Narrowed down, I think.
05-01-12, 11:05 AM
#26
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With quick release wheels it's surprisingly easy to toss full size bikes in a trunk. However, in this case, I think both would be viable options (full size or folder) I think the curve is a good choice.
On a side note, does the 1-1.5 miles away parking area at a fixed location? or is it variable (ie. you have to hunt around for a parking space) I only ask because another option if you have a full size bike you're not too worried about, is to ride it back and forth and lock it at both ends of the ride. (parking area and at work) Just another option!
On a side note, does the 1-1.5 miles away parking area at a fixed location? or is it variable (ie. you have to hunt around for a parking space) I only ask because another option if you have a full size bike you're not too worried about, is to ride it back and forth and lock it at both ends of the ride. (parking area and at work) Just another option!
05-01-12, 06:59 PM
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between citizen and curve, if it were me, i will choose curve in a fly (i had experience in both bikes).
05-01-12, 07:39 PM
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The Tokyo is the only reasonably priced 16" I could find, and while the reviews here range from "meh." to "awesome!!" on the Tokyo I cannot find a single negative review.
Also, I figure no matter what bike I get now I will wind up upgrading in the future if I get really serious about this so why spend $600 just to upgrade later vs. less than $250.
I got the bag and rear rack for it. I'm excited to take some pics and post a nice little review of what I think.
Thank you all so much for all of your input - without it I would have never thought of Citizen. I will also be reviewing this thread when it is time to upgrade.
05-01-12, 09:01 PM
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I own two 20" folders: (1) 7-speed Shimano, 6061 frame, 406mm rims, weighs 10 Kg $85 brand new; (2) Mexller BAHIS B3, 27-speed, 7005 aluminum frame, 451mm rims, 10.5Kg, very handsome bike, $265. Both bikes were purchased brand new in Taiwan. You need a luggage of 24" wide to transport the bike as a check-in luggage.
In some North American cities such as Toronto, bikes with 20" wheels are allowed on the sidewalk.
In some North American cities such as Toronto, bikes with 20" wheels are allowed on the sidewalk.
Last edited by violini; 05-02-12 at 01:02 PM.
05-02-12, 06:29 AM
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I own two 20" folders: (1) 7-speed Schimano, 6061 frame, 406mm rims, weighs 10 Kg $85 brand new; (2) Mexller BAHIS B3, 24-speed, 7005 aluminum frame, 451mm rims, 10.5Kg, very handsome bike, $265. Both bikes were purchased brand new in Taiwan. You need a luggage of 24" wide to transport the bike as a check-in luggage.
In some North American cities such as Toronto, bikes with 20" wheels are allowed on the sidewalk.
In some North American cities such as Toronto, bikes with 20" wheels are allowed on the sidewalk.
05-02-12, 10:11 AM
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On a side note, does the 1-1.5 miles away parking area at a fixed location? or is it variable (ie. you have to hunt around for a parking space) I only ask because another option if you have a full size bike you're not too worried about, is to ride it back and forth and lock it at both ends of the ride. (parking area and at work) Just another option!
05-02-12, 10:21 AM
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I own two 20" folders: (1) 7-speed Schimano, 6061 frame, 406mm rims, weighs 10 Kg $85 brand new; (2) Mexller BAHIS B3, 24-speed, 7005 aluminum frame, 451mm rims, 10.5Kg, very handsome bike, $265. Both bikes were purchased brand new in Taiwan. You need a luggage of 24" wide to transport the bike as a check-in luggage.
05-02-12, 11:04 AM
#34
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I'm a Brompton man so I can't tell you about the Dahon brand specifically, but here's my two cents on your description and idea:
1) For a 1.5 mile commute from the free parking spot it would work great, assuming you don't have many hills. Keep in mind, however, that the bikes with smaller wheels fold up into a smaller space when compact, but they travel slower than a regular bike. Much slower. You could probably fit a folder with 20" wheels in your trunk and be able to get to work a little faster. I also find myself paying a lot of attention to the roads, because the 16 inch wheels can easily fall into a small rut or really bang up against the backside of a pothole, so the condition of the road you ride on should play a factor in your purchase decision.
