Junkboyjude

Well I sit here in saudi dreaming about bikes and looking at eBay and what not. The question I have is there any way to really tell if a particular frame was braised by Confente ? Such a shame that there aren't better records of who built what etc. Just dreaming and counting the days down until I can go home and start on my bike again

Chombi1 

Confente made bikes, being a finite item that collectors of such would like to hold on to and only sell to the highest bidder. The chances of most of us ever finding and affording such a bike must be similar to winning a lottery jackpot.....

Kactus

You can find some info here:
Victoria bicycle parts: Confente and Masi Part II

repechage

That would be telling.

For reasonable reference you could visit

bhovey.com

and select the bicycles section.

Ex Pres 

I hope he wasn't braising them, as I doubt they'll ever get tender

But there was a recent discussion over on the CR list about "Confente" Masis, with some pics of supposed clues. The problem is, did he ever really braze one of these frames that appear to show his handiwork - from start to finish, or did he just do a portion and pass the frame on down the line, or maybe that "tell-tale" difference was, on any particular frame, just him looking over another brazer's shoulder. Who knows?

The only way to know is to buy that real Confente.

Junkboyjude

I have been over the Hovey website start to finish. Love it. That's the source I have used to date my GC as a 1975. It's serial number 930. I did find out that a lot of confente builds have the drilled rear dropouts which appear on most of the Confente bikes I have seen pictures of, mine how ever does not have the drilled drop Outs lol. So I guess I can quit wondering. I can still dream of him looking at my frame and thinking "yes this will do, good job (insert name)"
As far as buying one I would could see giving 10,000 or more for a Confente one day. Save save save

abellanti

I think there is still a Masi frame/ or bike on ebay with the drilled dropouts..fair condition for $2,000 starting bid: has been relisted seveal times...but...did he build it????

Junkboyjude

Yes I saw it. Who knows that's the thing with the masi builds is save one that I saw with a letter or some sort of documentation from Alberto Masi himself stating that Mario had built the bike you never know I guess. To be able to purchase a Confente. What a dream !!

satbuilder 

From Charles Andrews on the CR list. Photos and an explanation.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/210782...57684153231754

SteelCharlie

If it is not possible to discern the identity (build quality or performance) of the particular builder then I have to wonder why it is a matter of any concern? I mean, at that point, if the difference cannot be told, who GAF?

If you want authenticated absolutely beautiful builds and performance then those by Mr. Baylis, who also built at Masi USA, would be a worthy pursuit. As well a a number of others.

Cult bikes are fine for trading around with the believers but what are you really getting for the $ besides the opportunity to sell it up to another believer? (I almost wrote "sucker")

JMO of course - - WTF do I know?

Salamandrine 

Without the tragic story and premature passing of Mr. Confente, I doubt very much that there'd be such a legend today, and corresponding high value placed on his bikes. I tend to agree with SteelCharlie. My Masi is a Lippy build, and it's perhaps the nicest Masi I've seen - and I've seen a lot, yet without the legend there is no particular value.

I'm no expert but I've heard a lot of stories over the years. The link that Kactus posted shows some pretty good clues. I suspect that you could say Confente had a part in building all the early Masi (California) frames, but I don't know how many he built entirely himself, and if so if any of these were actually marked or noted.

abellanti

It's simply supply and demand with any collectables. It's part of the game for many who are looking for the rarest of the rare...we all buy and or collect for many reasons. Many of us just enjoy riding bikes and could really care less who built it. I'm kinda in between, but on a low budget scale.

Wildwood 

I like to ride really nice vintage bikes.
That's enough for me.

I used to want to be an astronaut; being a private pilot was fun for a while, but then I learned the air is not rarefied up there.
I used to collect some paintings (no classic Greats), but after relocating a few times they became a liability, so to speak.

Guess i'm just a country boy at heart, with no connoisseur genes in my end of the pool.

qcpmsame 

At this point in your C&V life, the beginning, just enjoy the fact you have a Masi. Most of us would have given parts of our male anatomy for one at some time or another. The attention to detail you've shown up until now should give you a fantastic rider, that looks absolutely magnificent and has enough cache' for two bikes.

Perhaps the person still supposedly holding the build list for the CA Masi could identify yours, but I have a feeling this is almost a myth, or vaporware. If someone here knows of its existence please give Jude a direction to who has the information. I won't say the individuals identity, I am not certain they are advertising this to the public, I have only read tales about its existence. If its true there are some really knowledgeable people here with the inside on Masi, you know who you are. This is my best shot at identifying who built your Masi Jude.

