Courtesy on the bike paths....
08-22-19, 02:34 PM
#51
Virgo
08-22-19, 03:02 PM
#52
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If slower people are properly on the right side of the trail i simply pass at a reasonable speed. A speed i'd pass my grandmother at! If someone is in the way on the left side, i say "on your left" which normally scares them into moving over. I got some new wheels quieter hubs (DT350s) and i'm now considering getting a bell so i can make some noise behind people. I used to just coast for a sec or two.
Paths can be happy communal places. Everyone is outside doing their thing. Don't F it up by being rude and in a rush. If you want to go fast take the road.
Paths can be happy communal places. Everyone is outside doing their thing. Don't F it up by being rude and in a rush. If you want to go fast take the road.
08-22-19, 05:08 PM
#53
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Courtesy on the bike paths....
PASSING
BEING PASSED
I was curious what people's experience has been when being passed by, or otherwise encounter, other bikers while out on a ride. Specifically, I'd be interested when riding on a multi-use path (MUT/MUP).
I ride a mtn. bike and noticed most people on road bikes rarely ever let me know they are going to pass me (sometimes catch me by surprise
And some of these riders pass fairly close at reasonable speeds (for that trail)...like if I turned my head at the moment of their passing, I might get hit by a shoulder I don't see many other mtn. bikes at all where I ride, so I don't have enuf data to draw any kind of inference from that.
Do others see similar behavior? Or do I have the unfortunate luck to cross paths with road bikers who exhibit bad behavior here in Silicon Valley?...
I ride a mtn. bike and noticed most people on road bikes rarely ever let me know they are going to pass me (sometimes catch me by surprise
And some of these riders pass fairly close at reasonable speeds (for that trail)...like if I turned my head at the moment of their passing, I might get hit by a shoulder I don't see many other mtn. bikes at all where I ride, so I don't have enuf data to draw any kind of inference from that.Do others see similar behavior? Or do I have the unfortunate luck to cross paths with road bikers who exhibit bad behavior here in Silicon Valley?...
Originally Posted by @badger1
By the way, all the Cat 6 racers round here love that little phrase. Other current favourites: "Coming through" and "Hold your line."
Originally Posted by @Machka
Oh no ... not this.
These threads have started to be as prevalent as the other signs of spring ...the waving and shaving threads
These threads have started to be as prevalent as the other signs of spring ...the waving and shaving threads
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
I think Machka was referring to those numerous threads about MUPS, and the up coming cyclist yelling “On your left” as they approached slower pedestrians, cyclists, etc, often with earphones on. I myself initially thought the same, just from the title of this thread.
When I’m passing anyone in any situation, including a fellow cyclist on the road, I don’t yell ”On your left”; at most I will say “Coming up” when nearby, but most importantly will pass with a wide berth. Yelling a warning might be annoying; a startling yell is inappropriate; but close passing is definitely uncalled for.
I like “coming up”…non-committal (as opposed to “on your left”) but not so antagonistic as “coming through.”
When I’m passing anyone in any situation, including a fellow cyclist on the road, I don’t yell ”On your left”; at most I will say “Coming up” when nearby, but most importantly will pass with a wide berth. Yelling a warning might be annoying; a startling yell is inappropriate; but close passing is definitely uncalled for.
I like “coming up”…non-committal (as opposed to “on your left”) but not so antagonistic as “coming through.”
I have noticed that when i am out riding and get passed by a 'serious' rider, they rarely announce. I have also seen them buzz past unsuspecting walkers without a word.
This past weekend i spied a 'serious' rider approaching fast in my rear view and they ended up zipping by without any word...and quite close as well.
This past weekend i spied a 'serious' rider approaching fast in my rear view and they ended up zipping by without any word...and quite close as well.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
As a mirror wearer, I like to wave if I see a cyclist coming up from behind, and say hello when they get close, with the intention of (gently) surprising them before they surprise me.
An upcoming paceline makes me think of a school of piranhas.
An upcoming paceline makes me think of a school of piranhas.
… Rte 4/225 from Lexington westward is one of my favorite long (about 70 miles) training rides from Boston; and then I return by way of Harvard.
Last year, for about 3-4 hours along the route, starting in Boston, I was passed by wave after wave of strong riders on the B to B Harpoon ride going up to Vermont.
Last year, for about 3-4 hours along the route, starting in Boston, I was passed by wave after wave of strong riders on the B to B Harpoon ride going up to Vermont.
Last edited by Jim from Boston; 08-22-19 at 05:18 PM.
