Vintage Puch road bike - need help with Frame identification and year of manufacture
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Vintage Puch road bike - need help with Frame identification and year of manufacture
Hi everyone, I purchased this bike a few years ago near where I live here in Vienna Austria. I can only say it is a Puch because of the Puch logo sticker located on the front of the bike. The bike has Shimano Dura-Ace brake calipers (front & rear) and Shimano Dura-Ace brake levers. The rear Derailleur is a Shimano Crane. The Cassette, front Derailleur and crank assembly are all Shimano Dura-Ace. The handlebar and Stem and Cinelli - Mod Campione Del Mondo, but the Head Set is again from Shimano. These parts are all easily recognisable and are in very good condition. The tricky part is the frame. As said the only identification is the Puch logo sticker on the front. On the underside of the frame are some serial/production numbers: 3 1267 85. The front and rear dropouts are from the company Campagnolo. I have tried comparing my bike with other road bikes in the Puch range to find which model it may and have only found similarity with the brake cable holders found on the top tube which are similar to that on the Puch Mistral. Would be grateful if anyone could help in identifying the model and year of manufacture. Cheers!!!
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Welcome to the forums. The biggest date clue is the presence of a Campagnolo Portacatena dropout, These were introduced in late 1977 for the 1978 model year and were used through to circa 1982-1984, depending on the amount of inventory. Given the era and Portacatena dropout, it is curious that the frame used clamp style shift levers and brake calipers with exposed nuts. One Puch frame which held onto these characteristics into this era was the Vent Noir but the chrome on your frame is natural, as opposed to the smoked chrome used on the Vent Noir.
The black, first generation, Shimano Dura-Ace with a Crane rear derailleur is also typical of a Vent Noir. However, these components were only available 1974-1977, with second generation Dura-Ace EX being introduced for 1978. The brake levers suggest very late first generation. as they appear to have the oval lightening/grip holes, which were introduced in 1977. Still, unless Puch made a big last time buy or placed a special order, the components are anachronistic with the Campagnolo Portacatena dropout.
Additionally, there are a couple of anomalies to suggest the group may have been pieced together. The non-drive crankarm does not have the black fill in the flute, as used on black Dura-Ace. The rear skewer nut is Dura-Ace EX, as opposed to first generation. Also, the smaller chainring is not black, though this would be a common replacement item.
Finally, there a huge fly in the ointment. Given that the cable housing cores routed through the BB tunnels have been painted over in the same colour as the main triangle, your frame would appear to be a repaint and therefore the head badge is not OEM. Furthermore, the A-D/Puch S/N that I've seen are routinely seven characters long, all printed in one one string and starting with a 5, 6 or 7. In your case, the '3' and '85' do not appear to be part of the serial number, which is only four characters long.
So, the bottom line is that it may not be a Puch and that the component group may have been pieced together. About the only definitive item is the age, which dates from 1978 to early 1980s, based on the Portacatena dropout.
Link to OP's photo album: https://www.bikeforums.net/g/picture/15437562
The black, first generation, Shimano Dura-Ace with a Crane rear derailleur is also typical of a Vent Noir. However, these components were only available 1974-1977, with second generation Dura-Ace EX being introduced for 1978. The brake levers suggest very late first generation. as they appear to have the oval lightening/grip holes, which were introduced in 1977. Still, unless Puch made a big last time buy or placed a special order, the components are anachronistic with the Campagnolo Portacatena dropout.
Additionally, there are a couple of anomalies to suggest the group may have been pieced together. The non-drive crankarm does not have the black fill in the flute, as used on black Dura-Ace. The rear skewer nut is Dura-Ace EX, as opposed to first generation. Also, the smaller chainring is not black, though this would be a common replacement item.
Finally, there a huge fly in the ointment. Given that the cable housing cores routed through the BB tunnels have been painted over in the same colour as the main triangle, your frame would appear to be a repaint and therefore the head badge is not OEM. Furthermore, the A-D/Puch S/N that I've seen are routinely seven characters long, all printed in one one string and starting with a 5, 6 or 7. In your case, the '3' and '85' do not appear to be part of the serial number, which is only four characters long.
So, the bottom line is that it may not be a Puch and that the component group may have been pieced together. About the only definitive item is the age, which dates from 1978 to early 1980s, based on the Portacatena dropout.
Link to OP's photo album: https://www.bikeforums.net/g/picture/15437562
Last edited by T-Mar; 10-08-19 at 07:03 AM.
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Assuming original components, Shimano Crane derailleurs would put it mid to late 1970s. Components and frame description suggest an upper level model. As always, pictures would help.
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There are some similarities to this one, a 1982 team bike built for Stefan Mutter. The transitions from stays and fork blades to the Campagnolo tips and dropouts looks similar, which is different from the usual domed/rounded transitions I am accustomed to seeing on mid-70s A-D/Puch products. These are a lot more chisel/square-cut to my eye, but the fork crown is one A-D/Puch used on their nice bikes from the mid-70s well into the 80s. The lugs on the OP's bike are throwing me off, though - where they come around the face of the head tube looks plainer than I am used to seeing on Puchs. A-D/Puch looooved Bocama lugs, using short point Professional model lugs on the A-D Vent Noir and Ultima bikes as well as on the Puch Royal Force and Royal X frames.
The BB on the team bike differs from the OP's in having what appear to be different length slots, but there are a lot of similarities. Basically, you're looking at a bike that if it is indeed a Puch, slots into whatever time they still used that particular box crown and seat stay caps without embossing or engraving, top tube cable guides and under BB , clamp on shifters and a single bottle boss. That is an interesting mix of features, particularly with lugs I don't see on any other Puchs - not yet, anyway.
In addition to the Vent Noir, A-D/Puch also used black (or mostly black) Dura-Ace on the Royal Force certain years, and I suspect they bought a lot of stuff at a time.
I would suggest rolling on over to Facebook's Puch Rennrader von 1976-87 group and seeing what they have to say - there are a LOT of Austrian guys who are deeply into this marque.
The BB on the team bike differs from the OP's in having what appear to be different length slots, but there are a lot of similarities. Basically, you're looking at a bike that if it is indeed a Puch, slots into whatever time they still used that particular box crown and seat stay caps without embossing or engraving, top tube cable guides and under BB , clamp on shifters and a single bottle boss. That is an interesting mix of features, particularly with lugs I don't see on any other Puchs - not yet, anyway.
In addition to the Vent Noir, A-D/Puch also used black (or mostly black) Dura-Ace on the Royal Force certain years, and I suspect they bought a lot of stuff at a time.
I would suggest rolling on over to Facebook's Puch Rennrader von 1976-87 group and seeing what they have to say - there are a LOT of Austrian guys who are deeply into this marque.
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Many thanks for all the very detailed information. Yes indeed the bike does look as if it may have been resprayed. However I am hesitant to remove just a little on the paint to see what the original spray job may have been before I know a little more about the bike. Another little feature I forgot to mention is the handmade metal basket which looks to be custom made for this bike. Could this bike have been used as a training bike? Have added new pictures to the link mentioned in the previous comments. Cheers John