Chi_Z

why did we ever move away from square taper

Marcus_Ti

All else equal...about 1 pound of weight.

HTupolev

Because you can make a wider-diameter spindle with similar strength and rigidity at a lower weight in lower-density materials. Obviously this poses its own drawbacks, but making BB shells huge to compensate isn't an unnatural choice for aluminum and carbon frame construction.
Furthermore, it's cheaper for bike manufacturers to make unthreaded shells than threaded, and trying to make BBs for 3-piece cranks like square-taper or Octalink work in press-fit shells is a clunky proposition.

The reason I'm using square taper here - and a part of why I bought this particular frame - is the amount of control that it offers over crank setup. There's a broad assortment of parts available, and the ability to swap spindles and shift them laterally gives loads of control over chainline and q-factor.
One of my road bikes has a triple with a 142mm q-factor.

But, I should contain my excitement until I have this drivetrain together and it works, which is hopefully something that will happen. It might not, because what I'm attempting to do is stupid and bad.

Typically more like half a pound. Since the cranks don't have the spindle, they're not always at a weight disadvantage versus similar-tier modern two-piece cranks, and many quality BBs are in the 250g ballpark or lower (below 200g if you're cool with titanium spindles).

It's true that square-taper setups sometimes get ultra-heavy, but that's in large part because square taper's biggest remaining market is on setups that are cheap and beefy. A SunRace FCM300 paired with a BB-UN55 is going to end up at around 3 pounds, but I'm not sure what an "all else equal" setup would look like for literally any other type of spindle. I mean, if I go to Campagnolo and I say that I want a triple crankset and a bottom bracket that will spin smoothly until the heat death of the universe, and I'd like it to be Ultra-Torque, and my budget is $40, what can they offer?

Marcus_Ti

Depends on the cranks.

I had an IRD Defiant 46/30 and UN-55 bottom bracket is a bit over 1 kilogram and costs $215USD new ($200 for the crank, $15 for the BB). The FSA SL-K 46/30 and BB that replaced it was about $400USD and weighed 600 grams....which, in the realm of weight weenie-ism, even getting 1gram/$ is good--getting 2gram/$ is a steal. Keeping $$ spent constant would still get you 105-level cranks and get you your half-pound saved. Either will be much stiffer.

Sq taper is gone from higher-end because it was heavy, and not stiff. And the lighter you made it (titanium spindles--EEeeek), the more noodly it got. And as I recall those Ti spindle BBs had posted weight limits. The only big advantage Ye Old sealed cartridge tapers had was durability, and adjustability of the spindle..

Metieval

Nice!

kokak

Just curious... how are you liking the Catalyst Pedals?

DarKris

For me at 350lbs, they aren’t as stiff/reliable as 24mm/30mm spindles

So I actually ditched the tires. They got up to 55.5mm at the casing and with only about 3-4mm between the stays I didn’t want to risk rubbing. The knobs were only about 51mm so that wasn’t the issue. Gonna try a 2.0 Continental Race King and if that doesn’t work I’ll run Teravail Rutlands.

I like them a lot though I still need to run crank spacers to get my q-factor just right. My second favorite pedal is the Crank Bros. Stamp pedals in the large size. It’s wider than the Catalyst but slightly shorter but the width of the Stamp pedals means I don’t have to use spacers

Metieval

I was thinking 650x50 Strada USH, or the 650x50 MSO

DarKris

I considered the MSO’s but I wasn’t too keen on the weight of the tires. Also I tried the 700x50mm MSOs before and on 23mm rims they ended up measuring to about 54mm. Wasn’t sure if the 650b version would turn out the same or more considering my even wider rims.

Steve B.

Not sure it strictly qualifies as something “for” the gravel bike, but I bought a gravel bike, my first dedicated bike for off roads, other than my mt. bikes. Cannondale Topstone 105 aluminum.

Test ride today, it’s great (forgot to take picture in woods), fits well, but I’ve got road fit dialed in. Came with a 42m bar, which is odd on a bike for folks in the 5’-9” and up range. I’ve ordered a 46, my usual width.

Did 6 miles of dirt of the 14 I could squeeze in this morning, and this is not an area with an abundance of dirt roads. Will add a 2nd set of wheels and 28mm tires, plus a tighter cassette, to use as a commuter next spring.

Duende108

What did I just get for my gravel bike? A set of road wheels!

DarKris

Ok *hopefully* I am finished with Looking for 27.5“ tires that fit my bike. Running the rear at 35 PSI and the front at 30 PSI. Really fun setup 😬






Casing width

Tread Width

dualresponse

SURLY OGRE' (fork)
Came in the mail last night.... Installed on my 700c converted trek 930 frankenbike. I didn't want to cut the steerer too low until I found out if it worked or not. Amazingly, the geometry works!!!!

CarloM

Good news and bad news on purchasing front.

• Good news: LBS was having a 20% off Bontrager Aeolus Pro 3V wheels, which have the 24mm internal rim width and the 108 point hub, which sounds like a boss when freewheeling.
• Bad news: rear wheel was out of stock for Shimano...so it's on back order, not just at the LBS, but at Trek in general, so I have to wait a bit before I take ownership.

diverge52rider

Cheap aero bars ... I just hope they're worth the $12.