08-22-19, 05:12 PM
#54
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This is a topic that is near and dear to me. Up until three years ago I lived on a rural paved road and I had a 26 mile route I could ride on similar low traffic paved country roads. Now I live in a fairly big city and you couldn’t pay me enough to road cycle.
So the MUP is my new norm and to be honest it sucks big time. I have reached a point where an indoor trainer is the only way to get a quality workout so cycling outside for training is almost non-existent for me.
I’ve encountered all the aforementioned problems on the trails and a top speed of 14-15 is the only safe speed for myself and other users, thus a recreation ride.....
So the MUP is my new norm and to be honest it sucks big time. I have reached a point where an indoor trainer is the only way to get a quality workout so cycling outside for training is almost non-existent for me.
I’ve encountered all the aforementioned problems on the trails and a top speed of 14-15 is the only safe speed for myself and other users, thus a recreation ride.....
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08-23-19, 06:48 AM
#55
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There is a huge problem with Cyclists that are riding TOO FAST FOR CONDITIONS on these multi-use/bicycle paths!
Many ignore the speed limit and just fly way too fast at near 20mph during the most congested and populated times on these multi-use paths.
These jerks are giving Cyclists a bad name.
These offenders tend to be all male in the 18 to 35 year old age group according to the local police.
These folks are old enough to know better but since most of them are single and without any children, according to the police officer, they have no concept of the importance of slowing down and not being a potential reckless menace. Usually once these young bucks finally have children of their own, they will instinctively then realize that they have been a menace to the pedestrians and families with strollers and the dog on the path, as well as joggers, older children, and the elderly people that use the paths for walking. These 18 to 35 year old idiot road bike "serious" cyclists are just as bad as the 16 year old kid with a new drivers license that likes to drive 40 to 45 mph through the Walmart or Kroger parking lot where they are employed and are earning minimum wage. These 16 year old morons with their new licenses do not realize just how dangerous this is as they believe now that it is harmless to accelerate rapidly through crowded parking lots, and speed through school zones. They believe that Nothing bad will happen. The worst that they believe that could happen is that they might receive a TICKET or a Warning from the local police. They do not forsee the possibility of an accident with another car or hitting a pedestrian. They tailgate too and they believe that they can control their car. We all know of stupid accidents by 16 year old drivers, whether it was in 1954, 1965, 1972, 1979, 1999 or whatever year. You might have been lucky but my bet is if you are male and you were 16 when you started driving, that you were likely as horrible as everyone else in any era.
The important thing is that in the case of these "serious" road cyclists that have to use the PATH, are childish and obviously must feel that it is somehow a threat to their manhood if they must SLOW their cycling speed on the PATH to a very moderate 9 to 11 mph and even slower when Dogs, Old People, and runners going in both directions are blocking the way. Most of these offending "jerk cyclists" refuse to use a bell. They feel that a bell is somehow only for the girl or elderly lady on a cruiser bike with a front mounted wicker basket.
My opinion is that there are now too many of these "jerk cyclists" that the perhaps the time has come again for municipalities and or States to require a large visible license plate to mounted on every bicycle that is ridden on public roads, paths, trails, and public parks. I did not think that would ever be necessary ever again but now I'm not sure. It would be an excellent way to quickly identify Cyclists . I have a friend who is an attorney and his belief is that instead of a plate or sticker for each bicycle, that there should be a State issued bicyclist REGISTRATION NUMBER that is identifies the bicyclist. He/she would be required to display that number placard on the bike like for example competition numbers are displayed in a triathlon. He says that every cyclist's helmet should have a sticker with that same State registration number. Bicycle helmet use would be required at all times on public roads, trails, parks, and paths.
He says that children under 18 violating the registration display policy would incur a potential $50 fine for the parents of said child. The fine for those 18 and older (adults) cyclists who violate the registration display policy would incur a potential $250 fine. I know his idea sound like madness but perhaps this method of madness will improve things. Just as folks can now capture video and identify cars on the video by their license plate, so too would it be possible to identify the cyclist on dash cam video or other video by their individual state issued bicyclist REGISTRATION NUMBER no matter what bicycle that person decided to ride on that particular day. I am beginning to see that this may not be too crazy after all. In certain areas, there are just too many jerk cyclists that are misbehaving. It is certainly not the homless folks that are flying down these paths on weekends when everybody is walking the family, jogging, cruising with the kids, etc. The folks messing things up are the young male "serious" road bike riders that do use the paths. They aren't riding Salvation Army specials, as many are seen on things sporting the names Specialized and others. It isn't grandpa on his Specialized. These dumb--- young fellows need to respect the lower speed necessary on the PATHS or they need to just Not Use the PATHS when high pedestrian, dog traffic, and elderly walkers are present! It can be okay for them to ride as fast as they wish to IF YOU HAVE NOBODY THERE with 1000 meters of visibility, but these young bucks need to think about what they are doing. It might be a good suggestion: Make America Think again.
