Disc Brakes; Yay or Nay?
#151
Senior Member
Hydraulic disk brakes on bikes do have a fluid reservoir in the brake lever and do self adjust. If yours aren't self adjusting then something is wrong with them. It is one of the advantages over mechanicals.
Through axles exist because people wouldn't tighten their regular quick release correctly and with the way front disc brakes are made that can equal your front wheel flying off when you hit the brakes. If the brake caliper was installed on the front of the fork that wouldn't happen, braking would push the wheel up instead of down, but nobody thought of that or didn't like the look and now it is just the standard. Stiffness is an added bonus.
Through axles exist because people wouldn't tighten their regular quick release correctly and with the way front disc brakes are made that can equal your front wheel flying off when you hit the brakes. If the brake caliper was installed on the front of the fork that wouldn't happen, braking would push the wheel up instead of down, but nobody thought of that or didn't like the look and now it is just the standard. Stiffness is an added bonus.
Likes For Canker:
#152
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 664
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 238 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
my 2kw e-bike weighs 90lbs, sprints to 45mph in just a few seconds, and despite using it on heavy stop-start routes i don't get fade.
Again, pads. And discs. Its not fair to compare the best rim brakes to small/budget/resin disc set-ups.
Also, the wet... enough said.
My bike would be hopeless on rims.
Again, pads. And discs. Its not fair to compare the best rim brakes to small/budget/resin disc set-ups.
Also, the wet... enough said.
My bike would be hopeless on rims.
#153
ambulatory senior
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Peoria Il
Posts: 6,347
Bikes: Austro Daimler modified by Gugie! Raleigh Professional and lots of other bikes.
Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1953 Post(s)
Liked 3,633 Times
in
1,670 Posts
I just went to see what tires I could fit on my road bike. I'm comfortable riding 28c road tires on fine gravel but Cycle Oregon is offering one of its gravel options this year where the stones are 1 to 2". It looked like I could get a 38c Pasela on the front. Fully expecting to have to deflate the tire, I went for it. Throwing the caliper release off was not quite enough. But popping the Tektro (Cane Creek? - I forget which this bike has) lever release and I had clearances to spare. Lots. And this on on pretty skinny rims, ~20 mm outside width. I suspect a 45c would go in inflated. The calipers are simply Shimano Ultergra? 105?. I picked them up used and never learned the model.
Now I do have a feature that helps clearance although that was never considered when I did it. My levers are road V-brake. Less leverage, more cable travel so they sit further off the rim. (V-brake levers to get the bigger, more comfortable hoods and drop the power for more predictable braking on mountain descents. I love e'm.)
Ben
Now I do have a feature that helps clearance although that was never considered when I did it. My levers are road V-brake. Less leverage, more cable travel so they sit further off the rim. (V-brake levers to get the bigger, more comfortable hoods and drop the power for more predictable braking on mountain descents. I love e'm.)
Ben
#154
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 331
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 106 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 36 Times
in
23 Posts
my 2kw e-bike weighs 90lbs, sprints to 45mph in just a few seconds, and despite using it on heavy stop-start routes i don't get fade.
Again, pads. And discs. Its not fair to compare the best rim brakes to small/budget/resin disc set-ups.
Also, the wet... enough said.
My bike would be hopeless on rims.
Again, pads. And discs. Its not fair to compare the best rim brakes to small/budget/resin disc set-ups.
Also, the wet... enough said.
My bike would be hopeless on rims.
#155
ambulatory senior
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Peoria Il
Posts: 6,347
Bikes: Austro Daimler modified by Gugie! Raleigh Professional and lots of other bikes.
Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1953 Post(s)
Liked 3,633 Times
in
1,670 Posts
my 2kw e-bike weighs 90lbs, sprints to 45mph in just a few seconds, and despite using it on heavy stop-start routes i don't get fade.
Again, pads. And discs. Its not fair to compare the best rim brakes to small/budget/resin disc set-ups.
Also, the wet... enough said.
My bike would be hopeless on rims.
Again, pads. And discs. Its not fair to compare the best rim brakes to small/budget/resin disc set-ups.
Also, the wet... enough said.
My bike would be hopeless on rims.
#156
Non omnino gravis
So what y'all are saying now is that rim brakes are fine because you're slow? Why would I not want brakes to quickly bring me down from 45mph? I can hit 45mph on a descent quite easily.
