RobbieTunes

That’s the spirit!

game_player_s

I really should've figured on this... but I didn't.

So the 1987 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert "Miami Vice" I bought last month. I stripped the rear wheel and readied the rim, spokes, and spoke nuts for the scrap heap. Not sure if it was ice damage or just what, but the rim was cracked in four different locations, and five of the spokes snapped when I went to unscrew the spoke nuts, crazy stuff!

So I'm thinking to myself, "it's not a big deal there's a couple spare rear 700c road bike wheels sitting in the storage shed". But, being the complete noob to all this that I am, made the mortifying shock discovery that there's apparently more than one size of cassette mount, there was no such mention of this possibility in the bike repair book I've got, and boy do I feel stupid for not considering there could be more than one size of mount. So I've got the hub, and the cassette, both of which are fine. Is it cheaper to hunt a whole wheel with compatible mount for the Shimano cassette, or to try to source a rim and spokes and build a wheel using the original hub?

texaspandj

First, if you have the original wheel, it's a freewheel Not a cassette. Pics would be helpful.
The original freewheel is a 6 speed, meaning it has 6 sprockets (cogs). It also has 32 spoke hole rim (wheel).
Armed with that information, you can choose which way is less expensive the cost of a rim verses a complete wheel.
Craigslist would be a good source for a complete used wheelset.
I'm not familiar with buying new rims but hopefully someone will chime in on that. But if you want the exact vintage model rim, I think eBay will be you're best bet and probably won't be cheap.

Bondsy

My Carbon-R Serial number 87M0084 finished. Having read all the info on here I think this proably was an Ironman. The later Carbon-R's had a different shaped fork! Should of
done some more research before starting the build. However I don't think it's turned out too bad.

RobbieTunes

The later Asian Carbon-R's had a different fork, but the first Carbon-R's were just like that. Probably not that nice!

Classtime 

Maybe because this is the latest one that I have seen, but this is the nicest one. Perhaps I should look for a Carbon Bike.

Bondsy

Not sure how common these are but this is the only one I have seen over here in the UK. Not sure how many were built, anyone any idea?

texaspandj

You mentioned it may have been originally an Ironman, did you re-sticker/decal it?

Bondsy

Yes I bought just the frame and fork, it had Colnago Super decals, it clearly wasn't a Colnago which was one of the reasons why I bought it, looked good and I was interested in finding out what it really was. It was only when I found this forum that I discovered that it was a Centurion.

texaspandj

Hmm, interesting.
Well as far as I am aware the Centurion Carbon R and the Centurion Carbon Ironman frames were Identical. However the Carbon-R was outfitted with Dura Ace components while the Carbon Ironman had Shimano tricolor 600 components. So you could've gone either way. Either way.... Your Centurion is Super Nice.

Bondsy

Yes didn't see the post with the catalogue details until I had the magority of the 600 parts, probably easier to get some Carbon Ironman decals, RT did point me in the right direction but I had also already order the carbon r decals. QVs rebuild posts were pretty much the main source of information I used.

texaspandj

QVs Carbon rebuild thread was pretty impressive for sure.
Your version is very well done. So my guess is your Carbon came with 600 tricolor group?
Yeah it may be time for @RobbieTunes to update the Carbon Ironman specs.

Multisync

For those of you who have refurbished the Ironman carbon frames, what is the best way to do it?
Sanding, dry or wet, scraping?

Just got myself one here in Norway, joined the site to post a picture of it on the "post your Centurion Ironman thread", but I guess I gotta join some conversations first.

Did all of these come with all shimano 600 or maybe as bare frames?

This one has the biggest mashup of parts ever, pretty much period correct kit-bashing.
Justthe back wheel looks like it is more modern, and has a bike roller tire on.

Shimano 600 brakes and levers, one 600 downtube lever, the other simplex.
Mavic 851 SSC rair derailleur, Mavic 860 front.
Front wheel, one of the campagnolo high flage hubs with mavic MA2 rim.
Back wheel Shimano 105 hub with Rigida Chrina rim.
Stronglight 107 cranks.

markwesti

I have never refurbed a CF IM frame , other CF frames though . First of all no scraping , also I would dry sand , if there is a nick in the clear coat , feather it out with fine grit sandpaper and build it back up with clear coat , this will take multiple coats , lightly sand in between coats . Also for filling up nicks use some backing on the paper . If the decals are good very lightly with very fine sandpaper , sand , just enough to give some tooth to the CC . Another thing that works well for me is 3M Scotch Bright , with the 3M you can get down in the nicks and then finish up with backed paper . Good luck and keep us posted . Also welcome to the IM club .