Many ignore the speed limit and just fly way too fast at near 20mph during the most congested and populated times on these multi-use paths.
These jerks are giving Cyclists a bad name.
These offenders tend to be all male in the 18 to 35 year old age group according to the local police.
These folks are old enough to know better but since most of them are single and without any children, according to the police officer, they have no concept of the importance of slowing down and not being a potential reckless menace. Usually once these young bucks finally have children of their own, they will instinctively then realize that they have been a menace to the pedestrians and families with strollers and the dog on the path, as well as joggers, older children, and the elderly people that use the paths for walking. These 18 to 35 year old idiot road bike "serious" cyclists are just as bad as the 16 year old kid with a new drivers license that likes to drive 40 to 45 mph through the Walmart or Kroger parking lot where they are employed and are earning minimum wage. These 16 year old morons with their new licenses do not realize just how dangerous this is as they believe now that it is harmless to accelerate rapidly through crowded parking lots, and speed through school zones. They believe that Nothing bad will happen. The worst that they believe that could happen is that they might receive a TICKET or a Warning from the local police. They do not forsee the possibility of an accident with another car or hitting a pedestrian. They tailgate too and they believe that they can control their car. We all know of stupid accidents by 16 year old drivers, whether it was in 1954, 1965, 1972, 1979, 1999 or whatever year. You might have been lucky but my bet is if you are male and you were 16 when you started driving, that you were likely as horrible as everyone else in any era.
The important thing is that in the case of these "serious" road cyclists that have to use the PATH, are childish and obviously must feel that it is somehow a threat to their manhood if they must SLOW their cycling speed on the PATH to a very moderate 9 to 11 mph and even slower when Dogs, Old People, and runners going in both directions are blocking the way. Most of these offending "jerk cyclists" refuse to use a bell. They feel that a bell is somehow only for the girl or elderly lady on a cruiser bike with a front mounted wicker basket.
My opinion is that there are now too many of these "jerk cyclists" that the perhaps the time has come again for municipalities and or States to require a large visible license plate to mounted on every bicycle that is ridden on public roads, paths, trails, and public parks. I did not think that would ever be necessary ever again but now I'm not sure. It would be an excellent way to quickly identify Cyclists . I have a friend who is an attorney and his belief is that instead of a plate or sticker for each bicycle, that there should be a State issued bicyclist REGISTRATION NUMBER that is identifies the bicyclist. He/she would be required to display that number placard on the bike like for example competition numbers are displayed in a triathlon. He says that every cyclist's helmet should have a sticker with that same State registration number. Bicycle helmet use would be required at all times on public roads, trails, parks, and paths.
He says that children under 18 violating the registration display policy would incur a potential $50 fine for the parents of said child. The fine for those 18 and older (adults) cyclists who violate the registration display policy would incur a potential $250 fine. I know his idea sound like madness but perhaps this method of madness will improve things. Just as folks can now capture video and identify cars on the video by their license plate, so too would it be possible to identify the cyclist on dash cam video or other video by their individual state issued bicyclist REGISTRATION NUMBER no matter what bicycle that person decided to ride on that particular day. I am beginning to see that this may not be too crazy after all. In certain areas, there are just too many jerk cyclists that are misbehaving. It is certainly not the homless folks that are flying down these paths on weekends when everybody is walking the family, jogging, cruising with the kids, etc. The folks messing things up are the young male "serious" road bike riders that do use the paths. They aren't riding Salvation Army specials, as many are seen on things sporting the names Specialized and others. It isn't grandpa on his Specialized. These dumb--- young fellows need to respect the lower speed necessary on the PATHS or they need to just Not Use the PATHS when high pedestrian, dog traffic, and elderly walkers are present! It can be okay for them to ride as fast as they wish to IF YOU HAVE NOBODY THERE with 1000 meters of visibility, but these young bucks need to think about what they are doing. It might be a good suggestion: Make America Think again.
Might as well go full "Big Brother" and require everyone to have a RFID chip implanted because that's about what it would take to make this effective. Big no thanks.
08-23-19, 07:01 AM
#56
☢
Where there is not rule you cannot break the rule. Courtesies vary from place to place, and from time to time, but I've never heard of one where you're expected to announce yourself when passing another cyclist..
Fixed.
Sharing the path applies to everyone equally.
