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Wahoo Elemnt - transferring routes from a tablet

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Wahoo Elemnt - transferring routes from a tablet

Old 09-07-18, 04:25 PM
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Wahoo Elemnt - transferring routes from a tablet

Hi all,
i know I can connect my Elemnt directly to my PC and transfer routes onto the unit directly, bypassing the app totally.
I'm wondering if the same is possible from a tablet, or even a phone?
Anyone done this with any success?

I'm trying to avoid the need for a wifi/data connection.

Thanks
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Old 09-07-18, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by HobbesOnTour
Hi all,
i know I can connect my Elemnt directly to my PC and transfer routes onto the unit directly, bypassing the app totally.
I'm wondering if the same is possible from a tablet, or even a phone?
Anyone done this with any success?

I'm trying to avoid the need for a wifi/data connection.

Thanks
I don't see any way of doing this without an internet connection.

What you can do is import the route into RWGPS, Garmin Connect or Strava and then link that account to the Wahoo computer. The routes can then be available on the unit.

J
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Old 09-07-18, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnJ80
I don't see any way of doing this without an internet connection.

What you can do is import the route into RWGPS, Garmin Connect or Strava and then link that account to the Wahoo computer. The routes can then be available on the unit.

J
Thanks John. Importing the routes via wifi is not a problem.
By connecting the unit directly to the PC, I can import a gpx or tcx file directly onto the unit - no internet required. It bypasses the app completely.
I'd like to do the same from a tablet (or even a phone!)
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Old 09-07-18, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by HobbesOnTour
Thanks John. Importing the routes via wifi is not a problem.
By connecting the unit directly to the PC, I can import a gpx or tcx file directly onto the unit - no internet required. It bypasses the app completely.
I'd like to do the same from a tablet (or even a phone!)
The most you can do is open the fit/tcx/gpx on your tablet by clicking on it and selections “Open in...” then select “Copy to Elemnt” whichnis the Wahoo phone app. Then it will copy the route to the bike computer via Bluetooth. But you cannot do it via cable. At least that’s the process in iOS.

So so you have to get the file onto the tablet or in another app. I’ll try it and see.
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Old 09-08-18, 01:50 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnJ80


The most you can do is open the fit/tcx/gpx on your tablet by clicking on it and selections “Open in...” then select “Copy to Elemnt” whichnis the Wahoo phone app. Then it will copy the route to the bike computer via Bluetooth. But you cannot do it via cable. At least that’s the process in iOS.

So so you have to get the file onto the tablet or in another app. I’ll try it and see.
Hi John,
I haven't used IOS with the Elemnt, only android.
I've been using the device for over 2 years, mainly for navigation, so I (think!) I'm reasonably well versed on the process via the app.

But... I recently discovered I can bypass the app altogether by transferring the file directly from my PC to the unit via a standard USB cable.
From Wahoo: https://wahoofitness.yonyx.com/y/con...10d166&lang=en

Through a Mac or PC connection to the ELEMNT:

  1. Once the ELEMNT is connected to your Mac or PC (instructions here), you can drag and drop a route file (in either TCX or GPX format) into the ELEMNT's routes folder.
  2. When the transfer is complete, find the route by scrolling to your ELEMNT's Map page, then press ROUTE.
(Personally, I wish I had known this ages ago. Most of my routes are prepared on the computer. This is an easier process than emailing the gpx/trx file to my phone, then uploading to the app, and then transferring to the unit! )

So.... if it can be done from a PC, in my simple mind, it should be doable from a tablet. Tablets with a USB connection are few and far between, and I'm sure there's more to it than just a USB port. But there my technological knowledge starts to get cloudy.

Why do I want to do this?
I do a lot of long distance touring and it is not practical (nor enjoyable) to plan a week's ride (or longer) and stick rigidly to it.
When Wifi or data is available, it's not a problem to plan a new route on the fly.
However, I am looking for a solution when wifi/data is not available.

Currently, using OSMand on the tablet I can plan a route and transfer it to my phone all without internet. To load that route in the app needs a momentary internet connection, so this is where the process fails.

It is the app that requires the internet connection, not the unit.

If I can transfer the route directly to the Elemnt unit, bypassing the app, no internet connection is required and my issue is solved.

I then have a unit that will work anywhere, be re-routable anywhere, irrespective of data/wifi availability.

Thanks!
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Old 09-08-18, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by HobbesOnTour
Hi John,
I haven't used IOS with the Elemnt, only android.
I've been using the device for over 2 years, mainly for navigation, so I (think!) I'm reasonably well versed on the process via the app.

