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When do you realize you were a retro-grouch?

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When do you realize you were a retro-grouch?

Old 07-08-20, 05:19 AM
  #126  
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Modern bikes aren't any better than classic bikes, just different. They haven't developed their own songs yet. Modern bikes are like buying all your music through digital downloads. You can carry it all on your phone and take it anywhere. Convenient, surely, however it will never compare to listening to old vinyl on a Linn Sondek turntable, running through a sweet old MacIntosh and a pair of Klipschorns.
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Old 07-08-20, 06:10 AM
  #127  
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Originally Posted by J.Higgins View Post
Modern bikes aren't any better than classic bikes, just different. They haven't developed their own songs yet. Modern bikes are like buying all your music through digital downloads. You can carry it all on your phone and take it anywhere. Convenient, surely, however it will never compare to listening to old vinyl on a Linn Sondek turntable, running through a sweet old MacIntosh and a pair of Klipschorns.
Agreed............Thorens, Sherwood (tube) and Altec VOT for me...
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Old 07-08-20, 08:40 AM
  #128  
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I understand that Rivendell is coming out with a line of wool pants with leather pockets large enough to fit a rotary-dial telephone.
Brent
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Old 07-08-20, 08:44 AM
  #129  
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Originally Posted by obrentharris View Post
I understand that Rivendell is coming out with a line of wool pants with leather pockets large enough to fit a rotary-dial telephone.
Brent

That is hilarious!
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Old 07-08-20, 09:47 AM
  #130  
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Old 07-08-20, 10:24 AM
  #131  
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Perfesser Lerner ftw!
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Old 07-08-20, 10:33 AM
  #132  
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Found it: Retrogrouch: Retrogrouch: Etymology, Definition, Reference

Fred Zahradnik:

"Those who use the word are often asked: "Where did it come from and what does it really mean?" I believe I am the first person to use the word, in an editorial titled "Techies Unite!" in the May (not positive about the month but will verify when I can) 1990 edition of Bicycling Magazine.

There's the claim, links to earlier claimed usage are encouraged, if you can find it.

edit: it as in the June 1990 edition of Bicyclng Magazine, and SpeedofLight posted it here on the forums.
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Last edited by gugie; 07-08-20 at 10:51 AM.
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Old 07-08-20, 10:59 AM
  #133  
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Now someone needs to come up with that article. Maybe @SpeedofLite, who seems to be angling for the job of C&V retro-librarian.
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Old 07-08-20, 10:59 AM
  #134  
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Originally Posted by gugie View Post
The question: Originally Posted by SpeedofLite View Post
"I wonder when the term "retro-grouch" first gained popularity among cyclists."

Is your answer still Henri Desgrange?

If so, please post where this claim was made. My french is merde, maybe I missed it?
The actual term, not so much. The attitude in cycling? Definitely.

Do you think though it predates Henri? Maybe when safety bikes were all the rage some old bastard was upset at the loss of high wheelers? But really nothing much changed until those new-fangled multi-gear bikes. Flies in the face of Rule #5 . You people griping about sti and carbon are soft like the Pillsbury dough boy.
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Old 07-08-20, 11:37 AM
  #135  
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Retro-grouch?

When did I realize it? ? When I purchased my first new bike ever. A 1992 Bridgestone MB-4. There were other bikes that I could have bought at the time with Rapidfire shifting, suspension, etc., but I loved the thumbies (still do), and the rest of the spec as well as the lugged frame. It was a toss up between that or a Breezer (Sky?), but the lugged frame won out.

My wife used it for a while, now my youngest daughter (32) has it. I now have a couple of lugged frames and love the ride. None are super stupid crazy and were all used. Oh, and all are good steel.
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Old 07-08-20, 11:57 AM
  #136  
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Originally Posted by iab View Post
The actual term, not so much. The attitude in cycling? Definitely.

Do you think though it predates Henri? Maybe when safety bikes were all the rage some old bastard was upset at the loss of high wheelers? But really nothing much changed until those new-fangled multi-gear bikes. Flies in the face of Rule #5 . You people griping about sti and carbon are soft like the Pillsbury dough boy.
My answer was to the OP, but I'm sure the concept of retrogrouch was around when the first caveman to strike fire to cook meat, Grob said to Bleek, "what, you can't just eat it raw?"

I don't gripe about STI and carbon, my personal preference is friction and steel. And I'm in a small minority, obviously, based on what I see people riding on, even here in Portlandia where retro is practically the area's motto. "Some of my best friends ride carbon."

