Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Bicycle Mechanics
Reload this Page >

Why do I have constant shifting problems

Notices
Bicycle Mechanics Broken bottom bracket? Tacoed wheel? If you're having problems with your bicycle, or just need help fixing a flat, drop in here for the latest on bicycle mechanics & bicycle maintenance.

Why do I have constant shifting problems

Old 02-22-21, 01:20 AM
  #1  
btppberk
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 139
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 77 Post(s)
Liked 26 Times in 23 Posts
Why do I have constant shifting problems

I've got a 2012 Focus Izalco with SRAM force. Since as long as I can remember, I've had some sort of trouble with shifting: dropped chains, difficulty/impossibility moving up to the big ring, rubbing on the front derailleur. Even when I've tuned it to perfection or the bike shop, it stays perfectly only for a few rides at most. Bike shops, furthermore, rarely get it right because they don't test it under load. My partner's shimano from the same generation, in contrast, almost never needs tuning.

These issues recently led me to replace my chain, cassette, and cogs, and yet there were immediate problems including some skipping on shifts and lots of rubbing on the front derailleur.

Of course maybe I and the LBS keeps messing up, but I've had such consistent problems with shifting, I suspect its something systematic. My only guess is that the internal routing (and I believe it was relatively new in 2012) is the problem. Or maybe there are known problems with SRAM force of that generation?

Any knowledge/hypotheses/tips would be very appreciated.
btppberk is offline  
Old 02-22-21, 01:52 AM
  #2  
cbrstar
BMX Connoisseur
 
cbrstar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Canada
Posts: 774

Bikes: 1988 Kuwahara Newport, 1983 Nishiki, 1984 Diamond Back Viper, 1991 Dyno Compe

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 399 Post(s)
Liked 108 Times in 69 Posts
I don't have any experience with it personally. But my friend was telling me that he had trouble with his SRAM double tap shifters that were doing similar things. He had to clean and rebuild them for them to work properly. And he told me that it wasn't an easy fix. I've also heard of people complaining that the hood gets jammed up into the shifter causing it to do things like drop a whole bunch of gears. But you may not have to go to those extremes as under the hood there is a "Reach" adjustment which may need some fine tuning.
cbrstar is offline  
Likes For cbrstar:
Old 02-22-21, 09:07 AM
  #3  
Andrew R Stewart 
Senior Member
 
Andrew R Stewart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 18,003

Bikes: Stewart S&S coupled sport tourer, Stewart Sunday light, Stewart Commuting, Stewart Touring, Co Motion Tandem, Stewart 3-Spd, Stewart Track, Fuji Finest, Mongoose Tomac ATB, GT Bravado ATB, JCP Folder, Stewart 650B ATB

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4172 Post(s)
Liked 3,792 Times in 2,271 Posts
We see more SRAM ft shifting issues then with Shimano. Some say this is why SRAM has pushed the whole 1x thing, it's well known their ft shifting isn't up to par in general. When the rings are replaced use Shimano, not SRAM. We've seen this change out help a lot often. Andy
__________________
AndrewRStewart
Andrew R Stewart is online now  
Likes For Andrew R Stewart:
Old 02-22-21, 09:22 AM
  #4  
mack_turtle
n00b
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,397

Bikes: Surly Karate Monkey, Twin Six Standard Rando

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 428 Post(s)
Liked 466 Times in 273 Posts
SRAM Force from 2012: that's your problem. I worked in a bike shop around that era and all of the Trek, Cervelo, and Cannondale road bikes we sold with SRAM drivetrain were a hassle. One thing that helped a lot was switching those bikes to better chainrings. Praxis rings worked well for our customers.
mack_turtle is offline  
Likes For mack_turtle:
Old 02-23-21, 01:21 AM
  #5  
oldbobcat
Senior Member
 
oldbobcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Boulder County, CO
Posts: 4,370

Bikes: '80 Masi Gran Criterium, '12 Trek Madone, early '60s Frejus track

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 508 Post(s)
Liked 434 Times in 331 Posts
As a pro mechanic I'm embarrassed to admit that my bike, a 2012 Trek Madone with 10-speed Force, is the best mechanical shifting SRAM system I've ever worked on. I've gotten other bikes close but not quite, including 10- and 11-speed yaw derailleurs. And I'm still using the original chainrings.

I suspect that the other setups were shifting so badly for so long that the ramps on the big ring were worn down. But here's my guide. Set the derailleur low, 1-1.5 mm above the tallest teeth on the big ring, with the outer plate parallel to the rings. Set the outer limit screw so the outer plate clears the chain by about 0.5 mm when the chain is on big-small (front to rear). Set cable tension so the upshift hits the limit screw softly. Softly being the key word. There might even be a barely perceptible bit of overshift. That is, after the shift, the cage might settle back a hair's width. Then fine-tune. You don't want the outer limit so loose that you're throwing the chain over the top, the cable so tight that it's jamming against the limit screw, or the cable tight and the screw loose that it's jamming the chain tight against the big ring and wearing out the ramps. It's all about getting just enough pressure on the chain for the ramps to push and lift the thing onto the big ring.

