Shimano vs. Campy
10-30-19, 05:18 PM
#26
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He's talking about having the right hand brake lever operate the front brake like Euro bike racers have been doing since the 60s, maybe even further back than that. I'm not familiar with Shimano shifters but it's nothing more than running the front brake cable to the right lever with Campy. Even though I ride motorcycles, I keep my right lever as the rear brake because I'm right hand dominant and the rear doesn't have as much mechanical advantage as the front (longer cable run).
With the way Shimano works, I don't think braking hard and sweeping the cogs into a lower gear is really a viable option (if the right lever were set up to be the front brake). One or the other functions would be compromised given that the brake lever serves two functions (braking and downshifting). With the front brake lever on the left it would lend itself better to braking with the front (left side) and down shifting (right side) at the same time.
With the way Shimano works, I don't think braking hard and sweeping the cogs into a lower gear is really a viable option (if the right lever were set up to be the front brake). One or the other functions would be compromised given that the brake lever serves two functions (braking and downshifting). With the front brake lever on the left it would lend itself better to braking with the front (left side) and down shifting (right side) at the same time.
Braking hard and sweeping the chain onto larger cogs not only works, it works so well I'm sure that's the whole point of the swinging brake lever. Japanese riders have their front brake on the right, no? As for needing both hands to perform this move, what if you're holding your water bottle, or carrying say, milk home from the shop?
Who's talking about the FD?
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10-30-19, 06:04 PM
#27
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Braking hard and sweeping the chain onto larger cogs not only works, it works so well I'm sure that's the whole point of the swinging brake lever. Japanese riders have their front brake on the right, no? As for needing both hands to perform this move, what if you're holding your water bottle, or carrying say, milk home from the shop?
10-30-19, 06:23 PM
#28
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I'm not some sort of morphological freak; if it works for me, it can work for most. Or, at least, most folks who have the front brake on the right... might be a bit tough to modulate the rear properly with a dual pivot there and no load like a rack or something.
But give it a try - I'm pretty sure it should be easy with a bit of practice. It feels so damn slick. Don't tell me Shimano didn't mean it until you try it.
FTR - I greatly preferred Ergos until I discovered this trick. I still prefer the other brands somewhat, not just for their relative simplicity and robustness, but mainly because Shimano cable pull is too small IMO. On my three bikes I have Campy, SRAM and Sensah.
But give it a try - I'm pretty sure it should be easy with a bit of practice. It feels so damn slick. Don't tell me Shimano didn't mean it until you try it.
FTR - I greatly preferred Ergos until I discovered this trick. I still prefer the other brands somewhat, not just for their relative simplicity and robustness, but mainly because Shimano cable pull is too small IMO. On my three bikes I have Campy, SRAM and Sensah.
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Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
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Last edited by Kimmo; 10-30-19 at 06:26 PM.
10-30-19, 07:06 PM
#29
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Merlin Cycles offers a Dura Ace R9100 rim brake groupset for 1160 euros, while buying parts seperately (from Merlin Cycles too) I can get a Record 12spd group for 1214. What should I buy? Keep in mind that I will have to buy BB cups for the Record (I have Shimano BB cups from my older bike).
10-30-19, 07:15 PM
#30
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Like I said, do what you're comfortable with.
Last edited by pickettt; 10-31-19 at 06:34 AM.
10-30-19, 07:27 PM
#31
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Why would I need that advice? It's just a euphemism for yeah sure pal, whatever - isn't it?
I'm trying to flag there's totally a flipside to all those folks saying that shifting with the brake lever feels weird and wrong - it's as if I'm the only one who actually sees the point of it.
I'm trying to flag there's totally a flipside to all those folks saying that shifting with the brake lever feels weird and wrong - it's as if I'm the only one who actually sees the point of it.
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Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
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Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
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10-30-19, 08:08 PM
#32
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Not really all that bad. Mind you, not sure what all exactly was in the Merlin groupset that the OP referenced, but 1160 Euros = ~$1300; $150 more gets you something bought in the US.. presumably with Shimano USA warranty. No worry about duties being charged also.
https://www.texascyclesport.com/shim...ed-time-offer/
https://www.texascyclesport.com/shim...ed-time-offer/
10-31-19, 06:30 AM
#33
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I look forward to a time when I am required to emergency brake while simultaneously shift the front to a different ring. Cant say I have come across anyone needing to do this combo move outside of bikeforums, so it may be a long time before I can.
I imagine it will be during some sort of bank heist where I am trying to get away on a bike- skidding out to cut thru alleys and whatnot.
I imagine it will be during some sort of bank heist where I am trying to get away on a bike- skidding out to cut thru alleys and whatnot.
