidly and in all categories of our sport - commuter, mtb, roadie, casual pedaler, etc. Within a short time-span unassisted adult bikes may be a small fraction of the total adult bikes sold.

Personally, the availability of used parts for high-end unassisted bikes, in a market dominated by assist bikes is attractive.
Perhaps unassisted bikes will be considered clunkers - and at the current rate of conversion -- maybe, next year. The snob appeal is creeping in fast.

E-bikes are for racers, too. Right Peter?
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Old 07-22-19, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Wildwood View Post

I merely think that e-bikes are growing rapidly and in all categories of our sport - commuter, mtb, roadie, casual pedaler, etc. Within a short time-span unassisted adult bikes may be a small fraction of the total adult bikes sold.
I think that's quite a stretch.
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Old 07-22-19, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Wildwood View Post
Within a short time-span unassisted adult bikes may be a small fraction of the total adult bikes sold.
Ugh, I wonder if then instead of seeing disadvantaged folks on those big-box MTB's with the silly suspension fork bouncing with every pedal revolution, we'll see them huffing and puffing to move formerly assist bikes with the batteries long gone.
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Old 07-22-19, 09:36 AM
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Originally Posted by CAT7RDR View Post
If finding a sense of accomplishment by achieving a cycling goal (under my own pedal power) PROMOTES me to C&V - Count me in!!!

I've grown apathetic to e-motorbikes.

Fixed it for you.
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