Repacked Old Shimano Exage Hubs - How smooth should it feel?
10-30-20, 09:28 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
Repacked Old Shimano Exage Hubs - How smooth should it feel?
I bought an old less-than-perfectly-maintained Miyata Pavea for my partner, since her bike was stolen, and have been getting in back in shape to ride. Just about done. The one thing that bothered me was the wheels (Mistral rims on Shimano HBRM50 Exage hubs). When I spun them they did not feel super smooth, like wheels on my other (newer) bike. They would spin a very long time, but I could feel some vibration or roughness, and hear a bit of clicking. Both wheels.
From reading more on this forum, my guess was it was something with the hubs or bearings—dried out grease, damage cones or bearings, something like that, since the bike is decades old, and has potentially never had its hubs serviced. The clicking I surmised was the bearings knocking into each other, perhaps loose from not much grease in there. I'd like the wheels and bike to live a long and happy life, so I took them to my LBS, and they basically told me "it's an old wheel, what do you want?" and said that having them repack both hubs would probably not be worth what they charge to do it ($85) since it might not help. They did adjust the bearings a little for free because they said it had slight play, but that did not have any discernible change to the issue.
So I decided to attempt repacking hubs for my first time. When I opened them up, there was in fact almost no grease, but otherwise everything looked pretty intact. No pitting or corrosion. No damage to hubs, cones, or bearings. The cones are dark, and there is a straight line of lighter metal in the center of the curve of the cone, but from looking on other posts here, it looks like it's not damage but the bearing "polishing" the cone. So, I cleaned everything out with a rag, put new grease in, put brand new bearings in for good measure, and reassembled. No more clicking! It still spins for a long time, But the the vibration/roughness is still there (although hard to tell if it is less or the same).
Anyway, my question is, if there is no damage, and repacking is done properly, should the spinning be perfectly smooth without any roughness whatsoever, or is this expected from a wheel that is 30+ years old? Is this a product of general wear? Were old hubs ever perfectly smooth? Or did I just do it wrong, misadjusting or not cleaning properly? If you have any thoughts or suggestions, I would love to better understand how all this is supposed to work and feel. thanks!
From reading more on this forum, my guess was it was something with the hubs or bearings—dried out grease, damage cones or bearings, something like that, since the bike is decades old, and has potentially never had its hubs serviced. The clicking I surmised was the bearings knocking into each other, perhaps loose from not much grease in there. I'd like the wheels and bike to live a long and happy life, so I took them to my LBS, and they basically told me "it's an old wheel, what do you want?" and said that having them repack both hubs would probably not be worth what they charge to do it ($85) since it might not help. They did adjust the bearings a little for free because they said it had slight play, but that did not have any discernible change to the issue.
So I decided to attempt repacking hubs for my first time. When I opened them up, there was in fact almost no grease, but otherwise everything looked pretty intact. No pitting or corrosion. No damage to hubs, cones, or bearings. The cones are dark, and there is a straight line of lighter metal in the center of the curve of the cone, but from looking on other posts here, it looks like it's not damage but the bearing "polishing" the cone. So, I cleaned everything out with a rag, put new grease in, put brand new bearings in for good measure, and reassembled. No more clicking! It still spins for a long time, But the the vibration/roughness is still there (although hard to tell if it is less or the same).
Anyway, my question is, if there is no damage, and repacking is done properly, should the spinning be perfectly smooth without any roughness whatsoever, or is this expected from a wheel that is 30+ years old? Is this a product of general wear? Were old hubs ever perfectly smooth? Or did I just do it wrong, misadjusting or not cleaning properly? If you have any thoughts or suggestions, I would love to better understand how all this is supposed to work and feel. thanks!
10-30-20, 09:54 PM
#2
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Does the roughness go away if you back the cones out a little?
Also, if they are QR wheels, adjust the cones with the skewer under tension off the bike, using a couple of nuts as a spacer, a search of youtube should show you how to do this.
Also, if they are QR wheels, adjust the cones with the skewer under tension off the bike, using a couple of nuts as a spacer, a search of youtube should show you how to do this.
10-30-20, 10:36 PM
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Adjusting wheel bearings requires patience and a light touch. Sounds as if your cones are adjusted a bit too tight. Back them off a touch until they smooth out.
10-31-20, 12:52 AM
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I’m in the replace the ball bearings camp, especially if it has been decades since there has been any service. The technique I use to adjust the cones, from others here, is to have an ever so slight amount of play that disappears when the quick release is tightened.
But honestly for me, I’ve never been able to get a lower end hub to feel as smooth as a higher end.
John
But honestly for me, I’ve never been able to get a lower end hub to feel as smooth as a higher end.
John
10-31-20, 01:45 AM
#5
Blamester
I bought an old less-than-perfectly-maintained Miyata Pavea for my partner, since her bike was stolen, and have been getting in back in shape to ride. Just about done. The one thing that bothered me was the wheels (Mistral rims on Shimano HBRM50 Exage hubs). When I spun them they did not feel super smooth, like wheels on my other (newer) bike. They would spin a very long time, but I could feel some vibration or roughness, and hear a bit of clicking. Both wheels.
