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1971 Peugeot PX-10 Time Capsule

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1971 Peugeot PX-10 Time Capsule

Old 06-11-20, 02:11 AM
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Brad L
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1971 Peugeot PX-10 Time Capsule

I bought this 1971 PX-10 a few days ago and it appears to be completely original and very low mileage. The tires are possibly original, as the rims show very little wear on the braking surfaces, but any maker's name has long since disintegrated. The chainrings, though greasy, are not worn, and the freewheel teeth are in very nice condition. I believe the Sedis chain may be original as well, and if so, is in amazing condition. The Brooks Professional saddle is in great shape, but a bit stiff, so I have a tin of Proofide on the way. There are a few scuffs and scratches in the paint, but nothing serious. There's a city license sticker dated 1975 on the seat tube. Unfortunately the Delrin front derailleur mount is cracked in the typical location. A friend is sending me a replacement.

Everything seems to be correct. It has Stronglight 93 cranks with 45/52 chainrings, Stronglight headset, Ava stem and bars, Mafac Racer brakes, Lyotard 45CA pedals with Christophe clips and Lapize straps, Normandy Luxe Competition hubs with Mavic Montlery Championnat du Monde rims, and a Cyclo Competition freewheel.

The best part is, it's my size (52ctc). Plans are for a complete, sympathetic refurbishment to put it back on the road. A Stronglight crank puller is on the way, as is a set of Kool Stop brake pads. I'll be buying replacement cables as soon as I can find some in stock (any suggestions?).









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Old 06-11-20, 02:15 AM
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More photos.








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Old 06-11-20, 02:20 AM
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And a few more.









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Old 06-11-20, 03:09 AM
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Looks like it was ridden once and squirreled away.
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Old 06-11-20, 03:11 AM
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Very nice!!

I think you should at least replace the tires though...
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Old 06-11-20, 05:02 AM
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Wow, talk about a "time capsule!" What a great find! Amazes me that, with so much long term heat damage to the tires, cables, half hoods, and front derailleur, the Brooks saddle looks like new as well!
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Old 06-11-20, 05:46 AM
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Congrats on a great find! Hope it is your size! I bought a UO 8 in 1968/9 or so. Didn't want to spend the extra for a PX 10. One of the mistakes in life that is memorable. Deep down, I would like to have one now but finding one in my size would be a challenge along with the effort to "resotre" what is frequently available when found.
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Old 06-11-20, 06:07 AM
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Very nice, congrats on a great find! I picked up a '72 a few years back, it had been hanging upside down on a wall in the owner's game room/man cave. Judging from the layer of dust on the underside of the saddle and elsewhere it had been there for at least 35-40 years and lightly ridden before that. The only non-original part on it was a Campy/Weinmann 27" wheelset, not the worst thing to have swapped in.

I got brake cables/housings from PorkchopBMX (large variety at a good price but nothing ribbed like the originals) and Rustines Mafac half hoods repros off the 'Bay.

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Old 06-11-20, 06:41 AM
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I love it!! Time capsule indeed
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Old 06-11-20, 07:17 AM
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Cool. I was given a 72 PX-10 by the original owner a year or so ago. It is complete except he had 700c rims laced to the original hubs. It was ridden a fair bit and not in the condition yours is in. Have fun with it.
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Old 06-11-20, 07:26 AM
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https://www.ebay.com/itm/RIBBED-OUTE...72.m2749.l2649
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Old 06-11-20, 08:01 AM
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Whew, like a flashback.
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Old 06-11-20, 08:21 AM
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Not only is that a time capsule, that's a really nicely brazed example too. The previous owners couldn't have picked a better one to preserve all these years!

-Kurt
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Old 06-11-20, 08:40 AM
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Plans are for a complete, sympathetic refurbishment to put it back on the road. A Stronglight crank puller is on the way, as is a set of Kool Stop brake pads. I'll be buying replacement cables as soon as I can find some in stock (any suggestions?)
...these were popping up on the local CL here about ten or fifteen years ago in the $400 range, so I've reworked a total of six of them, and I sent one frame that was too big for me to Frank the Welder some years back as well. My suggestion (if you plan on using it for a regular rider and plan on riding it fast), would be maybe rethinking your ideas on what a sympathetic refurbishment might involve.

These are a great starting point for a fun ride, but there are certain parts of the original equipment that have been so improved over time, that replacing them with something more practical makes sense. If you are more interested in a complete, original, as it was first sold project ignore anything I say here.

The stems they put on these in this time period usually suck, and although your original stem and bar there are probably good for a while (because little ridden), eventually the bar will start to sag and the stems are prone to breaking. The solidest and most easily sourced practical replacement is something scrounged used from a made in Japan or made in Taiwan scrapper, with a forged stem (like an SR) and a bar with a center sleeve reinforcement. You'll need to sand down the insertion of the stem to fit the 22.0 steerer, but that takes only minutes to accomplish. The original derailleur in the front are junk, and replacing one that has already self destructed with another (that will eventually also self destruct), makes no sense to me. There are plenty of front derailleurs that will work, but the clamp needs to fit down small enough to go on the metric 531 frame tubing, which is smaller than the other stuff.