2) Where will the bike be stored at work? A folder with 16 inch wheels should be able to fit under a desk, a 20 incher might or might not. Will the bike be folded and carried on an elevator? Also keep in mind that if you are planning to lock up the bike outside, most folding bikes have a-typical frames that don't always work that well with a single U lock.
3) The smaller folders often have proprietary bags that can carry the bike when folded. I use mine when entering a business that objects to me carrying in a folded bike just because they have a "no bikes indoors" policy. When it is in the bag, it just looks like a piece of luggage.
4) How much do you plan on using the bike elsewhere? For me, folding bikes became addictive. I first got one to put in the trunk of my car when traveling so I could ride at remote destinations. Now, I take my folding bike everywhere...literally...I never have to lock it up and it never gets scratched in a bike rack because I simply fold it up and carry it inside with me. If I go shopping I either put the folded bike in the shopping cart or use the bike itself as a shopping cart (it's a Brompton-specific feature). By the way, it's a total chick magnet. To do that you'll want one of the smaller folding bikes, the bikes with 20 inch wheels will be a little too big.
5) If the bike is only to be used for the 1.5 mile commute from free parking and there's no hills, you might want to consider a single speed. Less maintenance, less weight, less cost (generally speaking) and in some cases a smaller size when folded.
1) For a 1.5 mile commute from the free parking spot it would work great, assuming you don't have many hills. Keep in mind, however, that the bikes with smaller wheels fold up into a smaller space when compact, but they travel slower than a regular bike. Much slower. You could probably fit a folder with 20" wheels in your trunk and be able to get to work a little faster. I also find myself paying a lot of attention to the roads, because the 16 inch wheels can easily fall into a small rut or really bang up against the backside of a pothole, so the condition of the road you ride on should play a factor in your purchase decision.
2) Where will the bike be stored at work? A folder with 16 inch wheels should be able to fit under a desk, a 20 incher might or might not. Will the bike be folded and carried on an elevator? Also keep in mind that if you are planning to lock up the bike outside, most folding bikes have a-typical frames that don't always work that well with a single U lock.
3) The smaller folders often have proprietary bags that can carry the bike when folded. I use mine when entering a business that objects to me carrying in a folded bike just because they have a "no bikes indoors" policy. When it is in the bag, it just looks like a piece of luggage.
4) How much do you plan on using the bike elsewhere? For me, folding bikes became addictive. I first got one to put in the trunk of my car when traveling so I could ride at remote destinations. Now, I take my folding bike everywhere...literally...I never have to lock it up and it never gets scratched in a bike rack because I simply fold it up and carry it inside with me. If I go shopping I either put the folded bike in the shopping cart or use the bike itself as a shopping cart (it's a Brompton-specific feature). By the way, it's a total chick magnet. To do that you'll want one of the smaller folding bikes, the bikes with 20 inch wheels will be a little too big.
5) If the bike is only to be used for the 1.5 mile commute from free parking and there's no hills, you might want to consider a single speed. Less maintenance, less weight, less cost (generally speaking) and in some cases a smaller size when folded.
05-02-12, 11:08 AM
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I own two 20" folders: (1) 7-speed Schimano, 6061 frame, 406mm rims, weighs 10 Kg $85 brand new; (2) Mexller BAHIS B3, 24-speed, 7005 aluminum frame, 451mm rims, 10.5Kg, very handsome bike, $265. Both bikes were purchased brand new in Taiwan. You need a luggage of 24" wide to transport the bike as a check-in luggage.
In some North American cities such as Toronto, bikes with 20" wheels are allowed on the sidewalk.
In some North American cities such as Toronto, bikes with 20" wheels are allowed on the sidewalk.
