View Poll Results: How does a bicycle steer?
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How does a bicycle steer?
08-25-23, 02:31 PM
#1
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How does a bicycle steer?
A discussion of zero-length stems veered into a discussion of how a bicycle steers. So I thought that I'd open a new thread and start with a poll.
08-25-23, 03:01 PM
#2
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Time to stock up on pop corn
...sit back and enjoy the entertainment.
...sit back and enjoy the entertainment.
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08-25-23, 03:16 PM
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A bicycle doesn't steer. It is steered.
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08-25-23, 03:21 PM
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08-25-23, 03:21 PM
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By pure voodoo, a true 'dark force' that descends upon us every time we want to turn so we can overcome the forces of good that try to steer us straight ahead to keep us on the centerline in the direction of righteousness. Amen and Hallalujah!
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08-25-23, 04:19 PM
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Lean it!!!
(Yes, I know this is fake.)
(Yes, I know this is fake.)
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08-25-23, 04:23 PM
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But wait...Before it was steer into the turn as slow speeds. Counter steer at higher speeds. What speed is the tipping point between steering and counter-steering? At that point, is it both/neither? Maybe steer with the left and counter-steer with the right? This is confusing...
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08-25-23, 04:29 PM
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But wait...Before it was steer into the turn as slow speeds. Counter steer at higher speeds. What speed is the tipping point between steering and counter-steering? At that point, is it both/neither? Maybe steer with the left and counter-steer with the right? This is confusing...
I was raised on a Honda motorcycle-dad was a Honda mechanic starting in 1966. I learned about counter steering sometime back then. Most riders just lean but that gives sloppy results. Counter steering is much more precise.
08-25-23, 04:30 PM
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But wait...Before it was steer into the turn as slow speeds. Counter steer at higher speeds. What speed is the tipping point between steering and counter-steering? At that point, is it both/neither? Maybe steer with the left and counter-steer with the right? This is confusing...
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08-25-23, 04:32 PM
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08-25-23, 04:33 PM
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Don't really know. I've been riding them for over 60 years. Many times down fast twisty trails. But I have no idea what I do. I think which way I want to go and the bike does that. And I don't even know if I lean first or turn the bars first. Maybe the bars turn themselves as I lean. What ever it is when the bike is going more than a few miles per hour, the bars don't get turned but a minute amount. Otherwise a larger movement would be followed by a wreck.
Probably quite a bit of difference whether we are turning to avoid a pothole or road hazard that appears out of nowhere, compared to turning around a bend in the road or a turn to another road.
Probably quite a bit of difference whether we are turning to avoid a pothole or road hazard that appears out of nowhere, compared to turning around a bend in the road or a turn to another road.
Last edited by Iride01; 08-25-23 at 04:37 PM.
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08-25-23, 04:35 PM
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I’m really not sure what speed makes the difference. As slow as bicycles are most riders actually lean into the turn instead of counter steering.
I was raised on a Honda motorcycle-dad was a Honda mechanic starting in 1966. I learned about counter steering sometime back then. Most riders just lean but that gives sloppy results. Counter steering is much more precise.
I was raised on a Honda motorcycle-dad was a Honda mechanic starting in 1966. I learned about counter steering sometime back then. Most riders just lean but that gives sloppy results. Counter steering is much more precise.
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08-25-23, 04:39 PM
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08-25-23, 04:47 PM
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If you hang a set of fake bull onions on your bike, it will prevent you from steering it.
08-25-23, 04:53 PM
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08-25-23, 05:01 PM
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I’m really not sure what the physics are on a bicycle. Many times when trying to sprint I would lean my bicycle to each side as I pedal but I continue straight.
Maybe steering is magic?
08-25-23, 05:04 PM
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BT 5.1 & HDMI if going up a downhiller.
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08-25-23, 05:14 PM
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A road bike will countersteer itself. There's very little point in intentionally countersteering a road bike. I was watching videos of riderless bikes yesterday, and I thought it was interesting there was no evidence of countersteering.
People on descents with hairpins tend to countersteer naturally by steering out wide on the corner. Most of us don't even think of it as countersteering.
I have yet to try intentionally countersteering on my mtb. I figure it probably would help me
People on descents with hairpins tend to countersteer naturally by steering out wide on the corner. Most of us don't even think of it as countersteering.
I have yet to try intentionally countersteering on my mtb. I figure it probably would help me
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08-25-23, 05:19 PM
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The vast majority of turning is leaning. The faster yo go, the more it's about the lean. That is why toe/front wheel overlap only matters at low speeds; if your front tire hits your toe at speed, you have crashed or are in the procees.
I saw a video (probably by following a BF link) that had a guy rigging up a bike so it could be steered to the right and then had people try to turn left. They could not do it. Same thing when he reversed it (no left tun possible, riders asked to turn right). His asserted conclusion was that all turns on a bike begin with a little bit of counter-steer, which induces a little bit of lean in the direction you want to turn, at which point leaning and turning in the direction you want to go takes over. It all happens so fast and you have taught yourself to react so quickly that you don't notice the initial little bit of counter-steer.
It sure sounds counter-intuitive, but the video was pretty compelling (an pretty humorous).
I saw a video (probably by following a BF link) that had a guy rigging up a bike so it could be steered to the right and then had people try to turn left. They could not do it. Same thing when he reversed it (no left tun possible, riders asked to turn right). His asserted conclusion was that all turns on a bike begin with a little bit of counter-steer, which induces a little bit of lean in the direction you want to turn, at which point leaning and turning in the direction you want to go takes over. It all happens so fast and you have taught yourself to react so quickly that you don't notice the initial little bit of counter-steer.
It sure sounds counter-intuitive, but the video was pretty compelling (an pretty humorous).
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08-25-23, 06:31 PM
#25
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The vast majority of turning is leaning. The faster yo go, the more it's about the lean. That is why toe/front wheel overlap only matters at low speeds; if your front tire hits your toe at speed, you have crashed or are in the procees.
I saw a video (probably by following a BF link) that had a guy rigging up a bike so it could be steered to the right and then had people try to turn left. They could not do it. Same thing when he reversed it (no left tun possible, riders asked to turn right). His asserted conclusion was that all turns on a bike begin with a little bit of counter-steer, which induces a little bit of lean in the direction you want to turn, at which point leaning and turning in the direction you want to go takes over. It all happens so fast and you have taught yourself to react so quickly that you don't notice the initial little bit of counter-steer.
It sure sounds counter-intuitive, but the video was pretty compelling (an pretty humorous).
I saw a video (probably by following a BF link) that had a guy rigging up a bike so it could be steered to the right and then had people try to turn left. They could not do it. Same thing when he reversed it (no left tun possible, riders asked to turn right). His asserted conclusion was that all turns on a bike begin with a little bit of counter-steer, which induces a little bit of lean in the direction you want to turn, at which point leaning and turning in the direction you want to go takes over. It all happens so fast and you have taught yourself to react so quickly that you don't notice the initial little bit of counter-steer.
It sure sounds counter-intuitive, but the video was pretty compelling (an pretty humorous).