Bad Lag

THE OP SPEAKS - If you want to discuss chain lubrication, go elsewhere. The topic of this thread is finding a suitable replacement chain - the hardware.

I am searching for a chain to eventually replace my old Regina Oro. I have a 5 speed freewheel and a Nuovo Record derailleur - old school.

Which chains will work best with this set up? That is, which will not compromise my gear shifting?

I love the solid "chunk" and "snick" I get with the Regina chain. I don't want sloppy shifting. <-- This is a fear based upon things I've read about new chains on old drive trains.

Will any 1/2" X 3/32" chain work?

Thanks in advance.


P.S. - Do master links work with older drive trains like mine, or should I stay with press-fit pins?

Kabuki12

I am running an eight speed SRAM chain on one of my bikes with a SunTour FW . It shifts fine and the master link is handy .

1989Pre 

Make sure you get a 4 or 5 speed chain (7.3mm in width). If you like a substantial, high quality chain and can't find the Regina, then I'd go with Sachs. The master (Quik) link will work if it is 7.3mm. If it is a 6-speed (7.1mm), it won't.

abdon 

I run 8-speed chains on everything. Meaning 5~8 speeds.

Bianchi84

I used to use a Sedisport chain with no master link with my Regina CX-S 6 freewheel (until I got a Regina SL hollow pin chain). Both work great.
(I don't think you CAN use a master link on a Sedisport due to the flush pins. You can still find them I think.

repechage

Sedisport was the secret upgrade decades ago. A SRAM chain would probably be closest as they bought Sedis, but the part numbers have drifted, I have not kept track of what they really denote.

a later Regina Record chain is a bit better as the side plates are not as tall, so the chain traverses faster.

no personal info on the master link use. Get out the micrometer.

the risk of course is that the freewheel is match worn to the existing chain. Decades ago a chain lasted about 1,500 miles for me, they stretched out. Over one off season I did not adhere, bought a number of new cogs.

Kabuki12

The reason I like the master link is the ability to remove the chain from the bike with ease . I like to clean and lube the chain off the bike . The SRAM chains are of decent quality and seem to hold up for many miles. Over two years on my main bike and the .5 gage is still a no go. The 8 speed chains are around $20-$25 most places and work well with most 5 and 6 speed FW’s .

MooneyBloke

What I want to know is what is best to replace the Campy C10 chain these days (still have a Record 10 speed chain in the box) that works well with paraffin lubrication? My understanding from what I've read is that wax doesn't work so well with KMC chains, so I'm crossing that brand off my list. Molten Speed Wax is flogging Yaban, but I know nothing about that brand, but I'm somewhat skeptical of an endorsement by the distributor. They want to sell me something after all.

daka

I've been using SRAM PC 850 chains with a Campagnolo Super Record and can report mixed results. Freewheel is a Suntour "Old Winner" (as in before the New Winner was introduced) with aluminum cogs - standard spaced five speed) By and large, shifting is good but the newer chains seem to me to be more flexible side-to-side so the upshifts in the smaller cogs where the idler is farther away from the freewheel are "late" and require trimming after the shift.

I'm baffled as to why anyone would use wax on a chain they actually ride. Wax, Cosmoline and, one could argue, Boeshield as well are for coating metal items to protect from corrosion, not for lubrication of things that move. These products have very low mobility so once squeezed out from between two moving parts, the lubricating layer is lost. Since the term "paraffin" in Britain refers to what is kerosene in the US I've always wondered whether that led to some confusion when it came to lubricating chains.

MooneyBloke

You could give it a try and find out. Wet lube seems to attract a lot of abrasive grime that causes things to wear faster. It also tends to make a mess when you have to handle drive train parts. I know that my drive trains are plenty quiet since I started riding a wax setup (boring old Gulf wax in a slow cooker), and there's empirical testing showing significant power savings when running wax, but that's not a big deal for me as I'm no longer taking out a racing license. It will take some time before I can check elongation and cassette/chainring wear results. I do note that the maintenance, while somewhat more time consuming, seems a lot less messy.

BTW: there's plenty to read on this subject if you care to search the forum. Google can point you at things like Zero Friction Cycling though bear in mind that those guys want to sell you something.

Test on vendor site; view with appropriate skepticism: https://zerofrictioncycling.com.au/lubetesting/

HTupolev

Wax's lubricating properties are quite good, and it doesn't break off from a chain as easily as you might think.