But... I recently discovered I can bypass the app altogether by transferring the file directly from my PC to the unit via a standard USB cable.
From Wahoo: https://wahoofitness.yonyx.com/y/con...10d166&lang=en


(Personally, I wish I had known this ages ago. Most of my routes are prepared on the computer. This is an easier process than emailing the gpx/trx file to my phone, then uploading to the app, and then transferring to the unit! )

So.... if it can be done from a PC, in my simple mind, it should be doable from a tablet. Tablets with a USB connection are few and far between, and I'm sure there's more to it than just a USB port. But there my technological knowledge starts to get cloudy.

Why do I want to do this?
I do a lot of long distance touring and it is not practical (nor enjoyable) to plan a week's ride (or longer) and stick rigidly to it.
When Wifi or data is available, it's not a problem to plan a new route on the fly.
However, I am looking for a solution when wifi/data is not available.

Currently, using OSMand on the tablet I can plan a route and transfer it to my phone all without internet. To load that route in the app needs a momentary internet connection, so this is where the process fails.

It is the app that requires the internet connection, not the unit.

If I can transfer the route directly to the Elemnt unit, bypassing the app, no internet connection is required and my issue is solved.

I then have a unit that will work anywhere, be re-routable anywhere, irrespective of data/wifi availability.

Thanks!
I am certain that you cannot transfer between the unit and the tablet with a usb cable under iOS. I’d also be fairly certain it less so that is also the case with android.

But the Elemnt has Bluetooth. So does the your your tablet. If you have the route as a gpx resident on your tablet however you’ve done that you can then get it into the Wahoo app and then from the Wahoo app onto the element via Bluetooth without the internet. The Bluetooth connection does not require the internet, it is a point to point connection to the Wahoo Elemnt that replaces the usb cable and is its direct analog in this example.

So so if you have the route on your tablet and you’re sitting in the middle of the wilderness miles
from the nearest internet connection, you can get that stored route on your tablet into the Wahoo app and into the Elemnt directly. There is no way to do that over a cable from a tablet to my knowledge. This Bluetooth method should actually be more reliable since you don’t have to deal with normal cable issues. Neither the cable nor Bluetooth transfer require the internet.

i May be wrong about android although I believe it’s similar in this regard on most tablets and phones, but they usually do not allow the mounting of external drives or devices in the manner described by Wahoo because this represents a big security issue for a phone or tablet. So they don’t usually mount an external file system in the way you can with a computer. Android may provide a way to hack around that but iOS doesn’t.

Either way, the net is the same. Presuming you have the route on your tablet you can get it to the Elemnt without needing anything but you element and your tablet.

Last edited by JohnJ80; 09-08-18 at 07:56 AM.
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Old 09-08-18, 08:09 AM
  #7  
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Originally Posted by JohnJ80
If you have the route as a gpx resident on your tablet however you’ve done that you can then get it into the Wahoo app and then from the Wahoo app onto the element via Bluetooth without the internet.
Yeah, that's the theory... unfortunately, the reality is different. To load a route into the app requires internet. Try it. Disconnect wifi & data. Select a gpx track that already exists on the phone /tablet. You cannot get it into the app without internet. (According to Wahoo it "pings" or "Checks in" to the Wahoo cloud database. No internet and you get the message about a corrupt file.

What I don't understand is that there is no need to do "check in" when the file is transferred by cable directly to the unit. It just works.

So, what software is it that sits on my laptop that lets me see the Elemnt device as a separate drive that is missing from my tablet?

Thanks for your input!
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Old 09-08-18, 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by HobbesOnTour
Hi John,

I haven't used IOS with the Elemnt, only android.

I've been using the device for over 2 years, mainly for navigation, so I (think!) I'm reasonably well versed on the process via the app.


But... I recently discovered I can bypass the app altogether by transferring the file directly from my PC to the unit via a standard USB cable.

From Wahoo: https://wahoofitness.yonyx.com/y/conversation/?id=0879d4c0-53dd-11e8-8f6c-bc764e10d166&lang=en



(Personally, I wish I had known this ages ago. Most of my routes are prepared on the computer. This is an easier process than emailing the gpx/trx file to my phone, then uploading to the app, and then transferring to the unit! )


So.... if it can be done from a PC, in my simple mind, it should be doable from a tablet. Tablets with a USB connection are few and far between, and I'm sure there's more to it than just a USB port. But there my technological knowledge starts to get cloudy.


Why do I want to do this?