I didn't realize I was supposed to operate only within a range of lower, rim-brake friendly speeds.
Either the argument is that rim brakes are every bit as good as disc brakes, without any applied conditionals, or you're conceding.
And (hopefully) for the last time (in this thread)
THE RIM BRAKES ARE A BETTER OPTION IN THE OP's CASE BECAUSE THEY ARE LIGHTER, CHEAPER, AND THE LOW-END DISC BRAKES AREN'T WORTH IT
I didn't realize I was supposed to operate only within a range of lower, rim-brake friendly speeds.
Either the argument is that rim brakes are every bit as good as disc brakes, without any applied conditionals, or you're conceding.
And (hopefully) for the last time (in this thread)
THE RIM BRAKES ARE A BETTER OPTION IN THE OP's CASE BECAUSE THEY ARE LIGHTER, CHEAPER, AND THE LOW-END DISC BRAKES AREN'T WORTH IT
#158
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 664
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 238 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
So what y'all are saying now is that rim brakes are fine because you're slow? Why would I not want brakes to quickly bring me down from 45mph? I can hit 45mph on a descent quite easily.
I didn't realize I was supposed to operate only within a range of lower, rim-brake friendly speeds.
Either the argument is that rim brakes are every bit as good as disc brakes, without any applied conditionals, or you're conceding.
And (hopefully) for the last time (in this thread)
THE RIM BRAKES ARE A BETTER OPTION IN THE OP's CASE BECAUSE THEY ARE LIGHTER, CHEAPER, AND THE LOW-END DISC BRAKES AREN'T WORTH IT
I didn't realize I was supposed to operate only within a range of lower, rim-brake friendly speeds.
Either the argument is that rim brakes are every bit as good as disc brakes, without any applied conditionals, or you're conceding.
And (hopefully) for the last time (in this thread)
THE RIM BRAKES ARE A BETTER OPTION IN THE OP's CASE BECAUSE THEY ARE LIGHTER, CHEAPER, AND THE LOW-END DISC BRAKES AREN'T WORTH IT
#159
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 15,453
Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE
Mentioned: 144 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7628 Post(s)
Liked 3,452 Times
in
1,823 Posts
Yeah, so ... what's your point?
#161
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 15,453
Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE
Mentioned: 144 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7628 Post(s)
Liked 3,452 Times
in
1,823 Posts
#162
Non omnino gravis
I'm saying it's not a black or white issue. In the OP's case, there is nothing to be gained in choosing the disc model, because the equipment is... meh. Rim brakes will do the same job for less money, with less weight.
Now if the extra $150 was magically getting him 4-piston hydraulic discs, then there would be no comparison. But it's not. It's getting mechanical Shimano BR-RS305s. They are in the best case unremarkable, and certainly not worth putting 1.75lbs on the bike.
The Hope RX4 brakes on my CX bike weighs about 200g more than a comparable rim brake setup-- with IceTech rotors, no less-- and I would put it up head-to-head performance-wise against any rim brake setup available.
But the calipers, rotors, levers, and hoses cost nearly as much as the Speedster 20 the OP is looking at, so it's not really relevant.
#163
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 15,453
Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE
Mentioned: 144 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7628 Post(s)
Liked 3,452 Times
in
1,823 Posts
No! No! Screwdrivers are Always better than Allen wrenches!
Not a perfect analogy ... but there are different applications where different systems are superior and otehrs where they are not.
I rode a bike with Ultegra rim brakes in the rain last night. I guess I must have died.
This argument over which brake system is "better" is no more reasonable than debating index versus friction, bar-end versus brifter, or Al versus Ti, versus steel versus CF ... or road bikes versus CX versus MTBs, or hard-tails versus full squish.
Apples are just better than oranges. Always ... said the guy who didn't make orange juice.
Not a perfect analogy ... but there are different applications where different systems are superior and otehrs where they are not.
I rode a bike with Ultegra rim brakes in the rain last night. I guess I must have died.
This argument over which brake system is "better" is no more reasonable than debating index versus friction, bar-end versus brifter, or Al versus Ti, versus steel versus CF ... or road bikes versus CX versus MTBs, or hard-tails versus full squish.