I've got wide feet, so those original pedals don't work for me. Your feet might be different. And I would rather not ride on tubular tyres and rims, because they are a royal PIA. Those original hubs are great, MAFAC brakes are good to wonderful, I genuinely like Stronglight cranks, and the rear derailleur is workable, if you don't push it or try to get too much range out of it. They were the introduction to a nice, 531 framed bike for a lot of us, because they sold them cheaper than most anyone else managed to do for a similar 531, brazed frame. So iconic in that respect. Enjoy yours.

A couple of pictures of ones I have reworked, so you can see how what I'm talking about looks, and decide if you can live with it.


Prugnat

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Old 06-11-20, 09:00 AM
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Originally Posted by SJX426 View Post
Congrats on a great find! Hope it is your size!
That's the best part - it IS my size!
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Old 06-11-20, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by 3alarmer View Post
...these were popping up on the local CL here about ten or fifteen years ago in the $400 range, so I've reworked a total of six of them, and I sent one frame that was too big for me to Frank the Welder some years back as well. My suggestion (if you plan on using it for a regular rider and plan on riding it fast), would be maybe rethinking your ideas on what a sympathetic refurbishment might involve.

These are a great starting point for a fun ride, but there are certain parts of the original equipment that have been so improved over time, that replacing them with something more practical makes sense. If you are more interested in a complete, original, as it was first sold project ignore anything I say here.

The stems they put on these in this time period usually suck, and although your original stem and bar there are probably good for a while (because little ridden), eventually the bar will start to sag and the stems are prone to breaking. The solidest and most easily sourced practical replacement is something scrounged used from a made in Japan or made in Taiwan scrapper, with a forged stem (like an SR) and a bar with a center sleeve reinforcement. You'll need to sand down the insertion of the stem to fit the 22.0 steerer, but that takes only minutes to accomplish. The original derailleur in the front are junk, and replacing one that has already self destructed with another (that will eventually also self destruct), makes no sense to me. There are plenty of front derailleurs that will work, but the clamp needs to fit down small enough to go on the metric 531 frame tubing, which is smaller than the other stuff.

I've got wide feet, so those original pedals don't work for me. Your feet might be different. And I would rather not ride on tubular tyres and rims, because they are a royal PIA. Those original hubs are great, MAFAC brakes are good to wonderful, I genuinely like Stronglight cranks, and the rear derailleur is workable, if you don't push it or try to get too much range out of it. They were the introduction to a nice, 531 framed bike for a lot of us, because they sold them cheaper than most anyone else managed to do for a similar 531, brazed frame. So iconic in that respect. Enjoy yours.
Thanks for the input. I've read quite a bit about these in the past few days and have learned most, if not all, of their idiosyncrasies.

I'll evaluate the stem once I've removed it. If it has double slots, it will be replaced. I'm 5'-7" and 135 lbs., so I'm not too worried about it if it has the single, tapered slot, as I've read these are more reliable for lighter riders. My size also works in my favor for the pedals. Concerning the front derailleur, I'm a stickler for originality, so I'll try another Simplex Prestige before moving on. I've even knocked around the idea of having the Delrin mount scanned, then printed in a more durable material, maybe even aluminum, then painted black. Though, I'm sure it's cost prohibitive. The wheels will be rebuilt as original, but if I feel the need for clinchers, I can swap out the wheels from my 1983 Gitane, which has 700x28 Paselas on Mavic Module E rims and the same O.L.D.

I'll post the refurbishment on the C&V page, and would appreciate any input. This will be an interesting journey as I'm relatively new to C&V, and will only be my second resto.
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Old 06-11-20, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by cocoabeachcrab View Post
This is perfect, except for the "Does not ship to United States" part. Thanks for the thought.
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Old 06-11-20, 09:51 AM
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odd... must be new change in policy as i have an order from that seller for that very item on it way to me. sorry about that!
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Old 06-11-20, 10:06 AM
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bradl When I purchased my UO 8, I included a set of clinchers that had Rigida 1320's. With the option, I would use the clinchers for most rides, which included commuting to work, and use the sew-ups for fun rides. BITD there was a significant difference between the two. I was sold on the sew-ups with the improved performance.
My wife's 1974 Raleigh Gran Prix has the same set of derailleurs. The band has not broken but I need to find a replacement.
3ttt made a stem for French steerers. My 1972 Motobecane Le Champ came with one. I have seen them on CL upon occasion.
LC_Stem, on Flickr
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Old 06-11-20, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by SJX426 View Post
3ttt made a stem for French steerers. My 1972 Motobecane Le Champ came with one. I have seen them on CL upon occasion.
I have a few options, some more problematic than others. Finding a French size Cinelli or 3ttt may be the most difficult. On the easiest side, I have a friend who's a long-time frame builder that reamed out the steerer tube of my 83 Gitane to fit a standard stem size. At this point, all options are open, including using the original.
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Old 06-11-20, 11:34 AM
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Are you sure it fits? That's at least an inch more seatpost than should be showing. Not sure if that's your ride height or just where the it is now. If you're comfortable on that size, that's fine, but I'd suggest you install a longer modern seatpost. Vintage ones were short because of the sizing standards of the day, and if the post is raised too high the seat lug can break.