05-02-12, 11:59 AM
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I'm a Brompton man so I can't tell you about the Dahon brand specifically, but here's my two cents on your description and idea:
1) For a 1.5 mile commute from the free parking spot it would work great, assuming you don't have many hills. Keep in mind, however, that the bikes with smaller wheels fold up into a smaller space when compact, but they travel slower than a regular bike. Much slower. You could probably fit a folder with 20" wheels in your trunk and be able to get to work a little faster. I also find myself paying a lot of attention to the roads, because the 16 inch wheels can easily fall into a small rut or really bang up against the backside of a pothole, so the condition of the road you ride on should play a factor in your purchase decision.
2) Where will the bike be stored at work? A folder with 16 inch wheels should be able to fit under a desk, a 20 incher might or might not. Will the bike be folded and carried on an elevator? Also keep in mind that if you are planning to lock up the bike outside, most folding bikes have a-typical frames that don't always work that well with a single U lock.
3) The smaller folders often have proprietary bags that can carry the bike when folded. I use mine when entering a business that objects to me carrying in a folded bike just because they have a "no bikes indoors" policy. When it is in the bag, it just looks like a piece of luggage.
4) How much do you plan on using the bike elsewhere? For me, folding bikes became addictive. I first got one to put in the trunk of my car when traveling so I could ride at remote destinations. Now, I take my folding bike everywhere...literally...I never have to lock it up and it never gets scratched in a bike rack because I simply fold it up and carry it inside with me. If I go shopping I either put the folded bike in the shopping cart or use the bike itself as a shopping cart (it's a Brompton-specific feature). By the way, it's a total chick magnet. To do that you'll want one of the smaller folding bikes, the bikes with 20 inch wheels will be a little too big.
5) If the bike is only to be used for the 1.5 mile commute from free parking and there's no hills, you might want to consider a single speed. Less maintenance, less weight, less cost (generally speaking) and in some cases a smaller size when folded.
1) For a 1.5 mile commute from the free parking spot it would work great, assuming you don't have many hills. Keep in mind, however, that the bikes with smaller wheels fold up into a smaller space when compact, but they travel slower than a regular bike. Much slower. You could probably fit a folder with 20" wheels in your trunk and be able to get to work a little faster. I also find myself paying a lot of attention to the roads, because the 16 inch wheels can easily fall into a small rut or really bang up against the backside of a pothole, so the condition of the road you ride on should play a factor in your purchase decision.
2) Where will the bike be stored at work? A folder with 16 inch wheels should be able to fit under a desk, a 20 incher might or might not. Will the bike be folded and carried on an elevator? Also keep in mind that if you are planning to lock up the bike outside, most folding bikes have a-typical frames that don't always work that well with a single U lock.
3) The smaller folders often have proprietary bags that can carry the bike when folded. I use mine when entering a business that objects to me carrying in a folded bike just because they have a "no bikes indoors" policy. When it is in the bag, it just looks like a piece of luggage.
4) How much do you plan on using the bike elsewhere? For me, folding bikes became addictive. I first got one to put in the trunk of my car when traveling so I could ride at remote destinations. Now, I take my folding bike everywhere...literally...I never have to lock it up and it never gets scratched in a bike rack because I simply fold it up and carry it inside with me. If I go shopping I either put the folded bike in the shopping cart or use the bike itself as a shopping cart (it's a Brompton-specific feature). By the way, it's a total chick magnet. To do that you'll want one of the smaller folding bikes, the bikes with 20 inch wheels will be a little too big.
5) If the bike is only to be used for the 1.5 mile commute from free parking and there's no hills, you might want to consider a single speed. Less maintenance, less weight, less cost (generally speaking) and in some cases a smaller size when folded.
I got the bag for the Tokyo and plan to carry it in and keep it in the coat closet here at work. The road is pretty smooth so I am hoping the 16" will work just fine.
Thanks again!
