Miele Man

Anyone ever see a tubular tire split like this where the split runs across the tire? The tire belongs to a friend an it's getting binned.


Cheers

Miele Man

Bump.

Anyone know what would cause a tire to split transversely like that?

Cheers

due ruote 

I don’t really have an answer, but it appears as though the tread rubber was brittle. How it got that way would be the question, and a number of things could have contributed, including tire quality, age, storage conditions, and maybe other factors. Do you know the brand and age? Judging by the sidewall, it appears to be fairly old.

(edit) other ideas: perhaps the tire was folded tightly at that point and left for a long time; random mfr defect is always possible.
If the tire is still around, it would be interesting to see if other sections crack if bent tightly.

Salamandrine 

Almost certainly just age. Rubber get brittle and degrades as it gets old. It's obvious from the fact that most of the sidewall latex is gone that the tire is quite old.

xiaoman1 

I have had a few that have done that.....was it folded for a long period of time, mine were and they cracked just like the one you posted.
Ben

gaucho777 

Is that another crack forming toward the left edge of the top photo? It does look like an old tire, but the cracking seems isolated to my eyes. Just speculating...I've heard about broken-off metal street sweeping bristles causing similar damage. However, I suspect just age and a crack that quickly grew. If that is indeed another crack forming to the left, there may be some credence to the idea of it cracking where the tire was folded for storage.

RobbieTunes

I usually spent 15-30 seconds to ascertain why a tire failed.
After that, I move on.

This one?
A shrug and a “darn it.”

Moe Zhoost

It's just age. I have some like that that I use as spares. As long as the carcass is not compromised, that tire will get you home.

Road Fan

There is some black goop called Shoe Goo, made to fill cracks in running shoes. I think it has some cyanoacrylate (Super Glue stuff) built in, which helps it stick in place. I've used it on occasion on tread cracks in tubulars. No problems before the crack and no problems afterwards, and no problems after Shoe Goo. I also used it to glue down a flap of rubber that came up from the casing. A tube of it is less than $20, really cheap compared to a new tubular or a repair at Tire Alert. If it's a YJ tire, the Goo is the price of the tire, and Tire alert is more than the price. But even for a YJ tire, it could give you another 6 months on the tire, and you would have the ability to treat many more tires.

It COULD be just age, but I don't think the light in the photo is good enough to really see much. I definitely have tires >15 years old that do not show spontaneous cracking, and certainly not big cracking. But I really think that if the casing is not greatly distorted when at riding pressure, it has not been damaged and the tread rubber just needs to be adhered to the casing, and the gap filled. The crack could have been started by something on the road like a shard or screw that cut it.

15 to 30 seconds after a tire investment of $50 at the low end not the bottom end? OK, but the Shoe Goo shopping trip will take about 20 minutes to the Local Running Store (LRS) and about 30 seconds to apply it, IF you are careful.

repechage

Decades ago I had a Clement Criterium Seta do similar, it was not folded for storage, Bought new and installed soon after.
Something in the rubber chemistry for sure.
Uncommon, the way tubulars are created, if the casing is sound, use it as a secondary spare.

tricky 

This is blowing my mind. Are you riding these tires or are they on wall hangers? Are the tires dry and brittle and the tread is cracking as a result? I value my teeth, intact bones, limited number of chronic issues, and lack of damage on my bikes at more than whatever a new tubular costs. I am also fairly risk averse when it comes to my gear, but you do you.

repechage

If this was a clincher tire, you are very correct- the tread is much more part of the tire.
Tubulars are a casing that has a rubber layer bonded to the outside. The casing is the needed integrity. There are other potential issues, such as a base tape letting go, but that is not the issue here.
It was stated the tire would be binned. I would make it a backup spare, the second tire carried under the saddle.
In 50 years this is the third tire I have seen with this type of failure. I worked in a bike shop of a dozen, when tubulars were THE performance tire, there were no hook beaded clinchers.

scarlson 

This sort of thing happens all the time in Boston. It's the bad air, ozone I think. Rubber things just fall apart, while up in Vermont they lasted forever.

John E

This is why I always stored my spare tubular tires lightly inflated, rather than folded. Back before I moved to north coastal San Diego County and discovered goat head thorns, I rode tubulars once per week, so it wasn't that big ideal to let the air out and fold a spare tire (in a different position each time) before a ride. .

Road Fan

I'm not the subject of the thread, but thank you for your concern. No, I don't ride bikes with dry, flaking rubber, since it's absolutely essential that the tire generates traction. If my rubber is in good condition and has some blemishes that can be patched and re-adhered to the base, I've done that a few times. Remember the Shoe Goo has some cyanoacrylate in the formula. I've been riding with tubulars beginning a little before the Super Course in question was new, so I've gained a few tricks that have helped me from time to time. I hope they can still help other folks. Perhaps you would not want to return such a tire to use, and that's your call. But you cannot predict that you won't have problems if you never ride on such a tire is such condition. And you could have problems due to failures that do not involve tires, or due to road conditions.

But in the history of this group and a few of the similar groups (example on Google), there are tubulars that had a history of carcasses that break spontaneously. I once was a proponent of that brand of tire, and after I saw those I stopped using anything new from that brand.

If there is a flat in most riding (straight or gentle turns), the bike capsizing and throwing you to the ground is mainly a feature of clinchers, which usually lose nearly all their air immediately, and then the wheel has zero traction - no steerability or braking traction. Tubulars when punctured usually lose air slower, since there is no bead to separate from the rim and the tubular casing, even light silk, is very hard to cut or tear. Try it! If it takes your 5 minutes at the workbench (tin snips are cheating!) it is not going to surprise you on the road, and that means that in an emergency you will have time to stop under control, catch your breath, and dismount safely.

I had a broken tubular sidewall due to a few of the threads being cut by an X-Acto knife. After riding it a few hours the tube herniated out through the little hole, like a balloon. A loud bang, but after that the pressure took about 30 sec to go away. The hole did not grow and the casing did not tear open. I had time to get on the brakes, and tubulars glued well let you retain some braking and steerability. If this happens in a 1-g turn (45 dgree heeled over) that's most likely a different story. But someone who rides that aggressively on roads is self-endangering, anyway. The experts riding that way all the time in the TDF have more experts preparing their bikes before every ride.

Damage to your bike? Mainly only if it falls. If you don't have your foot bolted to the pedal and you side-slip, you can kick out your foot as a buffer and to push yourself back up straight. If you can't get out of your clip-on that quickly (I can get out of my toe-clips with straps that quickly - the secrets are no cleats, smooth shoe soles and low strap tension) you should not be in clip-on road shoes. But that kick-out will keep you from falling and tearing your kit and skin, scraping your paint, needing PT or even surgery, and maybe even causing future asplosion of a carbon frame due to tearing fibers on the surface layers, if that's what you ride.

tricky 

Fair enough. Sounds like there is a little more safety margin with well-glued tubulars.

John E

True. I think the greatest danger from tubulars comes from adhesive failure. I just got tired of having so many to patch, even though I got reasonably good at it.

RobbieTunes

Part of the Sox's curse.

conspiratemus1

There once was a man from South Boston
Who wished that he'd ne'er been begotten.
Nor would he have been,
But the rubber was thin,
And right at the tip it was rotten.

Gotta watch that ozone.