On a lubricated drivetrain, a main driver of chain wear is contamination. Oil remains tacky after application, so it tends to pick up a lot more dust and grit from the road than wax does. This not only tends to make oil-lubricated chains much dirtier to handle, but also causes them to wear out faster.

daka

I know better than to argue on BikeForums where everyone is or knows an expert. But I will say that in a lifetime around mechanical things I have yet to see any other examples where wax was the recommended lubricant other than putting it on a nail to pound through hardwood. In optics fabrication we used to use wax as an adhesive to temporarily attach glass to a metal fixture for shaping/polishing, hardly a job for a lubricant. YMMV, of course.

randyjawa 

Yup, me too.

randyjawa 

I tried wax for a while. Pooey-Stinko, meaning no disrespect to the product, just my preference. Wax is, a pain to employ and, in my opinion, does darn little to improve the function or life of my chains. Course, that is just me.

MooneyBloke

I'm definitely not an expert, but my experience with wax so far has been favorable. I did however provide citations for the claims albeit from vendors. I think to prevail, you must show the flaws in the methodology cited. It's just like claiming you should run street sew-ups at 140psi. Research has shown otherwise, and you need to show the flaws in that research to back up your claims. I don't have a dog in this fight with the exception that biking seems to have a lot of urban legends that drive it, and we should endeavor to dispel these at every chance where there is recent work contradicting them. Science is all we have to go on, and we should show attempts at it a little more respect.

davester

To quote The Dude,“Yeah, well, you know, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.”

Now, if you're interested in actual data on this topic there is independent testing that shows that formulations like Molten Speed Wax and Silca wax are superior lubricants. Here's an example: https://zerofrictioncycling.com.au/lubetesting/
I've been using wax for a couple of years and find that it is much less hassle to use than the chain cleaning/lubrication steps needed for many of the other lubricants. Also, my chains stay nice and clean!

Bad Lag

THE OP SPEAKS - If you want to discuss chain lubrication, go elsewhere. The topic of this thread is finding a suitable replacement chain - the hardware.

MooneyBloke

And that's where I was going until the "I'm baffled" came up and basically called into question the sanity of folk who choose that mode of lubrication. Sorry for the detour. I'm seeking a good substitute for a Campy Record 10 chain that hangs onto wax well. I just mentioned lubrication because there are evidently brands with a treatment that tend to shed wax more than others.

daka

My apologies for derailing the thread.

Robvolz 

I've been lucky enough to rummage through co-op bins and often the metal recycle bin and pull out regina and Everest chains that still have some life.

I'm blown away by the ebay prices on regina chains. They made many, considered a commodity and were only a touch more $$ than the competition back then.

To me, I shouldn't have to spend more on a chain than a great condition rear dereailleur. But such is life.

Otherwise, as earlier suggested, Sachs if you can find them.

Bad Lag

Why does no one even mention 5 speeds in their advertisements, not even the major makers?

Is it just understood by the cognocenti that some or all 1/2" X 3/32" chains fit 5 speed freewheels?

Alternatively, is it not mentioned because nothing fits 5 speeds and I am out of luck?

I really miss retail stores.

JohnDThompson 

I have enough NOS SedisSport chain to last me a while:

daka

I think it may just be caution on their part. While an 8-speed chain is still 1//2" x 3/32", same pitch and tooth width as a five speed chain had, the chain is physically quite a bit narrower. And, in my experience anyway, seems to have more side-to-side flexibility as well which may be a consequence of a less "square" form factor and because all these modern chains do not have the transverse bushing that five-speed chain had up until the Sedisport was introduced. So, yes, 8 speed chain fits and most of us would say it works but it isn't the same and there may be situations where the narrower chain gets caught between chainwheels or some such thing - enough of a difference that the makers aren't going to guarantee that it is compatible.

Bad Lag

LOL! That was a wicked thing to post. Have you no shame, no sympathy for your fellow man? LOL!

I am going to buy and try an 8 speed chain and see how it works BEFORE this chain dies completely.

It is still possible to buy 5 speed chains. Last night I came across a NOS Regina Oro for $175. So, it is possible to get them.

Bad Lag

Thank you for the info and advice.

I wonder if a simple statement, in fine porint on the back of the package, such as, "Usable with reduced shifting performance on 5 speed freewheels."