I do a lot of long distance touring and it is not practical (nor enjoyable) to plan a week's ride (or longer) and stick rigidly to it.

When Wifi or data is available, it's not a problem to plan a new route on the fly.

However, I am looking for a solution when wifi/data is not available.


Currently, using OSMand on the tablet I can plan a route and transfer it to my phone all without internet. To load that route in the app needs a momentary internet connection, so this is where the process fails.


It is the app that requires the internet connection, not the unit.


If I can transfer the route directly to the Elemnt unit, bypassing the app, no internet connection is required and my issue is solved.


I then have a unit that will work anywhere, be re-routable anywhere, irrespective of data/wifi availability.


Thanks!
One possible solution involves the HooToo Tripmate Nano. Connect HooToo Nano to your Wahoo Elemnt with USB, then go to the HooToo app on your phone or tablet using the local wifi (intranet) connection created by the Nano. You can now magically move any file in any direction from or to your Elemnt. No data or internet connect needed to perform these actions. This works with Android devices. Sadly, iOS allows only limited access to directories. But using either a Fire phone or Kindle HDX I have often moved tcx files to a Garmin Edge 500 with only a USB connection to the Nano . The HooToo Nano is very small and light, needing only a power bank to function. Please note: I don't own a Wahoo Elemnt, but I would expect it to function as a Garmin device would in this case.

​​​​​​https://www.hootoo.com/hootoo-tripma...le-router.html

Last edited by sierrabob; 09-08-18 at 09:20 AM. Reason: more detail
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Old 09-08-18, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by sierrabob
One possible solution involves the HooToo Tripmate Nano. Connect HooToo Nano to your Wahoo Elemnt with USB, then go to the HooToo app on your phone or tablet using the local wifi (intranet) connection created by the Nano. You can now magically move any file in any direction from or to your Elemnt. No data or internet connect needed to perform these actions. This works with Android devices. Sadly, iOS allows only limited access to directories. But using either a Fire phone or Kindle HDX I have often moved tcx files to a Garmin Edge 500 with only a USB connection to the Nano . The HooToo Nano is very small and light, needing only a power bank to function. Please note: I don't own a Wahoo Elemnt, but I would expect it to function as a Garmin device would in this case.

​​​​​​https://www.hootoo.com/hootoo-tripma...le-router.html
Thanks for the tip!
I'll do some research on that.
My concern is that the Elemnt will not be recognised as a usb drive from the phone or tablet.
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Old 09-08-18, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by HobbesOnTour
Yeah, that's the theory... unfortunately, the reality is different. To load a route into the app requires internet. Try it. Disconnect wifi & data. Select a gpx track that already exists on the phone /tablet. You cannot get it into the app without internet. (According to Wahoo it "pings" or "Checks in" to the Wahoo cloud database. No internet and you get the message about a corrupt file.

What I don't understand is that there is no need to do "check in" when the file is transferred by cable directly to the unit. It just works.

So, what software is it that sits on my laptop that lets me see the Elemnt device as a separate drive that is missing from my tablet?

Thanks for your input!
its filesystem/operating system that prevents that. If so and it is as you say then you’re probably out of luck. That or make sure you have internet access.
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Old 09-08-18, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnJ80


its filesystem/operating system that prevents that. If so and it is as you say then you’re probably out of luck. That or make sure you have internet access.

The method I describe does not involve the use of the Wahoo app--it bypasses that. You would not want to open the Wahoo app on your phone to transfer files. It's just like using the copy and paste function when transferring files to the Elemnt without using the app. When properly setup, HooToo Nano treats your android phone or tablet, and your Elemnt like a group of directories connected through its wireless intranet.

Last edited by sierrabob; 09-08-18 at 12:05 PM. Reason: grammar
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Old 09-08-18, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by sierrabob
The method I describe does not involve the use of the Wahoo app--it bypasses that. You would not want to open the Wahoo app on your phone to transfer files. It's just like using the copy and paste function when transferring files to the Elemnt without using the app. When properly setup, HooToo Nano treats your android phone or tablet, and your Elemnt like a group of directories connected through it's wireless intranet.
That's sounding like just the ticket, Bob!

I don't suppose you could borrow an Elemnt and test it out?

I'm going to have a look around for a local supplier and see if I can test it out.

If it does treat the Elemnt as an USB device, then it looks like my problem is solved.... along with some very handy features!