I brought up Grant Petersen as a tongue-in-cheek comment, if you ask most "vintage aged" cyclists to name a cycling retro grouch, I'm pretty sure Grant's name would come #1 on a Pareto list.
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Old 07-08-20, 12:04 PM
  #137  
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Originally Posted by Charles Wahl View Post
Now someone needs to come up with that article. Maybe @SpeedofLite, who seems to be angling for the job of C&V retro-librarian.
Charles,

I found it and edited my response, just above yours. July 1990 Bicycling magazine has it.
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Old 07-08-20, 12:28 PM
  #138  
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I was born with a cycling cap and greasepaint moustache, so it was more "retro groucho."
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Old 07-08-20, 02:49 PM
  #139  
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Originally Posted by gugie View Post
I found it and edited my response, just above yours. July June 1990 Bicycling magazine has it.
Well he lays out the belief systems well enough, but he doesn't convince me -- just toes his party line. It's a similar situation in the guitar/amp world. I feel strongly that somehow, in many areas of our lives, there was a time when things worked well enough, even superbly, and then innovators came along and pretty much spoiled things for a lot of us "hands-on" people (as opposed to "users") by making them more complicated, more expensive to operate, and ultimately less satisfying. While I'm turned off by proselytizers, I do appreciate where GP is coming from, and so do a lot of people -- similarly, there's a market for brand-new guitars and amps made "the old way". I think that the stress should be on retro, though, and not on grouch. When I rent a car, I'm happy to drive the whiz-bang contraption that modern automotive technology has given us for several days, but I would not care to own one, and have to deal with its maintenance. I notice that Zahradnik is now in digital marketing, rather than cycling media, and is happily guiding a Trek carbon rocket around. More power to him, but I seem to have drunk the other Kool-Aid.

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Old 07-08-20, 02:59 PM
  #140  
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Originally Posted by Charles Wahl View Post
Well he lays out the belief systems well enough, but he doesn't convince me -- just toes his party line. It's a similar situation in the guitar/amp world. I feel strongly that somehow, in many areas of our lives, there was a time when things worked well enough, even superbly, and then innovators came along and pretty much spoiled things for a lot of us "hands-on" people (as opposed to "users") by making them more complicated, more expensive to operate, and ultimately less satisfying. While I'm turned off by proselytizers, I do appreciate where GP is coming from, and so do a lot of people -- similarly, there's a market for brand-new guitars and amps made "the old way". I think that the stress should be on retro, though, and not on grouch. When I rent a car, I'm happy to drive the whiz-bang contraption that modern automotive technology has given us for several days, but I would not care to own one, and have to deal with its maintenance. I notice that Zahradnik is now in digital marketing, rather than cycling media, and is happily guiding a Trek carbon rocket around. More power to him, but I seem to have drunk the other Kool-Aid.
Thanks for the date fix - I had it right on my edited post, I'll just leave the other one to show that I'm getting old, just like my bikes.
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Old 07-08-20, 04:25 PM
  #141  
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Originally Posted by J.Higgins View Post
Modern bikes aren't any better than classic bikes, just different. They haven't developed their own songs yet. Modern bikes are like buying all your music through digital downloads. You can carry it all on your phone and take it anywhere. Convenient, surely, however it will never compare to listening to old vinyl on a Linn Sondek turntable, running through a sweet old MacIntosh and a pair of Klipschorns.
No, I celebrated CDs because they brought back the old vinyl that I thought was gone for good. I got turned onto the old blues as a teen. Early '80s I started cassette taping my records just to extend their life, thinking that might be my only link to the music I love. Then CDs came. I saw the re-records of records I knew but never owned that i thought were gone for good. So digital CD yes - but to play the old music, re-mastered from analog tapes!

But, I play those CDs over JBL bookshelf speakers that are smaller, better versions of the 1971 Advents I still have. The JBLs sound the same, just a lot cleaner treble and less bass being smaller. The Advents are tucked away in the back corners still producing that wonderful bass. (And yeah, I've replaced the AR amp with a Marantz. Big step up, And for my old vinyl? An equally old AR turntable.

My favorite and most played CD - a 1959 recording of the Chess Records music genius, Willie Dixon, but recorded on the road at the Van Gelder's (sp) premier jazz studio in New Jersey with his long time partner, Memphis Slim and 3 very good, no-name studio musicians. "Willie's Blues" All first takes. (You can hear the sax player hit a wrong first note a couple of times!) One afternoon. Everyone is right in tune and the recording was clean like recordings of the day of the blues never were.

Ben
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Old 07-08-20, 04:25 PM
  #142  
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Retro-grouch? I'm enough of a retro-grouch to be consider in the high-risk group. I'm not sure how grouchy I am though.
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Old 07-08-20, 08:33 PM
  #143  
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Originally Posted by jimmuller View Post
Retro-grouch? I'm enough of a retro-grouch to be consider in the high-risk group. I'm not sure how grouchy I am though.
Pretty much everyone in this section of the forums are retro by definition.
Some are more grouchy than others.
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Old 07-09-20, 05:57 AM
  #144  
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My problem is a sense of urgency. I feel like time is running out. I've been into this since 1972, and the longer I live, the more I want to just simply suck up everything I can concerning bikes. I'm obsessed with studying.
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Old 07-09-20, 08:29 AM
  #145  
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I'm only a partial retro grouch I don't like all the hydro formed tubing, and neat CF frame shapes even if I know they're better than pretty lugs and round tubes. I do like modern groups, wheels, disc brakes, bottom brackets, handlebars etc. I'm more a "restomod" kinda guy I just wish we could get some more silver, every thing is so black.

What I really don't like is cotton bar tape, and 80's saddles (vetta makes me cringe)
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