I generally call out "on your left" before passing, except if the person is wearing headphone or ear buds. Wearing them means you won't hear me, so why bother. If I have to constantly slow down, then I shouldn't of chosen to be on the MUP.
Everybody needs to remember to share, the path with others.
But others need to remember to keep right, step off the path and not block it if they decide to stop and keep their children/dogs withing reach.
Everybody needs to remember to share, the path with others.
But others need to remember to keep right, step off the path and not block it if they decide to stop and keep their children/dogs withing reach.
Sharing the path applies to everyone equally.
08-23-19, 07:28 AM
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As far as announcing your pass, Mass. law states: "The operator shall give an audible warning whenever necessary to insure safe operation of the bicycle; provided, however, the use of a siren or whistle is prohibited." I'm sure you'll quibble with that, but that's a requirement to announce at least your close passes of anyone.
08-23-19, 07:31 AM
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The OP has a thread recounting negative interactions with joggers, motorists, overweight people and high school students.
This thread seems to be more about negative interactions with Silicon Valley roadies than it is about courtesy.
I struggled with anger for decades. Everyone was wrong and I was right. It took a long time to realize that we all have faults and forgive people for being human. Mostly I needed to forgive myself.
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08-23-19, 07:37 AM
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Cyclists tend to ride briskly on the main MUP and that's OK.
The fact that there are cyclists on the MUP and that some of the are faster than me and will pass me is no surprise. It's to be expected. I hold my line ... they pass ... everyone's happy.
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08-23-19, 07:43 AM
#60
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I was curious what people's experience has been when being passed by, or otherwise encounter, other bikers while out on a ride. Specifically, I'd be interested when riding on a multi-use path (MUT/MUP).
I ride a mtn. bike and noticed most people on road bikes rarely ever let me know they are going to pass me (sometimes catch me by surprise And some of these riders pass fairly close at reasonable speeds (for that trail)...like if I turned my head at the moment of their passing, I might get hit by a shoulder I don't see many other mtn. bikes at all where I ride, so I don't have enuf data to draw any kind of inference from that.
Do others see similar behavior? Or do I have the unfortunate luck to cross paths with road bikers who exhibit bad behavior here in Silicon Valley?
Cheers....
"Ride smart. Ride safe. Always have a plan b, c, d, etc."
I ride a mtn. bike and noticed most people on road bikes rarely ever let me know they are going to pass me (sometimes catch me by surprise
And some of these riders pass fairly close at reasonable speeds (for that trail)...like if I turned my head at the moment of their passing, I might get hit by a shoulder I don't see many other mtn. bikes at all where I ride, so I don't have enuf data to draw any kind of inference from that.Do others see similar behavior? Or do I have the unfortunate luck to cross paths with road bikers who exhibit bad behavior here in Silicon Valley?
Cheers....
"Ride smart. Ride safe. Always have a plan b, c, d, etc."
08-23-19, 08:29 AM
#61
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We ride ... sometimes we pass people, sometimes people pass us. If they're on bicycles, there's rarely any issues/difficulties/problems. All good.
Cyclists tend to ride briskly on the main MUP and that's OK.
The fact that there are cyclists on the MUP and that some of the are faster than me and will pass me is no surprise. It's to be expected. I hold my line ... they pass ... everyone's happy.
Cyclists tend to ride briskly on the main MUP and that's OK.
The fact that there are cyclists on the MUP and that some of the are faster than me and will pass me is no surprise. It's to be expected. I hold my line ... they pass ... everyone's happy.
08-23-19, 08:31 AM
#62
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If you're riding slowly on a MUP in Silicon Valley it's best to assume you are going to be passed frequently. Ride in a straight line and think about something else. Or ride faster...
08-23-19, 09:35 AM
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Unfortunately the bike paths here in Denver have become almost as dangerous as the roads... and trust me, being on both for many years, people need to be more courteous. There was a disastrous head on bike crash on the main Cherry Creek path downtown and serious injuries between the two riders ensued. Slow down and lay off the excess testosterone.
I've been on a group ride where the exact same thing happened, where a rider in my group accidentally crossed the center line and hit someone head-on. The sound of carbon frames, carbon wheels, and tubes exploding simultaneously is something I won't soon forget.
Last edited by Riveting; 08-23-19 at 09:43 AM.
08-23-19, 11:05 AM
#65
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I Ride the Va Capitol trail a lot. I have had very few encounters with rude bicyclists from either end. and those few may have just been having a bad day etc..
08-23-19, 11:18 AM
#66
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To be fair, that crash had nothing to do with lack of MUP courtesy, nor was it due to excess testosterone or speed. A rider simply came in minor pedal contact with another rider they were with, which caused them to swerve to the left and momentarily cross the center line at the exact moment someone was coming in the other direction. A small mistake that resulted in a ~35 mph (combined speed) head on collision.