Thanks!
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Old 09-08-18, 11:01 AM
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Yes, I may be able to help out, but it may take awhile. Will advise. Keep in mind, though, in order to edit gpx files, you'll likely need an internet connection. If your aim is to modify pre-planned gpx or tcx files on a tablet or phone while at a hotel during your travels, then this should work out nicely. I have done exactly that many times.

Last edited by sierrabob; 09-08-18 at 11:13 AM. Reason: more detail
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Old 09-08-18, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by sierrabob
Yes, I may be able to help out, but it may take awhile. Will advise.
I was only being cheeky!
If you get a chance to, then great, but please, don't put yourself out.
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Old 09-08-18, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnJ80


its filesystem/operating system that prevents that. If so and it is as you say then you’re probably out of luck. That or make sure you have internet access.
Thanks, John.
In the event of no internet access, I can just navigate by OSMand - that's what I would use to create the route without internet access. Not ideal, but in an emergency it'll do ok.
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Old 09-08-18, 11:22 AM
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An example of the transfer process using android tablet (Fire HDX) and HooToo Nano to Garmin Edge 500:

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Old 09-08-18, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by sierrabob
An example of the transfer process using android tablet (Fire HDX) and HooToo Nano to Garmin Edge 500:
Thanks for that, Bob! A picture tells a thousand words.
So, if I'm understanding this correctly;
The white rectangle is a battery pack supplying power to the HooToo
The HooToo is creating its own wifi network connecting the tablet with the HooToo wirelessly.
A USB cable connects the Garmin to the HooToo and this is used to transfer the file to the Garmin.

I'm not familiar with the Fire tablets. I believe they are Amazon own brand products? And they work on Android?

Many thanks
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Old 09-08-18, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by HobbesOnTour
Thanks, John.
In the event of no internet access, I can just navigate by OSMand - that's what I would use to create the route without internet access. Not ideal, but in an emergency it'll do ok.
there may be some android software that bypasses the protections. I’m not that expert at android although I have gotten familiar with some of the debugging tools while messing around with my Hammerhead Karoo.

In point of fact, Osmand totally saved my bacon while on a tour in Norway when the Karoo software went into one of its many and unique piques of rage and wouldn’t run. The Karoo is android based. I was very impressed with Osmand and thanking all the tech gods for my foresight in loading the routes on Osmand on the Karoo beforehand. Osmand is capable software. Because the Karoo is android based, I could put it in developer mode and use the android developer tools to load in an App Store and launcher so that I could download other apps like Osmand.

Give the tablet and mobile world a few years and it will be the primary vehicle for managing devices. Sales of laptops is steady in a good year and down in a bad year. It’s not a growing market any longer.

J.
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Old 09-08-18, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted by HobbesOnTour
Thanks for that, Bob! A picture tells a thousand words.
So, if I'm understanding this correctly;
The white rectangle is a battery pack supplying power to the HooToo
The HooToo is creating its own wifi network connecting the tablet with the HooToo wirelessly.
A USB cable connects the Garmin to the HooToo and this is used to transfer the file to the Garmin.

I'm not familiar with the Fire tablets. I believe they are Amazon own brand products? And they work on Android?

Many thanks
That is all correct. The power source depicted is a power bank, but it could be any 5V/2A or 5V/1A supply. The tablet is an Amazon product, the Fire HDX, wifi only version with android backbone, modified by Amazon, but it could be any android device. The screen depicts the downloads folder and the process of transferring a tcx file to the Garmin device. The internet signal depicted on the tablet is the Tripmate Nano local wifi.

Also, I don't know of a way to edit gpx files offline. Using Osmand offline with your phone mounted on the bike, you could ride part of a pre-planned gpx track, then easily add some new waypoints on the fly and navigate to them before returning to your planned route. Although a gpx track remains depicted on the Osmand map screen, to my knowledge, you can't actually connect a new series of waypoints to a gpx track; however, it's pretty easy to start back onto your track after plotting a diversion. Just long press anywhere onto your track and go. I've used that feature while on vacation in Athens recently.
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Old 09-09-18, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by sierrabob
Also, I don't know of a way to edit gpx files offline. Using Osmand offline with your phone mounted on the bike, you could ride part of a pre-planned gpx track, then easily add some new waypoints on the fly and navigate to them before returning to your planned route. Although a gpx track remains depicted on the Osmand map screen, to my knowledge, you can't actually connect a new series of waypoints to a gpx track; however, it's pretty easy to start back onto your track after plotting a diversion. Just long press anywhere onto your track and go. I've used that feature while on vacation in Athens recently.
Thanks, Bob.
I'm a big fan of Osmand - it's been my emergency navigator for years. Take it out, see where I am, put in my destination and off I go! The only problem is that I either use it on a tablet (preferred option) or my phone, and neither is terribly practical for the times that I want to use it - typically foul weather, off-road, passing through a city or a combination of those.