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10-31-19, 10:56 AM
#35
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After reading the comment for an 8th time(7 more than I should have), I think he is saying that with the front brake on the right, a rider could brake and shift at the same time?
1- that isnt correct, right?
2- Why couldnt I just engage the front brake with my left hand and shift the rear with my right? That would accomplish the same thing as he is suggesting, right?
Anyways, glad I am not the only to be totally confused as to the purpose of swapping F and R brakes.
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10-31-19, 09:28 PM
#37
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Maybe that, maybe you just took a swig from your water bottle.
This is why I'm not a fan of eTap. You should be able to do all the important stuff with one hand.
Peeps are like, why? I'm like, why the hell not? As if it isn't better.
How about someone give the brake & shift an actual try before any more pooh-poohing, huh? Like I said, although it makes more sense with the front brake, it should probably still be worthwhile with the rear.
I live in a country that pretty much killed utilitarian cycling with moronic mandatory helmet laws, but surely in places not befouled by such idiocy, it's more common for someone on a road bike to carry something home a few blocks? In this scenario an eTap bike is totally crippled. A bike with USAnian brakes, you choose if you want to be able to brake properly or shift (I always opted for shifting, but it was sketchy AF).
This is why I'm not a fan of eTap. You should be able to do all the important stuff with one hand.
Peeps are like, why? I'm like, why the hell not? As if it isn't better.
How about someone give the brake & shift an actual try before any more pooh-poohing, huh? Like I said, although it makes more sense with the front brake, it should probably still be worthwhile with the rear.
I live in a country that pretty much killed utilitarian cycling with moronic mandatory helmet laws, but surely in places not befouled by such idiocy, it's more common for someone on a road bike to carry something home a few blocks? In this scenario an eTap bike is totally crippled. A bike with USAnian brakes, you choose if you want to be able to brake properly or shift (I always opted for shifting, but it was sketchy AF).
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Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
11-01-19, 06:42 AM
#38
Senior Member
Chorus 12 is a great option if you don't want or need the lowest weight group. Functionally, there's no difference between Chorus and the higher level groups. The shift lever are now made of black coated aluminum, instead of carbon fiber and the crank lacks the fancy clear coat finish of Record and SR. Chorus offers a new 48/32 crank and an 11-34 cassette, which is what I chose for the steep hills in norther Colorado. The hills on my rides are far worse than most mountain slopes. I got my groups from pinkjersey.com.
One day I'm favoring Chorus 2X12 (48/32-11/32) and the next morning I'm back to ponderin' the 1X idea with plus rims/tubeless...plenty of hills on our side of the divide tho I've been riding the fatty on 4.6" wide rubber & some XC skiing (LOL, October snowfall has set all records so there is plenty of time for a decision during the 2nd half of ski/skin/tele/classic/skate/snowshoe/fatty season).
(lastly, as a new member/reader I'm struck how some (many) of these thread posts have become a blood in the water, snark fest).
Last edited by stormpeakco; 11-01-19 at 06:48 AM.
11-01-19, 08:04 AM
#39
Senior Member
1x makes no sense for the road. The jumps between the sprockets are too large and the top gear ratio is too low. Leave 1x to the off road bike.
11-01-19, 08:13 AM
#40
Senior Member
(I'm mostly a trail rider and ride 1X12 on rigid fatbike 52 wks and those 2T jumps on the small end of the cassette don't bother me much as one may just bump up the cadence some-like on a mtb trail).
11-02-19, 11:15 AM
#41
Senior Member
Merlin Cycles offers a Dura Ace R9100 rim brake groupset for 1160 euros, while buying parts seperately (from Merlin Cycles too) I can get a Record 12spd group for 1214. What should I buy? Keep in mind that I will have to buy BB cups for the Record (I have Shimano BB cups from my older bike).
EDIT AFTER READING COMMENTS: Well, my hands are small so I will go with Campy. Thumb shift won't be that hard to get used to I believe. My new frameset will be a C64 so Shimano would be way out. Anyways thanks for helping me out!
EDIT AFTER READING COMMENTS: Well, my hands are small so I will go with Campy. Thumb shift won't be that hard to get used to I believe. My new frameset will be a C64 so Shimano would be way out. Anyways thanks for helping me out!
11-03-19, 02:39 PM
#42
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You can get gouged petty hard for Campy spares.
__________________
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
Sheldon Brown's bike info ~~~ Park Tools repair help
Half-step triple, using double gear ~~~ 6400 STI rebuild walkthrough ~~~ Want 8/9/10s @126mm OLD? OCR. ~~~ Shimano cassette body overhaul ~~~ Ergopower Escape wear repair ~~~ PSA: drivetrain wear
List of US/Canada bike co-ops ~~~ Global list