05-02-12, 12:33 PM
#37
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Then I went to the stores, (1) take subway to Taipei city gov. station, walk on Gi-lung Road to the end,
松山基隆路1段6號方程式單車工坊 ($85 aluminum bike, NT$2,500)
(2)中壢市中北路二段４６８號 (where I bought BAHIS B3)
Take train to Tao-Yuen and walk to the store.
I put BAHIS B3 in the bag and took the train to Tairoko, from there I biked along the east coast hi-way to Kenting. Took train again to Koahsiung and then hi-speed train back to Taipei. You would have to pay one full ticket for a non-folding bike on train.
I stayed with a friend on 忠誠路 and had my daily meals at department stores 新光三越 and 高島屋. The foods are fantastic.
Last edited by violini; 05-02-12 at 01:31 PM.
05-02-12, 02:51 PM
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I did a search, that store has has their own shop on Ruten. Here's the link for their folders:
https://class.ruten.com.tw/user/index...55&o=0&m=1&p=1
The auction sites in Taiwan are riddled with cheap generic folders. I myself own one of these folders. No doubt they're cheap, but they're also heavy and of poor quality.
I'm assuming this is the bike you bought?
https://goods.ruten.com.tw/item/show?21111228959472
The quality on that bike looks better than average(judging from the folding latch and hinge). It's listed weight is 11kg, have you weighed it yourself?
You biked from Taroko Gorge to Kending?!?! Wow
That must have been one hell of a ride.
https://class.ruten.com.tw/user/index...55&o=0&m=1&p=1
The auction sites in Taiwan are riddled with cheap generic folders. I myself own one of these folders. No doubt they're cheap, but they're also heavy and of poor quality.
I'm assuming this is the bike you bought?
https://goods.ruten.com.tw/item/show?21111228959472
The quality on that bike looks better than average(judging from the folding latch and hinge). It's listed weight is 11kg, have you weighed it yourself?
You biked from Taroko Gorge to Kending?!?! Wow
That must have been one hell of a ride.
05-02-12, 05:53 PM
#39
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I am not really crazy about bicycles, just want some thing which serves my purpose. I tried 2 bikes made by Pacific Cycles, didn't really like them, besides I was not willing to pay US$2,000 for it.
I liked that little bike store in Taipei. The owner is a nice young lady, I bought the cheap aluminum bike there for my wife. It's well made, weighs only 10 Kg, what can you expect for NT$2,500? That model has since been sold out, you can't buy an aluminum bike for that amount any more. Next time I go to Taiwan, I won't mind work for her.
BAHIS B3 is a better bike, weighs 10.5 Kg on my friend's bathroom scale, 27-speed, and 21" wheels. The folding junction box is very well made, it is tight and no free play at all when latched up. It is much easier to get a precise casting in aluminum (not in steel due to higher distortion). I had great time using this bike on the east coast trip. BAHIS B5 (and MEXLLER M5) is not a good one. It has a rear shock but no hinge at the crank center.
For long trip, I use a big and soft saddle with hole/groove at the center, and don't over-inflate the tires. The highways in Taiwan are generally quite good. I don't feel any need for the front and rear shocks It's better to keep the bike as light as possible.
I liked that little bike store in Taipei. The owner is a nice young lady, I bought the cheap aluminum bike there for my wife. It's well made, weighs only 10 Kg, what can you expect for NT$2,500? That model has since been sold out, you can't buy an aluminum bike for that amount any more. Next time I go to Taiwan, I won't mind work for her.
BAHIS B3 is a better bike, weighs 10.5 Kg on my friend's bathroom scale, 27-speed, and 21" wheels. The folding junction box is very well made, it is tight and no free play at all when latched up. It is much easier to get a precise casting in aluminum (not in steel due to higher distortion). I had great time using this bike on the east coast trip. BAHIS B5 (and MEXLLER M5) is not a good one. It has a rear shock but no hinge at the crank center.
For long trip, I use a big and soft saddle with hole/groove at the center, and don't over-inflate the tires. The highways in Taiwan are generally quite good. I don't feel any need for the front and rear shocks It's better to keep the bike as light as possible.