Since I got the Wahoo, I'll take the gpx generated by Osmand, load it in the Wahoo app and then on to the Elemnt. I'm touring in Europe and there's hardly ever an issue with a phone/data signal. However, I'll be going further afield soon and would like to solve the issue.so as not to be dependant on wifi/data access.

Worst case scenario, I'll just use OSmand, but I'd prefer to be using the Elemnt.

I've been in touch with HooToo and am waiting a response to some questions. Finding a bricks'n'morter shop in NL that has one is difficult.

Thanks for all your help
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Old 09-09-18, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by HobbesOnTour
Thanks, Bob.
I'm a big fan of Osmand - it's been my emergency navigator for years. Take it out, see where I am, put in my destination and off I go! The only problem is that I either use it on a tablet (preferred option) or my phone, and neither is terribly practical for the times that I want to use it - typically foul weather, off-road, passing through a city or a combination of those.

Since I got the Wahoo, I'll take the gpx generated by Osmand, load it in the Wahoo app and then on to the Elemnt. I'm touring in Europe and there's hardly ever an issue with a phone/data signal. However, I'll be going further afield soon and would like to solve the issue.so as not to be dependant on wifi/data access.

Worst case scenario, I'll just use OSmand, but I'd prefer to be using the Elemnt.

I've been in touch with HooToo and am waiting a response to some questions. Finding a bricks'n'morter shop in NL that has one is difficult.

Thanks for all your help
I just looked at the HooToo nano. There wre
a lot of similar products out. When I used to travel for business I carried something similar to connect to the hotel Ethernet and give me secure WiFi. So anything like that should work - i just searched amazon for “travel router” and found a number of them including HooToo’s.

Then in I’m thinking about this, I’m. It sure why you could t set your phone up as a hotspot. That also creates a local WiFi network. If the Element is logged into this network and so is your phone or tablet, then it should be the same as if you used the hootoo device. Or, you could set up your phone as a hotspot and then connect the tablet and ELEMNT to the created network and it should be exactly what the hootoo nano was doing. make sense?

if that worked you wouldn’t need her another device. Be worth a try.

j.
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Old 09-09-18, 03:06 PM
  #22  
HobbesOnTour
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Originally Posted by JohnJ80

I just looked at the HooToo nano. There wre
a lot of similar products out. When I used to travel for business I carried something similar to connect to the hotel Ethernet and give me secure WiFi. So anything like that should work - i just searched amazon for “travel router” and found a number of them including HooToo’s.

Then in I’m thinking about this, I’m. It sure why you could t set your phone up as a hotspot. That also creates a local WiFi network. If the Element is logged into this network and so is your phone or tablet, then it should be the same as if you used the hootoo device. Or, you could set up your phone as a hotspot and then connect the tablet and ELEMNT to the created network and it should be exactly what the hootoo nano was doing. make sense?

if that worked you wouldn’t need her another device. Be worth a try.

j.
Hmmm....
I'm not exactly an expert in technology, but that sounds like an option.
My understanding of a hotspot was that the phone takes an existing wifi/data connection and makes it available to other wireless devices?
I'll check it out!
Thanks!
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Old 09-09-18, 04:00 PM
  #23  
CliffordK
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My phone allows me to run a wireless hot spot for about 1 minute, then it konks out. Presumably something the provider does. But, it is just enough to download STRAVA routes to another device.

Anyway, look up wireless hotspot with your app manager.
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Old 09-09-18, 04:01 PM
  #24  
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It's an interesting thought, but turning on my phone's hotspot does not allow me to open up the phone's file structure on another device. Nor does it allow me to open the files of any other connected device on the phone. Remember, the Hootoo Nano is not marketed as a hotspot. That's clearly stated in the Amazon marketing title:HooToo Wireless Travel Router, USB Port, N150 Wi-Fi Router, USB Powered, High Performance, Mini Router- TripMate Nano (Not a Hotspot)

Last edited by sierrabob; 09-09-18 at 04:08 PM. Reason: clarity
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Old 09-09-18, 04:27 PM
  #25  
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The core feature of the HooToo Nano for our purposes is to make the contents of a disk drive available to a wireless network. In this instance, the disk drive is located on a bike computer; however, it could be any USB disk. A hotspot does not provide this feature.
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