I've been on a group ride where the exact same thing happened, where a rider in my group accidentally crossed the center line and hit someone head-on. The sound of carbon frames, carbon wheels, and tubes exploding simultaneously is something I won't soon forget.
I've been on a group ride where the exact same thing happened, where a rider in my group accidentally crossed the center line and hit someone head-on. The sound of carbon frames, carbon wheels, and tubes exploding simultaneously is something I won't soon forget.
08-23-19, 04:45 PM
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08-23-19, 06:11 PM
#68
☢
I tend to agree.
The OP has a thread recounting negative interactions with joggers, motorists, overweight people and high school students.
This thread seems to be more about negative interactions with Silicon Valley roadies than it is about courtesy.
I struggled with anger for decades. Everyone was wrong and I was right. It took a long time to realize that we all have faults and forgive people for being human. Mostly I needed to forgive myself.
-Tim-
The OP has a thread recounting negative interactions with joggers, motorists, overweight people and high school students.
This thread seems to be more about negative interactions with Silicon Valley roadies than it is about courtesy.
I struggled with anger for decades. Everyone was wrong and I was right. It took a long time to realize that we all have faults and forgive people for being human. Mostly I needed to forgive myself.
-Tim-
08-23-19, 10:08 PM
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My peeve is two or more approaching cyclists on the MUP riding alongside each other, yakking away, They never move, but I go to the right.
What do they do when they approach another pair, Is it the chicken game?
What do they do when they approach another pair, Is it the chicken game?
08-24-19, 01:35 AM
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Just stop and remain perfectly stationary. They'll go around.
08-24-19, 03:05 AM
#72
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If there's plenty of room on the right, I really don't care about that, I don't mind moving a little to the right. If they're crowding my lane so I'd have to go way to the edge, I'm yelling at the guy to get out of my lane. Works like a charm. Startles the hell out of them, but I consider it a lesson they need to learn, and "courtesy" from me or anyone else they're making perform a risky maneuver is not deserved in that instance.
08-26-19, 11:15 AM
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You’re not alone. I live/ride in the Seattle area. Less than 1/3 of riders that pass me announce themselves. Almost none of the electric motor cyclists do, and they tend to fly by. I use a bell when I’m about 50 - 100 ft behind pedestrians, and about 20 behind other riders. I ride road bikes.
I was curious what people's experience has been when being passed by, or otherwise encounter, other bikers while out on a ride. Specifically, I'd be interested when riding on a multi-use path (MUT/MUP).
I ride a mtn. bike and noticed most people on road bikes rarely ever let me know they are going to pass me (sometimes catch me by surprise And some of these riders pass fairly close at reasonable speeds (for that trail)...like if I turned my head at the moment of their passing, I might get hit by a shoulder I don't see many other mtn. bikes at all where I ride, so I don't have enuf data to draw any kind of inference from that.
Do others see similar behavior? Or do I have the unfortunate luck to cross paths with road bikers who exhibit bad behavior here in Silicon Valley?
Cheers....
"Ride smart. Ride safe. Always have a plan b, c, d, etc."
I ride a mtn. bike and noticed most people on road bikes rarely ever let me know they are going to pass me (sometimes catch me by surprise
And some of these riders pass fairly close at reasonable speeds (for that trail)...like if I turned my head at the moment of their passing, I might get hit by a shoulder I don't see many other mtn. bikes at all where I ride, so I don't have enuf data to draw any kind of inference from that.Do others see similar behavior? Or do I have the unfortunate luck to cross paths with road bikers who exhibit bad behavior here in Silicon Valley?
Cheers....
"Ride smart. Ride safe. Always have a plan b, c, d, etc."
08-26-19, 11:45 AM
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To be fair, that crash had nothing to do with lack of MUP courtesy, nor was it due to excess testosterone or speed. A rider simply came in minor pedal contact with another rider they were with, which caused them to swerve to the left and momentarily cross the center line at the exact moment someone was coming in the other direction. A small mistake that resulted in a ~35 mph (combined speed) head on collision.
I've been on a group ride where the exact same thing happened, where a rider in my group accidentally crossed the center line and hit someone head-on. The sound of carbon frames, carbon wheels, and tubes exploding simultaneously is something I won't soon forget.
I've been on a group ride where the exact same thing happened, where a rider in my group accidentally crossed the center line and hit someone head-on. The sound of carbon frames, carbon wheels, and tubes exploding simultaneously is something I won't soon forget.
Cheers