Last edited by violini; 05-03-12 at 11:01 AM.
05-04-12, 10:16 AM
#41
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I was new to folding bikes. In February this year while I was in Taiwan, I visited several stores specialized in folding bike in Taipei area. First of all, I must say that I am not the one really "into" bicycle as a hobby, therefore, I will not spend extra money for some thing which is not better as a mechanical bicycle, just different. Here are my conclusions:
(1)In modern manufacturing, a bike company make only the main frame, the rest of the components are supplied by other manufacturers which can be located any where in the world. Some companies don't make any thing, they order every thing and assemble them together to be their own brand. The frame materials can be divided into two: carbon steel (plain carbon steel and alloy steel such as 4000 series), aluminum alloy (6061 and 7005). I exclude carbon fibre re-enforced plastics. Bikes with steel frame are usually heavy (13-15 Kg) but stronger. If you are a heavy person, say 200 lb, you are better off buying an iron folder. The problem of steel frame is, it will rust over time. The price of iron folders is in the range of 1,800 - 3,000 Taiwan dollars. I exclude iron folders by brand name such as Dahon, you'll pay extra for their established name, not necessarily will ride better. Folders with aluminum frame weigh around 10-11 Kg, price starting from NT$5,000.
(2) The front to rear axle distance is usually one meter. Some bikes have the seat tube and front tube angled to accommodate taller riders. You have to try the bike in question to see if it fits you.
(3) I was looking for a folding bike for use as a mixed transportation and for occasional touring in the far-away land. The only choice is 20” wheels. In this category, there are 2 rim sizes: 406 and 451mm, the corresponding tire diameters are roughly 19” and 21”, respectively. I have one of each in tire diameter. I also bought two spare 406 rims with 48 spokes for installing bigger tires.
(4) Steel or aluminum? I tried both and felt the difference in effort to propel a 15 Kg and 10 Kg bike is quite considerable, particularly when going up hill. My final decision was to buy a 10.5 Kg aluminum bike with 451 rims (BAHIS B3). In fact, the two steel bikes of GINORI and SRS brands I tried were very well built and had full suspensions for only NT$2,800. I might get one of those in the future for short commuting such as for going to the grocery store. BAHIS B3 and WEMAX X5i (451) were the two finalists for me. In the end, I chose B3 for its anodized coloring.
(5) I am very happy with my cheap folder, GOAL GT1, ($85). This is the bike I am going to keep and sell B3. Next time I go to Taiwan, I'll buy an aluminum folder with full suspension.
(1)In modern manufacturing, a bike company make only the main frame, the rest of the components are supplied by other manufacturers which can be located any where in the world. Some companies don't make any thing, they order every thing and assemble them together to be their own brand. The frame materials can be divided into two: carbon steel (plain carbon steel and alloy steel such as 4000 series), aluminum alloy (6061 and 7005). I exclude carbon fibre re-enforced plastics. Bikes with steel frame are usually heavy (13-15 Kg) but stronger. If you are a heavy person, say 200 lb, you are better off buying an iron folder. The problem of steel frame is, it will rust over time. The price of iron folders is in the range of 1,800 - 3,000 Taiwan dollars. I exclude iron folders by brand name such as Dahon, you'll pay extra for their established name, not necessarily will ride better. Folders with aluminum frame weigh around 10-11 Kg, price starting from NT$5,000.
(2) The front to rear axle distance is usually one meter. Some bikes have the seat tube and front tube angled to accommodate taller riders. You have to try the bike in question to see if it fits you.
(3) I was looking for a folding bike for use as a mixed transportation and for occasional touring in the far-away land. The only choice is 20” wheels. In this category, there are 2 rim sizes: 406 and 451mm, the corresponding tire diameters are roughly 19” and 21”, respectively. I have one of each in tire diameter. I also bought two spare 406 rims with 48 spokes for installing bigger tires.