Set the low limit to eliminate rub under tension in small-big (front to rear). Your front trim should then eliminate rub from the big ring to the two or three innermost cogs (cross-chaining).

And here's an operational tip. Shifting to the small ring from the smaller rear cogs can lead to chain drops off the small ring, due to sudden loss of chain tension. This is especially on 50-34 compacts. Better to downshift a couple cogs on the cassette before dropping onto the small ring. Good luck.
oldbobcat is offline  
Likes For oldbobcat:
Old 02-25-21, 12:00 AM
  #6  
btppberk
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 139
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 77 Post(s)
Liked 26 Times in 23 Posts
Thanks, everyone, for the feedback.

OldBobyCat, I've definitely discovered your tip about shifting to the small ring. Everytime I shift to the small ring while cranking up hill I pray a little. Shifting up to the big ring from the middle of the cassette randomly also causes the chain to come off, like today, though luckily that's less of an emergency. I'll try your tips for setting the derailleurs and see how it goes. If not, sounds like some new rings (though I just bought a pair!) are in order.
btppberk is offline  
Likes For btppberk:
Old 02-25-21, 06:52 PM
  #7  
oldbobcat
Senior Member
 
oldbobcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Boulder County, CO
Posts: 4,370

Bikes: '80 Masi Gran Criterium, '12 Trek Madone, early '60s Frejus track

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 508 Post(s)
Liked 434 Times in 331 Posts
I'm not going to argue that SRAM isn't fussier about tuning than Shimano. But lately, I just set it up, twiddle the cables with the inline adjusters for about a couple rides while the housings set into the ferrules, and then forget about it until the cables fray. This is likely my last kit before I get too old to get on a road bike, unless someone gives me their E-Tap.
oldbobcat is offline  
Likes For oldbobcat:
Old 02-25-21, 10:50 PM
  #8  
Russ Roth
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: South Shore of Long Island
Posts: 2,762

Bikes: 2010 Carrera Volans, 2015 C-Dale Trail 2sl, 2017 Raleigh Rush Hour, 2017 Blue Proseccio, 1992 Giant Perigee, 80s Gitane Rallye Tandem

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1073 Post(s)
Liked 999 Times in 710 Posts
I've got 2012 sram force and the front shifting has always sucked. For whatever reason shifting to the big ring causes the chain to jam and slam into the chainstay. I changed rings and spent an hour on the phone with sram as I went over all the measurements to make sure chain line, derailleur position and a number of other measurements were spot on. Nothing helped and the problem never went away despite changing chainrings. A different frame severely reduced the number of times it happened but it still does. Its why my next bike wasn't sram and none since have been. My wife's rival has never had the problem so it might just be a first gen force issue. Mine was virtually the only force level bike that went through the shop at the time, everything was either red, rival and typically shimano.
Russ Roth is offline  
Likes For Russ Roth:
Old 02-26-21, 11:09 PM
  #9  
oldbobcat
Senior Member
 
oldbobcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Boulder County, CO
Posts: 4,370

Bikes: '80 Masi Gran Criterium, '12 Trek Madone, early '60s Frejus track

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 508 Post(s)
Liked 434 Times in 331 Posts
Originally Posted by Russ Roth
Nothing helped and the problem never went away despite changing chainrings. A different frame severely reduced the number of times it happened but it still does. Its why my next bike wasn't sram and none since have been. My wife's rival has never had the problem so it might just be a first gen force issue. Mine was virtually the only force level bike that went through the shop at the time, everything was either red, rival and typically shimano.
In the very beginning, before there was Red, I seem to recall an issue with Force shifters. SRAM was replacing them, no questions asked. We'd sold a lovely 2007 carbon LeMond on clearance, with Force, that never shifted right. Warranteed the shifters, replaced the chainrings. Nothing would help it, and that thing came back and got resold several times. It was a corporate shop, so it made the rounds. Finally I got to take a good close look at it and found that the crank spider was not flat. We gave that guy a new Red crankset and we never saw that bike again.
oldbobcat is offline  
Old 02-27-21, 06:57 PM
  #10  
Troul 
Senior Member
 
Troul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Mich
Posts: 7,291

Bikes: RSO E-tire dropper fixie brifter

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked 2,910 Times in 1,884 Posts
if it's bound up during it's attempt to shifting, it could force a static adjustment from the effected parts deflecting. oldbobcat's experience is what I'm thinking is the shifting culprit.
__________________
-Oh Hey!
Troul is offline  
Old 02-28-21, 12:47 AM
  #11  
cpach
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Mt Shasta, CA, USA
Posts: 2,140

Bikes: Too many. Giant Trance X 29, Surly Midnight Special get the most time.

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 530 Post(s)
Liked 311 Times in 235 Posts
Yeah, that generation of Sram front shifting isn't the best. If you switch to better chainrings (Praxis, or Shimano if you can find ones that will fit well) that'll do most of the work to make it better. A Shimano FD wouldn't hurt either.
cpach is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.