As I ride a Medici, the Anti-Masi according to Mario, I'm not one to dwell on who built my bike. Probably not possible unless someone has the book on them, right now being able to see the other owners listed on the on-line spreadsheet registry. It has been a joy to build it and to ride it regularly, and it holds a special place in my heart regardless of its heritage.

Be safe over there in the sandbox, don't take a kick on any of the holes y'all drill and get back to SW Alabama in one piece so we can ride some.

Bill

KonAaron Snake 

I think a fair number of people, including frame builders, would tell you that, while nice, Confente bikes aren't any more "special" than those of a lot of other builders. I'm fairly sure that Baylis has said as much. I doubt most Confente owners would disagree, and we have at least one here. The reason Confente bikes are so prized is because he built so few of them, it's because of his influence on Masi and early US customs and because of the romance around the brand. That's not to say the value isn't justified...or the market irrational...but it is to say that they aren't prized because they're more magical than many other bikes.

Frankly a lot of the appeal is because a lot of others want them and are willing to spend a lot of money...and that appeal certainly isn't unique to Confente. The club that you can't get into is sexier than the one asking you to join.

qcpmsame 

Many do care about which frame builder from a certain marque did their frame. What Aaron said above is spot on, and couple the scarcity of Confente bikes/frames, along with some serious attention to detail he normally applied they command a premium price. Some are convinced they are worth it, other could care less about them. It all is depending on the person and the bike to me.

Road Bike Action Magazine did an article series earlier this year, From The Pro's Corner, and its first installment was one of the Confente bikes that Pro's Closet happened to have in their collection. You could see the extra time Mario had spent on various details, and the difference where it had been modified since its inception. Just small things that most folks would not even notice, but they showed up against the rest of the bike. It was a blue one, and very drool worthy, IMHO.

They had Jim Cunningham, who had painted some of the Masi and Confente frames and he pointed out where it was changed easily. Personally, I couldn't have even known that it had any flaws or changes, it was just a frame set you would not hesitate to buy and build if you had the coins. But in my case, that ain't in the cards, in this lifetime at least.

Bill

repechage

I think Brian would have corrected you on the tasks he did at during his tenure at Masi.
He built wheels, installed tires, toe straps (no simple task actually) painted, applied transfers, filed components, sub assemblies and frames. Learned and watched carefully torch work. This from talking to him and reading his old CR Bikelist.org posts. Much was learned from Faliero and later Mario, he and his co-workers who stayed in the bike biz got rare peek into how it was done in Italy, in the USA.

SteelCharlie

I, of course, instantly cop to totally lacking the collector gene. I do appreciate a fine build and ride everything I have. OK, that's a lie - the Sannino remains a frameset waiting on restoration.
No matter his tasks at Masi. The work I've seen with Mr. Baylis' name on them are as fine as can be imagined. As much a standard for excellence as any that could be named.

again, JMO

Chombi1 

Thing is, a majority of C&Vers, most likely had never even heard of builders like Confente till they joined this forum and noticed the hubbub around the guy in many threads posted.
Frankly, I was one of those and I'm still wondering what really makes a Confente bike so special to his fans.....
Do they ride much better than many other top line bikes. Was the brazing and lug prep far superior to other builder's? Frankly, on the surface, I do not really see anything that fantastic on examples of bikes he built that I've viewed. Yes, they look like very well crafted bikes, but am I missing something super special/unique about them that my non-Confente familiar eyes could not notice?....... educate me.....
Confente's gone a long time already, but his legend seems to thrive. It would be nice to have some sort of (tangible) reference maybe physically from his creations that reinforces why he continues to be missed and admired so much........Maybe he was just such a great guy, and that could be enough for many of us....
Now about Galmozzis........

KonAaron Snake 

Dude - chicken on a hub headbadge...and that seat stay!

qcpmsame 

Maybe when the time is right, should you choose to, your Sannino will get built, that should be an interesting one to observe, not many around that I have noticed. Yours will be the first I have watched, if you do a build thread.

I haven't seen a Wizard, by Baylis, in the flesh, but looking at examples of them, at CR and elsewhere shows. some nice looking, well thought out frame sets and bicycles. His painting on top of the framebuilding skills are eye pleasing.

No harm in not being attuned to the collector frequency, I am not of that school either, my two are quite satisfactory, and I can just fine tune their restorations. Many different ways to look at, and partake of in the C&V world.

Bill