From reading more on this forum, my guess was it was something with the hubs or bearings—dried out grease, damage cones or bearings, something like that, since the bike is decades old, and has potentially never had its hubs serviced. The clicking I surmised was the bearings knocking into each other, perhaps loose from not much grease in there. I'd like the wheels and bike to live a long and happy life, so I took them to my LBS, and they basically told me "it's an old wheel, what do you want?" and said that having them repack both hubs would probably not be worth what they charge to do it ($85) since it might not help. They did adjust the bearings a little for free because they said it had slight play, but that did not have any discernible change to the issue.
So I decided to attempt repacking hubs for my first time. When I opened them up, there was in fact almost no grease, but otherwise everything looked pretty intact. No pitting or corrosion. No damage to hubs, cones, or bearings. The cones are dark, and there is a straight line of lighter metal in the center of the curve of the cone, but from looking on other posts here, it looks like it's not damage but the bearing "polishing" the cone. So, I cleaned everything out with a rag, put new grease in, put brand new bearings in for good measure, and reassembled. No more clicking! It still spins for a long time, But the the vibration/roughness is still there (although hard to tell if it is less or the same).
Anyway, my question is, if there is no damage, and repacking is done properly, should the spinning be perfectly smooth without any roughness whatsoever, or is this expected from a wheel that is 30+ years old? Is this a product of general wear? Were old hubs ever perfectly smooth? Or did I just do it wrong, misadjusting or not cleaning properly? If you have any thoughts or suggestions, I would love to better understand how all this is supposed to work and feel. thanks!
From reading more on this forum, my guess was it was something with the hubs or bearings—dried out grease, damage cones or bearings, something like that, since the bike is decades old, and has potentially never had its hubs serviced. The clicking I surmised was the bearings knocking into each other, perhaps loose from not much grease in there. I'd like the wheels and bike to live a long and happy life, so I took them to my LBS, and they basically told me "it's an old wheel, what do you want?" and said that having them repack both hubs would probably not be worth what they charge to do it ($85) since it might not help. They did adjust the bearings a little for free because they said it had slight play, but that did not have any discernible change to the issue.
So I decided to attempt repacking hubs for my first time. When I opened them up, there was in fact almost no grease, but otherwise everything looked pretty intact. No pitting or corrosion. No damage to hubs, cones, or bearings. The cones are dark, and there is a straight line of lighter metal in the center of the curve of the cone, but from looking on other posts here, it looks like it's not damage but the bearing "polishing" the cone. So, I cleaned everything out with a rag, put new grease in, put brand new bearings in for good measure, and reassembled. No more clicking! It still spins for a long time, But the the vibration/roughness is still there (although hard to tell if it is less or the same).
Anyway, my question is, if there is no damage, and repacking is done properly, should the spinning be perfectly smooth without any roughness whatsoever, or is this expected from a wheel that is 30+ years old? Is this a product of general wear? Were old hubs ever perfectly smooth? Or did I just do it wrong, misadjusting or not cleaning properly? If you have any thoughts or suggestions, I would love to better understand how all this is supposed to work and feel. thanks!
10-31-20, 02:43 AM
#6
Senior Member
I have HB-RM50 front hub that was NOS. Cleaned and re-greased it. After the normal cone adjustment, it still wasn't super smooth. Not really rough, but not quite as buttery as Shimano's upper lines. Guess that the cone & cups aren't quite up to the standard of the upper lines.
10-31-20, 07:56 AM
#7
Senior Member
I have HB-RM50 front hub that was NOS. Cleaned and re-greased it. After the normal cone adjustment, it still wasn't super smooth. Not really rough, but not quite as buttery as Shimano's upper lines. Guess that the cone & cups aren't quite up to the standard of the upper lines.
Not to mention that its so common for low or even mid level hubs to be overtightened from the get go when new, so with some riding, the chances of small imperfections/pitting happening are going to be more.
another strangers experience who isnt a working mechanic but works and rides on a household of bikes with a whole range of hub qualities.
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11-02-20, 01:23 AM
#8
Senior Member
I take a lot of care cleaning and repacking old hubs, some 50 years old. They rarely feel smooth when spinning while holding the axle/skewers in my hands, but always work fine on the bike. Same with old headsets. I used to always replace bearings until a very experienced shop mechanic said they are still good if shiny.
11-13-20, 08:44 PM
#9
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Just following up—
I ended up starting over and cleaning and repacking them again. After a good bit of adjusting it definitely felt better. Not super buttery smooth, but better, and you can't feel or hear it at all when on the bike now.
I ended up starting over and cleaning and repacking them again. After a good bit of adjusting it definitely felt better. Not super buttery smooth, but better, and you can't feel or hear it at all when on the bike now.
11-13-20, 09:51 PM
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Front and rear or just the rear and is the rear hub cassette or freewheel? If freewheel you could have a slightly bent axle that can make it a little rough and impossible to adjust perfectly. Otherwise they are a bottom end hub that wasn't built to be as refined as a higher end one and they'll show it. My first bike I bought ran those for several years till I picked up a Shimano 600/Mavic Reflex wheelset at a pawn shop for 25.00, worked till the end and went on someone else's bike. Just older, slower and still reliable.
11-14-20, 12:45 PM
#12
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Hard to say with out having it in my own hands. But in general, I would rather have a little bit of play in the bearings than not. Once that last little bit of play is eliminated you quickly get to the point where they are too tight and will feel rough when spun.
A perfectly adjusted axle and bearings in a wheel off the bike won't be perfectly adjusted once the skewer is clamped.
A perfectly adjusted axle and bearings in a wheel off the bike won't be perfectly adjusted once the skewer is clamped.