Mighty fine PX10 find for sure. That's about the cleanest one I've seen.

The stem and bars on these were pretty dubious, as others have mentioned. Stem is a bigger danger though. It might last forever with no problems, or it could break unexpectedly. Eddy Merckx swapped out his PX10 bar and stem for Cinelli...

Simplex derailleurs shift perfectly well if properly adjusted and set up. There are two problems. Not many people these days have experience adjusting old push rod derailleurs, and the delrin plastic is now 50 years old. The plastic portion of the front derailleur is in tension, and they will eventually crack because the plastic has gotten old and brittle and lost its tensile strength. People slag the rear derailleurs all the time, but I've actually never seen a broken one. BTW if anyone has a pic of a dead Simplex RD, please share. Surely someone has snapped one. There were so many...

One additional issue is that they are optimized to work with the gearing of the time. If a 14-23 and 45/52 or maybe 42/52 doesn't cut it for you, the Simplex derailleurs aren't going to be optimum.

Originally Posted by SJX426 View Post
3ttt made a stem for French steerers. My 1972 Motobecane Le Champ came with one. I have seen them on CL upon occasion.
FYI, the standard non-french 22.2 version of those 3TTT stems were slightly undersized and often would fit a french steerer. Old timer bike shop hack knowledge.... If they don't fit as is, because they are polished instead of anodized, it's pretty easy to sand and repolish to make them fit. The french 22.0 ones are out there, but must be pretty rare by now.
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Old 06-11-20, 11:52 AM
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.
...here are some pictures I took of the bar/stem combination I removed and retired from one of my project bikes.This one was originally sold in Germany, and I bought it from the original ownerhere in the Bay Area. He had worn out just about everything on that bike. Which was how I ended up with the frame I sent to Frank, from a donor bike.



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Old 06-11-20, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Salamandrine View Post
FYI, the standard non-french 22.2 version of those 3TTT stems were slightly undersized and often would fit a french steerer. Old timer bike shop hack knowledge.... If they don't fit as is, because they are polished instead of anodized, it's pretty easy to sand and repolish to make them fit. The french 22.0 ones are out there, but must be pretty rare by now.
FWIW, the same is true for the Origin8 Classique quill stem on the market now -- marked as 22.2, but fits in a French steerer without modification. It's available in a few different sizes that I know of, length of 60mm, 80mm or 100mm, clamp 25.4 or 26.0.
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Old 06-11-20, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Salamandrine View Post
Are you sure it fits? That's at least an inch more seatpost than should be showing. Not sure if that's your ride height or just where the it is now. If you're comfortable on that size, that's fine, but I'd suggest you install a longer modern seatpost. Vintage ones were short because of the sizing standards of the day, and if the post is raised too high the seat lug can break.

Mighty fine PX10 find for sure. That's about the cleanest one I've seen.

The stem and bars on these were pretty dubious, as others have mentioned. Stem is a bigger danger though. It might last forever with no problems, or it could break unexpectedly. Eddy Merckx swapped out his PX10 bar and stem for Cinelli...

Simplex derailleurs shift perfectly well if properly adjusted and set up. There are two problems. Not many people these days have experience adjusting old push rod derailleurs, and the delrin plastic is now 50 years old. The plastic portion of the front derailleur is in tension, and they will eventually crack because the plastic has gotten old and brittle and lost its tensile strength. People slag the rear derailleurs all the time, but I've actually never seen a broken one. BTW if anyone has a pic of a dead Simplex RD, please share. Surely someone has snapped one. There were so many...

One additional issue is that they are optimized to work with the gearing of the time. If a 14-23 and 45/52 or maybe 42/52 doesn't cut it for you, the Simplex derailleurs aren't going to be optimum.
The current saddle height is because I had it raised to fit the seatpost in the jaws of my workstand. It fits.

The derailleur problems will be a bit of an evolution. It'll try another mount for the front derailleur, and if it cracks, I'll use a later Simplex model (staying French). The SJA 102 on my Gitane shifts fine. I'll keep the Stronglight crankset and see what I can do about a smaller inner ring, or larger cogs on the freewheel. It'll all work out.
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Old 06-11-20, 01:11 PM
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Brad L-

Since you are sticking to originality, if the front Simplex your friend sends you has a red disc on the body lubrication port it's a Prestige. Typically, PX 10s had Criteriums front and rear and your front Criterium will have a chrome plated alloy band the the silver coloured disc on the body. Pry off the red disc from the Prestige, squirt lube inside the derailleur body, swap out the Prestige dull alloy for the Criterium's chrome attachment band and, viola, a "new" Criterium replacement front derailleur. Check the hub bearings carefully. The Competition Luxe use a unique cone design contour and if over tightened will pit and be almost irreplaceable. Adjust carefully when re-lubing. A 37T inner ring is available from Red Clover: 122 BCD Conventional Chainring, 37 Teeth
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