Apples are just better than oranges. Always ... said the guy who didn't make orange juice.
#164
Non omnino gravis
Yeah, I've got Ultegra rim brakes on my other bike. They work fine-- great, even. I had the option of getting my Cervelo with discs, opted not to. Good disc brakes are great. Good disc brakes are also (usually) pretty expensive.
Newer dual-pivot Shimano rim brakes are inexpensive and they work great. It's nice to live in a world where I can not only have both kinds of brakes, but recognize the advantages and disadvantages of both kinds of brakes.
Newer dual-pivot Shimano rim brakes are inexpensive and they work great. It's nice to live in a world where I can not only have both kinds of brakes, but recognize the advantages and disadvantages of both kinds of brakes.
#165
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 664
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 238 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
I'm saying it's not a black or white issue. In the OP's case, there is nothing to be gained in choosing the disc model, because the equipment is... meh. Rim brakes will do the same job for less money, with less weight.
Now if the extra $150 was magically getting him 4-piston hydraulic discs, then there would be no comparison. But it's not. It's getting mechanical Shimano BR-RS305s. They are in the best case unremarkable, and certainly not worth putting 1.75lbs on the bike.
The Hope RX4 brakes on my CX bike weighs about 200g more than a comparable rim brake setup-- with IceTech rotors, no less-- and I would put it up head-to-head performance-wise against any rim brake setup available.
But the calipers, rotors, levers, and hoses cost nearly as much as the Speedster 20 the OP is looking at, so it's not really relevant.
Now if the extra $150 was magically getting him 4-piston hydraulic discs, then there would be no comparison. But it's not. It's getting mechanical Shimano BR-RS305s. They are in the best case unremarkable, and certainly not worth putting 1.75lbs on the bike.
The Hope RX4 brakes on my CX bike weighs about 200g more than a comparable rim brake setup-- with IceTech rotors, no less-- and I would put it up head-to-head performance-wise against any rim brake setup available.
But the calipers, rotors, levers, and hoses cost nearly as much as the Speedster 20 the OP is looking at, so it's not really relevant.
#166
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 15,453
Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE
Mentioned: 144 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7628 Post(s)
Liked 3,452 Times
in
1,823 Posts
On cars, getting carbon rotors up to operating temps is a real challenge.
#167
Senior Member
I want to see Buell type rotors enter the bicycle arena. Or how about the Magura hydro rim brakes? Those things were powerful. As for low end mechanical or hydraulic disc brakes, get V brakes. They simply are a better option at the low end price point.
#168
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Indiana
Posts: 74
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 49 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
2 Posts
Why would anyone want a 25" diameter disc brake on a bicycle? It sucked on Buells, but at least it was balanced since everything else about a Buell sucked.
#169
Banned
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Lincoln Ne
Posts: 9,924
Bikes: RANS Stratus TerraTrike Tour II
Mentioned: 46 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3352 Post(s)
Liked 1,054 Times
in
634 Posts
Remember also, when the braking surface wears out on rim brakes you have to buy a new rim and probably pay to have the new wheel built. But on a disc brake bike, anyone can remove the 5 screws, lay on a new disc, and you are on your way.
#170
Gravel Rider
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: CT
Posts: 153
Bikes: 2019 Trek Checkpoint ALR5 | Trek Farley 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
No matter the bike (unless it's a fixie) or where I ride it: it's disc breaks or nothing!
#171
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: The banks of the River Charles
Posts: 2,020
Bikes: 2022 Salsa Beargrease, 2020 Seven Evergreen, 2019 Honey Allroads Ti, 2018 Seven Redsky XX, 2017 Trek Boon 7, 2014 Trek 520
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 693 Post(s)
Liked 903 Times
in
486 Posts
Does it violate any rules of cycling to have and enjoy the unique attributes of both rim and disc bikes in ones fleet? Perhaps carbon rim brakes on a lightweight climber, disc on a comfy endurance bike used for bad weather?
#172
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 15,453
Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE
Mentioned: 144 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7628 Post(s)
Liked 3,452 Times
in
1,823 Posts
It is simply unnatural. It violates every law of the universe. You must choose one to love and defend, and you must hate and revile the other.
#174
Gravel Rider
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: CT
Posts: 153
Bikes: 2019 Trek Checkpoint ALR5 | Trek Farley 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts