garciawork

I am hear to request that you stop posting about that bike, and especially pictures. Since I switched to SS on my MTB, the thought of a road SS rears its head every so often, since my area is pretty flat, and I really need help keeping it outta my mind!

HTupolev

I don't see how that's illogical; it's a compromise between how wide your gearing range is and how bad a range-change is. A 15% range compromise, in the case of 50-34 versus 46-36. You can compensate by using a wider cassette with a 46-36 (i.e. switching from 12-28 to 11-30), but then we're back to the issue of compromising spacing between rear gears. Both options have sacrifices.

Jiggle

We're on the same page. I had a 42/53 for a while but 36/46 is a hair better for my speed band.

cthenn

They still make this bike huh? Mine is 10 years older than this, but it's been relegated to rain duty (easy to clean, no extraneous parts to get gummed up by riding in crappy weather).

enzo thecat

Me too...i ride the crap out of my SRAM 11spd on Zwift with a Kickr and a large chain ring (i think 52). I handle the hills and mountains just fine.

chong67

I have no problem climbing a hill with 1x11, say up a 1/4 mile stretch no problem at 30% angle. Just keep on paddling.

I also can paddle as fast as I can on the big gear on flat land. I am limited by my stamina.

I still dont get what problems you guys are talking about. Let me know what to look for so I can feel and experience it when I ride with a 1x11 limitations.

HTupolev

If you want to exaggerate the effect to make it more obvious, do a ride while limiting which cogs you allow yourself to use. For instance, restrict yourself to doing two shifts at a time, so that you can only use cogs 1, 3, 5, 7, 9, and 11.

Racing Dan

Looking to a gear calculator, I too have a hard time seeing how 1x is so bad. Can I ask what chain rings and cassette you run and, what your 5 most used combinations are?

kbarch

You'll only notice the "limitation" when you try to cruise at a relatively constant speed or effort; when the terrain is relatively flat or even and winds are mostly calm, but not quite. Or when you're in a pace line or peloton trying to keep your position.
Funny thing: on the last decent ride I got lately, because the route was very rolling, I found myself shifting two gears at a time quite often, and that was on a 1x 11-42

noodle soup

30% slope? I'd like to see you paddle up that waterfall.

HTupolev

My Miyata 710 has 52-42 cranks and a 14-16-18-21-24-28 freewheel. This one gets pretty good bang for its ratios: 1.5-step works across the whole range, and the small-small cross chain works smoothly, so I get maybe 11 real useful ratios out of the 2x6 drivetrain, as I detailed on post #27 of this thread.

My Emonda ALR has its usual 5800 105 50-34 cranks plus 11-12-13-14-15-17-19-21-23-25-28 cassette. I occasionally double-shift around the 16T cog problem, but only if I'm going to use it for a while, as it's an astonishingly clumsy double-shift.

My '83 Stumpjumper drop bar conversion has 48-38-24 cranks and an 11-13-15-18-21-24-28 cassette. The upper two chainrings 1.5-step the small cogs very well in the cruising range. And I do use the granny gears, partly because it makes the bike surprisingly effective on super-steep hills, and partly because the bike's trail makes it not handle super well out of the saddle at low speed.

My Fuji America has its original 53-44-36 cranks and 14-16-19-22-26-30 freewheel. Beautiful drivetrain with good acoustics, but it's got significant redundancy issues; when the middle ring finishes wearing out, I'll probably replace it with something slightly smaller.

My Bridgestone RB-T has 50-40-28 cranks and a 14-16-18-21-24-28 freewheel. The highest 1.5-step shift kind of sucks, but it otherwise more or less does the trick. This morning was actually my first time in a zippy paceline with it, so I'm still getting used to how it feels (I've seen log charts for the gearing on my bikes, but that's all just for fun; the gap around the highest 1.5-step shift can be seen in spreadsheet form, but what it really means is something learned at 23mph).

noodle soup

what do you use on your primary road bike, and what is the terrain like in your area?

Racing Dan

Mostly flat. Im on 50/34 and 11-28. On both the 34 and the 50 the vast majority of riding is on the cogs down to the 15t with the bulk on 50 + 17, 19, 21, 23. That is 2t shifts mosy of the time. Once it goes down and I can use higher gears (50+ 12, 13, 14, 15) and 1t jumps, the smaller spacing is of very little real word use, and its not used much either. A 46t + 11-40 cassette would give me the same 2t jumps in the same "high use" range and only be worse in the very high gears because it doent have a 14t and 12t. I the low end, I think id rather have the 13 - 15% gear jumps of the 11-40, rather than the tiny 9 - 12% of the 11-28. Thats why, from my perspective, a 46 + 11-40 combo looks like a nice solution.

Looks like this:

https://ritzelrechner.de/?GR=DERS&KB=...&SL=2.7&UN=KMH

Racing Dan

Thanks. I see you are mostly on triple rings. Thats a whole nother kettle of fish. Your gearings seem vastly different from what is commonly available these days. Im sure most PPLs perspective will be different from yours. I think most of the appeal of 1x is getting rid of the compact crank. At least thats is why im interested in 1x. I do how ever see the benefit of at triple. I could do 90% of my riding on the middle ring with a tight cassette.

Popeyecahn

OP, Felt VR4...

VR4 - Felt Bicycles

I test rode one last weekend, a nice bike very "compliant" in the back end. I wasn't sure if 1x was for me though, didn't ride it long enough or up any major climbs to know.

FrontRanger

I've ridden 1x almost exclusively for the past couple of years. Since most of my riding is solo over mixed terrain I really don't miss the smaller gaps between gears.

HTupolev

If you're comparing it to a typical road double, existence of low gears shouldn't be an issue. It's got a wider gearing range and a lower granny than a compact 50-34 11-28.

Popeyecahn

I think a couple things I had read gave me pause, one of which was the gear spacing. And something that would probably annoy would be the high gearing. I like an 11/50 to descend on simply because gravity doesn't always work so well when you don't have mass on your side (not that I'm complaining). Otherwise you are correct, the low gearing would be better, though I do fine up hills and mountains with the 28/34.

Jarrett2

How did I miss this thread?!

I had this same conversation on BF last summer. Here's the chart that seemed to help people understand:


The top chart is a 1x setup with a 48 chainring and a 11-42 cassette. The bottom is a 50/34 chainring with a 11-28 cassette. Pretty standard setup.

Over the course of several rides, I paid attention to my shifting patterns and like others have mentioned, I didn't use the little ring until I had to on a steep climb. So my 22 gear bike was essentially a 14 gear bike for me, with most of my riding in numbers 5-7 in the big ring, then dropping down occasionally to 1-4 for various climbs. If I went to 8+, it was not because I needed them, but usually because I was pedaling down a hill and trying for fun to see how fast I could go.

First, notice how much overlap there is in a standard 50/34 + 11/28 setup. The 47.8, 53.5, 60.8, 70.4, 83.x are all essentially duplicates. Second, look at the gear jumps on the double compact. It jumps from 60.8 to 70.4 when going from the 22 (6) to the 19 (7) cog when using the 50 chainring. No one complains about that jump on a double compact. Look at the equivalent jump between 6 & 7 on the 1x11 setup. It's smaller... Look at the jump between 7 & 8 on each setup, smaller on the 1x as well.

So moving from 2x to 1x for me was not going from 22 to 11, it was going from 14 to 11. And where are those extra 3 gears on the 2x setup? Right where I don't need them, in spots 8-14. The jumps there are really small, but as a rec rider, I don't need those small gear jumps in that range, it was wasted space for me.

Once I had that revelation, I made the switch to 1x and haven't looked back. The switch has improved riding for me. Like with anything, its not for everyone, but there are many like me that would enjoy it more I suspect.

Jarrett2

Anyway, OP. I couldn't find a 1x11 road bike, so I built one.

Once I got a taste of the 1x, I converted all three of my bikes.

I've been front DR free for about 8 months now and its wonderful

Can they go up hills? Sure, I have more climbing gears than I did on my 2x setups.

I stumbled onto this last Sunday morning during what was supposed to be a nice and easy slow ride:
Capture.JPG

Actually didn't realize it was a 20+% climb (or a segment) until I looked at Strava afterward.

Jarrett2

Pros:
Less moving parts/less things to break
Less to maintain
Can be lighter weight (depends on cassette size)
Quieter drivetrain
Simplified operation
No more chain slap

Cons:
Might not have the gear increments you need for racing/technical pacelining
Bike will be weighted more to the rear (again depends on cassette size)
Can be costly to covert or build

HTupolev

I'm a bit confused why you wouldn't spend most of your time in your small ring. On most road bikes that I've used, the cranks are situated such that the small-small cross-chain is very well-behaved. So it seems like, by using your "5/6/7", you're getting worse spacing and necessitating more front shifting.

Actually, the most common 11-28 is 11-12-13-14-15-17-19-21-23-25-28, since that's what Shimano uses. Nobody complains about the 19-22 jump because it only exists on SRAM road drivetrains, and they don't exactly dominate OEM. What people do complain about is the 15-17 jump; on a 50-34 crank it's technically possible to double-shift around the issue, but it's a pretty clumsy double-shift.

fietsbob

Get a 2 by 11 road bike you like , and replace the crankset and get a left brake lever
without the shifter in it.

Jarrett2

You can just change the chainring and ignore the left shifter also, to save some money.

Jarrett2

I probably should have been, but no one I ride with rides that way. Everyone is big ring all the time.

I even hear some of the racers I ride with having "little ring" rides where they ride in only the little ring as opposed to the normal big ring all the time.

Is all of BF riding in a different fashion? Shifting between big and little rings on every shift to maximize their gear ratios? I doubt it

The beauty is now, I don't have to worry about if I am in the best front/rear gear combo for that moment. I just subconsciously shift where I need to be, with one hand, and don't think about it at all.