awac

Ha! That got you! Oh, you thought THAT Paul Newman……lol (my wife just said, a lot of people here wouldn’t know him now!). Ok, what have I bought for £35? Stronglight crank 60/52 tooth. Mafac cantilever bosses. TDC headset. Nervex lugs. Steel drop outs. Curved brake stay. Fluted seat stay caps. Holdsworth or Claud Butler I am thinking? Top tube 25.6mm. Seat tube internal approx 27.9mm.

awac

Also a couple of wheels thrown in with new tyres, woo-hoo! 4.375kg as is in the picture….I needed an excuse to buy a Stronglight crank extractor….!



1004 serial number




60/52 teeth

markk900

Can't help with the identification but my knees are getting sore just looking at the chainrings..... Looks like a lovely frame!

Aardwolf

From https://www.nkilgariff.com/FrameNosTemp.htm

1004 as a Holdsworth serial number would be about 1936.
Claude Butler were 6 or 7 digit
Freddie Grub it could be 1923 or 1939.
None of those look likely to me.

But here's the fork from my 1961 Holdsworth Cyclone which is almost the same



However the brake fittings are no match:

awac

Better view of head lugs. The fork stem also carries the serial number 1004 found on bottom bracket.

Bad Lag

Looking at the freewheel, I'd guess the prior owner liked to pedal with a slooooooow cadence.

What a great find. The wheels/rims,... what can I say? Wow!


There were two other bikes shown a couple of months ago, one being repainted in red, which also had those "spear point" seat stay caps. It could be, those help with identifying the maker. (Bad Lag takes off to find thread, put pedals slowly)

awac

Thanks for the photos, I think it is pretty close if you disregard the centre pull cable bracket above it and the cantilever bosses, seat lug looks different. Claud Butler had a model called European around 1959 with Mafac criterium cantilevers, is this one or were these added as extra later? The fork lug is close isn't it!

awac

I had been watching it for a couple of weeks and no-one has bid, it was 30min drive from me so made a day out to the seaside! I just had to get it and try to find out what it is, it has been driving me crazy! The crank rings are mad aren't they! Hmm, could be amusing, “actually the 52 tooth is my granny ring” lol.

The seat stay caps. Have seen a picture of this type on the web, so far, bertin, Holdsworth and interestingly Eddie Soens from Liverpool which might link the wheels with the Tierney cycles sticker.

Aardwolf

You won't have the same lugs as a Cyclone unless it's actually a Cyclone - a special Holdsworth lug set.

But seat stays look similar too - can't see clearly but I think yours are the thin spearpoint type:
Edit: cable stops have been replaced



Looks like different dropouts too, these are Campagnolo (10 shillings extra)

Aardwolf

That was probably me building the 1961 Holdsworth Cyclone, in red flake: https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...one-build.html

due ruote 

Or maybe they were a mad strong time trialist. It is quite the stout setup.

Aardwolf

I just checked on https://nkilgariff.com/ClaudButler.htm

1959 European:



And checking the next couple of years thay switched to Mafac racer in 1961 !!!

nlerner

Have you checked with the Chelmer Cycling Club? https://www.chelmercc.org.uk

awac

1957–1987 Holdsworth ownership of Claud Butler.

Your cyclone with the spear point seat lugs, with the Mafac criterium brakes on the European? Possible factory bitsa?

10 shillings extra for campy dropouts,, trust me to find the cheapskate…..lol.

awac

Will send them an email later!

Aardwolf

Doh, I missed a bit: Claud Butler frame numbers reset when Holdsworth started making them.

Claud Butler went bust in 1956
In 1958 Holdsworth bought 3 Claud Butler trade marks
The Claud (by Holdsworth) European launched in 1959 with frame numbers in the range 0001 to 4400.

It's all on the site https://nkilgariff.com/ClaudButler.htm

Aardwolf

Just a thought: could you link the advert you found this on

Guessing it's Ebay but I do peruse the adds when I'm bored and I totally missed this one.
Not that I have room for another bike.

juvela

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looks like it may have been done for a retailer as a house branded frameset

NERVEX lug pattern 86bis/158

NERVEX bottom bracket shell nozzle cut Nr. 158

NERVEX dropouts Ref. 1007

NERVEX seat stay bridge Ref. 600 serie

Vagner fork crown Nr. 12ref+

seat binder Gripfast

TDC headset is Europa model

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suggestion -

at earliest convenience reset registration ("clocking") of T. A. chainwheel adaptor Nr. 175 so that it is symmetric


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awac

So it is looking likely a European then. I admit I am leaning towards this, unless anyone else has any new contenders?

Aardwolf

Yep, I'd say a 1959 Claud Butler European, built by Holdsworth.
It's always interesting to learn the history of who made what back in the day.

If you want to check for the original colour have a look under the crown race.

awac

Goodness gracious great lugs of er, well, frame. Amazing. Thank you for a full lug list, very, very handy. It is my great shame that I do not own a stronglight crank extractor, but a local charity bike shop owner I know thinks he might have one so will take it to bits tomorrow hopefully. Secretly I hope he does not so I can explain to my wife this is an essential purchase…..that’s how I have all the other crank and freewheel tools…sigh.

Aardwolf

I got one off Ebay: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/222325878325

2in1 Stronglight Specialites T.A. removal remover crankset Arm Puller Tool NEW

Although other places also sell them.

awac

You are a bad man. I noticed spa cycles have one for sale £44 but not a 2 in 1. So this looks a better deal. I hate not having a tool that fits. One day I am going to come across a TD cross freewheel on a bargain purchase and I will be so pleased with myself….

awac

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. Where have I heard used that one before!

juvela

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wrt Stronglight crank puller -

you want to verify that what you order is the 23.35mm size for early Stronglight and not the 22.0mm size for later Stronglight


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