(4) Steel or aluminum? I tried both and felt the difference in effort to propel a 15 Kg and 10 Kg bike is quite considerable, particularly when going up hill. My final decision was to buy a 10.5 Kg aluminum bike with 451 rims (BAHIS B3). In fact, the two steel bikes of GINORI and SRS brands I tried were very well built and had full suspensions for only NT$2,800. I might get one of those in the future for short commuting such as for going to the grocery store. BAHIS B3 and WEMAX X5i (451) were the two finalists for me. In the end, I chose B3 for its anodized coloring.
(5) I am very happy with my cheap folder, GOAL GT1, ($85). This is the bike I am going to keep and sell B3. Next time I go to Taiwan, I'll buy an aluminum folder with full suspension.
Last edited by violini; 05-15-12 at 08:00 PM.
05-07-12, 08:30 PM
#42
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Good to know, but I ordered a Citizen Tokyo this afternoon. Apparently Dahon is no longer making Curves.
The Tokyo is the only reasonably priced 16" I could find, and while the reviews here range from "meh." to "awesome!!" on the Tokyo I cannot find a single negative review.
Also, I figure no matter what bike I get now I will wind up upgrading in the future if I get really serious about this so why spend $600 just to upgrade later vs. less than $250.
I got the bag and rear rack for it. I'm excited to take some pics and post a nice little review of what I think.
Thank you all so much for all of your input - without it I would have never thought of Citizen. I will also be reviewing this thread when it is time to upgrade.
The Tokyo is the only reasonably priced 16" I could find, and while the reviews here range from "meh." to "awesome!!" on the Tokyo I cannot find a single negative review.
Also, I figure no matter what bike I get now I will wind up upgrading in the future if I get really serious about this so why spend $600 just to upgrade later vs. less than $250.
I got the bag and rear rack for it. I'm excited to take some pics and post a nice little review of what I think.
Thank you all so much for all of your input - without it I would have never thought of Citizen. I will also be reviewing this thread when it is time to upgrade.
05-07-12, 08:44 PM
#43
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My Tokyo is supposed to arrive on Wednesday!
05-07-12, 09:07 PM
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Congrats on the Tokyo! What color did you order it in?
05-09-12, 05:50 PM
#46
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cool. hopefully it works out ok for you. i had a tokyo before and i got 2 complains with it - 1. it's too heavy for it's size and 2. it's so slow. i decided to sell it and bought myself a used boardwalk D8 for $125. the difference is like night and day. congrats on your new tokyo.
05-09-12, 08:45 PM
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So it came today... First impressions:
- I agree that it's heavy, but it was also inexpensive.
- The fit and finish is pretty good. It's like a Ford.. Not a Lincoln, but not a Daewoo. (full disclosure: I've never actually been in a Daewoo)
- It is, indeed, horrifically under-geared and slow.
- It is plenty comfortable for a mile-long ride. Not nearly as twitchy as I thought a 16" bike would be.
- According to my wife it doesn't look like a total clown bike and I don't look ridiculous on it.
- It's not super compact, but I got the bag for it and it fits nicely in my trunk. Should be easy to carry up to my office.
Overall: C++
Better than I expected. Far from perfect, but for less than half of the price of the Curve (and less than 1/8 of a Brommie) I'm very happy.
Happy to answer any questions!
- I agree that it's heavy, but it was also inexpensive.
- The fit and finish is pretty good. It's like a Ford.. Not a Lincoln, but not a Daewoo. (full disclosure: I've never actually been in a Daewoo)
- It is, indeed, horrifically under-geared and slow.
- It is plenty comfortable for a mile-long ride. Not nearly as twitchy as I thought a 16" bike would be.
- According to my wife it doesn't look like a total clown bike and I don't look ridiculous on it.
- It's not super compact, but I got the bag for it and it fits nicely in my trunk. Should be easy to carry up to my office.
Overall: C++
Better than I expected. Far from perfect, but for less than half of the price of the Curve (and less than 1/8 of a Brommie) I'm very happy.
Happy to answer any questions!
05-10-12, 07:47 AM
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