Marcus_Ti

Found these handlebars on sale on ChainReation for $90USD shipped:

https://spank-ind.com/products/spank...84%A2-drop-bar

Was thinking of changing out my Cowbell for a Cowchipper--but this bar I think I'll like as the entire tops-area is 31.8mm as opposed to the Whisky and Salsa and Easton versions that taper down almost instantly. Also has basically no sweep.

Whether the vibrocore stuff works or not...the shape should be better.

tyrion

Those look nice. I wish more bars had full 31.8mm diameter across the top like that.

srode1

I was looking at their 12 degree wing bars but can't find anything on how long the 31.8mm section is - and I need room for Aero Bars, a light and a Garmin mount so it's risky purchasing them sight unseen. I like the less flare and the flat top on these, but it's a no-go without that info and they don't have any contact information on their website. (not even sure they are rated for Aero Bars).

CarloM

Bontrager Aeolus Pro 3V (25mm internal width, 32mm outer width, "Rapid 108 Hub" which is a 6 pawl 54 tooth drive ring). Sounds very similar to my 54 tooth DT 240s hubs (just a more muted sound, but the angle of engagement is really small, I think around 6 degrees). Mounted new 38c Panaracer GravelKing SK tubeless on them. Just waiting for my rotors and cassette to arrive tomorrow.

The only bummer is that it's going to be Ultegra rotors because the 160mm Dura-Ace rotors were on backorder at the places I normally get them for reasonably cheap.

HTupolev

Deda Dog Fang.



I hope to never discover whether or not it works!

mstateglfr 

You are a very capable home mechanic, so this is a great opportunity to ask you why you need this as it isnt at all a question of your abilities and rather- why is it needed even for someone who has proper shifting.
Thats on your friction shifting bike, so if the H and L limits are set, there just wont be any chain drop inside the small ring, correct?

Wasnt sure if its on the bike as precaution though not needed before, of if dropping the chain is an issue for some reason on friction shifting or on that crank or something like that.

HTupolev

It's to address an actual problem.

Part of the issue is that the rear derailleur is an Alivio T4000, which does not have a super-strong tensioner spring to compensate for the super-long cage; the result is a drivetrain that's prone to the chain flopping around dramatically on rough terrain. That's a common quirk with Shimano's cheaper MTB rear derailleurs. A couple times it actually managed to throw the chain off from the middle ring when we hit a patch of super-chunky gravel.
But this hasn't been much of an issue. If I'm going slow, the chain basically never gets bouncy enough to get thrown. And if I'm going fast (i.e. in the middle or big rings), in the very rare event that I get a drop, it would be easy to shift back onto the rings since I've got momentum to work with.

The main issue I'm trying to solve, and which isn't that rare, is the chain occasionally being thrown off the inside on front downshifts. I'm not really sure why this particular drivetrain is prone to this, it never happens on other triples that I've set up. It might be partly due to the size of the jump: the 38->24 14-tooth jump isn't a huge front shift, but it's bigger than most middle-to-small jumps on triples, and you have limited control of how close the FD's outer cage plate sits over the middle ring during middle-to-small shifts (especially on unmatched chainring and FD arrangements).
I'm not sure how "proper" the setup can be said to be. If I was serious about finding a more correct-ish solution, I'd probably start by looking into a better-matched front derailleur. Originally the bike had a Deore triple FD, but the inner plate couldn't clear the middle ring on middle-to-large upshifts unless the derailleur was set ridiculously high. Currently it has an FD-CX70, which seems visually less-wrong but isn't exactly made for a wide-range triple. Something like an IRD Alpina might be a better match, or perhaps the front derailleur that I have laying around from a 1990 Bridgestone RB-T.

Rides4Beer

GravelKing SK+ in 43mm. Good grip, but damn they're slow. So I bought some 40mm Contintental Terra Speeds, we'll see how those work out. The SK+ might be great offroad and super durable (a lot of people seem to like them, maybe the regular SKs are better and it's just the Plus with the extra layer that is slow), but I need a faster tire for the riding/racing I do. Limited reviews on the Terra Speeds, but they tested about 5w faster than the SKs, figure the SK+ is probably a few watts slower still. Doing some fast gravel in VA next week when I go to visit family, see if I can get some segment PRs.

westrid_dad

Finally gave in, and mounted fenders on my "fair weather commuter/graveler/single-tracker/roadster" Cannondale Topstone. I didn't think I'd need them necessarily, but after I got tired of listening to the incessant hum of studs on dry (cold) pavement while riding my Surly Ogre (the foul weather commuter), I added fenders to the Cannondale as well. At least for the season, we'll see...

Still need to fine-tune fit, and trim the velcro straps up front, but I think I'm going to like these SKS Speedrockers.

https://www.sks-germany.com/en/products/speedrocker/

Other recent additional include lights. While a big fan of dyno power, I wasn't ready to invest in dyno hubs for both wheelsets, so rechargeable USB it is. But I didn't want to give up a proper cut-off beam for road-riding so I went with Busch + Müller Ixon Space up front for my primary light, up to 150 Lux steady beam.

https://www.bumm.de/en/products/akku...ukt/196l.html?
​​​​​​​
Add a mix of Lezyne and Bontrager for flashies front and back. Now I feel I have adequate lighting for road commuting, day or night.

IronM

I gave in and put a Redshift Shock Stop stem on my gravel bike. I run 40's tubeless about about 33 lbs; but even then the rougher forest service roads were just beating me up too much. So far - results are 'meh', but I'll keep adjusting it to see if I can find a sweet spot of usefulness.