Multisync

Thanks!

I am afraid the clear coat is way too far gone, have to take it all off.
It feels worn through in some spots, a lot of places have this thin brownish layer that i can scrape off with my fingernail, like its oxidized, and is generally pretty dull looking. edit: after some more light fingernail scraping, that IS the clear coat, just brittle and dry.
Decals are all there, but some a bit scuffed and peeling, and to do the clear coat on the frame properly I think I have to take them off.

Probably have to make do with some almost correct decals.
Seems like the carbon ironman had some subtle details changed, the letter colors I can change to the right ones, but the "confetti" has a bunch of colors swapped around from the standard it seems.

Bondsy

I found it was easier to remove all the clear coat from each tube as when trying to patch it in you could always still see the repair. Depending on how bad the clear coat is determines really the method needed to remove it. If lifting and flakey then it is best to scrap off carefully. If it is pretty sound then use fine grade sand paper. In both cases you need to be very careful not to damage the carbon. It appears more difficult than it actually is. Once you get going it's pretty straight forward. I got my decals from velocals I am pretty sure if you contact them they will have what you are looking for. As for the components I believe you need to be looking at the 600 group set (6400).

texaspandj

@Multisync if your Centurion Carbon is decaled with Ironman then shimano 600 tricolor 6400 is the correct components as Bondsy has pointed out (despite what the info/specs on page 1 says). Even the BB IS 6400 however the headset is labeled Centurion. @Bondsy did your Carbon Ironman/now Carbon-R come with that seatpost?

Multisync

Cool, thanks. Might not make it original as I would have to buy most of the parts anyways.
Only brakes, levers and one of the dt shifters is shimano tricolor.
The BB was changed to a stronglight one. Headset is labelled Centurion however, do you know which headset it really is?

texaspandj

Sorry, I don't know what headset it actually could be.

Bondsy

@texaspandj no I had to source the seatpost. Which took me ages as being 25mm they are not cheap, most being over £100. I was lucky and found this durace one cheap on ebay. Was originally looking at the 600 post but couldn't find one that didn't bust the bank. My headset looks like the original and is marked Tange Japan PAT.P on the upper nut which I am guessing matches the Tange fork.

crank_addict

1984

Multisync

Does anyone know what kind of carbon weave they used on the carbon bike?
Don't have any reference to be able to tell. One of the chain stays on mine has been rubbed by the (too big) chain ring, I might try my hand at fixing it, seeing as this looks like it will turn into an all winter project.

TriBiker19 

Do I need to replace this chain or how can I get it to better condition? And is there anything I need to do with the cassette besides cleaning it? I was planning on swapping the tires from the tubeless (at least that's what I think they are) to presta stem tubes with new tires--will that cause issues?

revcp 

Yes, the chain needs to be replaced. Not only is it rusted, but there are frozen links. A new 6/7/8 speed chain is $8-$10.

If those truly are tubular rims, you cannot use clincher tires and tubes. Tubular rims don't have a "hook" on them to hold the tire's "bead" on under pressure. Tubular rims have a concave dish that the completely round (cross section-wise) tire (as opposed to a "U" shaped clincher tire) is glued to.

The pics aren't great, but the nipples on the spokes look pretty rusted. It might be very difficult to true the wheels, requiring a complete rebuild, and that would cost more than the $100-$150 that a good used wheelset would cost.

Hard to tell whether the cassette (gears) is ok. If it's a uniglide cassette it will probably be good to 2050 or so, but I'm guessing it's hyperglide, and a (6 speed?) replacement will be $25-$30.

sdn40

If the small sample of the pictures is any indication, I would find a friend or a co-op. Rear derailleur needs a little attention too. Without seeing other pictures, I think the safe assumption is all the general maintenance, consumables, bearings, need attention. Not a huge endeavor, unless you can't do it yourself. Hence, finding a friend