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Training Status??? (IV)

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Training Status??? (IV)

Old 05-26-20, 09:19 AM
  #14901  
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Wife and I did three days 35 miles/day, 105 miles total of team time trial for the Holiday weekend. We did the Carmel Mountain Road Park n Ride to Carlsbad but it was too slow with all the lights and traffic so we did two Camp Pendleton to San Clemente rides.

My petty / snarky behavior included interaction with a couple of cling ons on the coast ride including an old guy that jumped on my wife’s wheel which was a happenstance of traffic where we got separated. I politely told him that unless he was also married to her, she was my wheel and to vacate immediately - he did. I actually saved him the embarrassment of her riding him off her wheel. One other guy, who was a pretty good rider, obviously did not get the social distancing memo. He lasted for awhile until we rode him off our wheel as well. Riding someone off your wheel is just the best.
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Old 05-26-20, 11:16 AM
  #14902  
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Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
As an adult, when I get the hots for something, buy it and then abandon it, I call it a white elephant.
We have lots of white elephants at home. When I lived in the midwest, they'd do what was called a white elephant gift exchange. In new england we call it a yankee swap (not sure if the rules are the same though!)

As for training, really easy 90min z2 today, indoors even though it's sunny and high 70's today. I need my first outdoor solo/group ride to be something epic lol
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Old 05-26-20, 12:49 PM
  #14903  
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28mi last night, TT bike. Out and back until I hit 40k. Upper z2 and into z3. Almost 23mph at almost 60 feet per mile. Doggone curve at the bottom of the one hill is a "sit up and coast" deal. So you don't gain back all the time lost going uphill on the route. The 5 u-turns also killed the avg speed.

I'll take it. It's a rolling area in general.

Yeah, I think it would take more than 200w AP to go that quick on that route.
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Old 05-26-20, 12:50 PM
  #14904  
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Originally Posted by aaronmcd View Post
It isn't set all that low, I had it at 89% of my 12 minute effort from 3 weeks ago. May be a few watts low now. But this ride, riding at 85% felt almost like zone 2, even though I'd get tired riding over "threshold". Hopefully it is on the move or getting ready to move. Gonna raise it 8 watts based on this latest ride. Still poverty especially given my weight.
I did a 90% effort today right after I ate lunch. I caught a horrible cramp on my right side (rode too soon after I ate) about 10 mins into the interval and called it quits at 60 mins from not being able to take full breaths. It was also hot and humid, so I was starting to overheat anyway. I can't wait until the cold fronts start coming in again, this weather sucks.
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Old 05-26-20, 04:09 PM
  #14905  
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Originally Posted by ridethecliche View Post
gsteinb

Will you take me under your wing if I promise not to embarrass you and crash during the warm up to a crit?
I guess the pandemic is over
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Old 05-26-20, 05:32 PM
  #14906  
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Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
... I politely told him that unless he was also married to her, she was my wheel and to vacate immediately - he did. ...
I'm glad you didn't pull the "I got the COVID, I don't want to spew on you" routine.
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Old 05-26-20, 05:58 PM
  #14907  
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Last week was a rest week, but I did so much weed pulling I couldn't even close my hand, and my legs were sore from pulling them up.....so I don't think it was an effective one.

Probably easy today, probably smash tomorrow.

Oh yeah, I'm getting fat; well, 5 pounds over race weight. I need to start reeling that in....
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Old 05-26-20, 07:35 PM
  #14908  
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Whole lotta craziness in my training. Just brought my training notebook up to date.. I haven't skipped a day since 2.29. Before that was end of january when I was sick. Whether it be skiing, climbing or lifting I've done something. Was actually better than expected. I'm still skiing despite the warm temps. The snow line is just way higher than before! More like hiking with a heavy pack to have some fun on a descent.

Our gyms are open again, so lifting has resumed. Just trying not to hurt myself there.

Had a bunch of friends go and everest on Friday last week so I rode up to see them. I snuck in a 5 hr w/ 8700 ft of gain too. Nothing compared to those folks! One of my buddies went 9:37 minutes. Absolutely flying. Remember I live at altitude too!
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Old 05-26-20, 09:47 PM
  #14909  
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Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
I guess the pandemic is over
I'll wear my Bane mask!
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Old 05-27-20, 07:01 AM
  #14910  
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Originally Posted by ridethecliche View Post
I'll wear my Bane mask!
I don't really have any clue on what you're talking about with any of your posts. Get some rest.
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Old 05-27-20, 11:32 AM
  #14911  
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I'm going to try to introduce some structure back into my 'training.' Subscribed to trainingpeaks for a year so I could use their calendar to plan my workouts.

So far the tentative plan is to keep the focus on lifting until July (4x/week), while doing basic low intensity aerobic where I can, then switch to aerobic work while trying to slowly shed fat and drop the weights down to 2x/week.

Strength work currently consists of 4x/week, one day each for squats, deadlifts, bench, and press, following a 5/3/1 protocol with accessories. I'll be filling in the gaps with z2, alternating between cycling, rowing, and running, but keeping overall intensity and volume low. Z2 work will be primarily fasted in the mornings

Aerobic block will likely be 3-4 days of z2, 1 day of vo2max, 1 day of threshold, with progressively increasing durations for 5 weeks, 6th week rest and test, then reset durations at new power target (and if the power hasn't gone up significantly, then keep pushing duration). Lifting days will be 1 day deadlift/press, 1 day squats/bench, and minimal accessory work. I'll continue to progress if I'm able but the goal is to at least maintain. Progression for vo2 will be something like 8x3', 6x4', 5x5', 4x8'. Progression for threshold work will be something like 2x15', 2x20', 3x15', 2x25', 4x15', 3x20', 2x30', etc, or possibly similar but with sweet spot and longer starting durations. Testing will be trying to negative split alpe du zwift, starting at sweet spot and ramping up, taking the last 35-40 minutes or so avg as the new FTP (I have a habit of going out way too hard otherwise, and my 20 min power is usually skewed by anaerobic such that I can never really hold the calculated FTP for an hour). Z2 work will fill in the rest, primarily fasted, and I may continue to spend some time on the rower and running (rower to help offset imbalances, running because it's easy to fit in a stroller run with the kiddo mid-day)

Then I'm going to alternate every 12 weeks or so between the strength building and the endurance building phases, since I'm not planning on going back to racing for a bit. The end game is to slowly gain weight in the form of muscle, with minimal fat, while retaining a decent level of endurance and improving my sprint gradually over time. All this with the caveat of trying to not suck at being a dad being the priority, so I may need to skip workouts here and there.

Sorry if I posted this before, it's a bit of a self-experiment, but my hypothesis and my hope is that as I increase muscle mass, I should have a higher aerobic power ceiling via increased total mitochondrial volume within the leg muscles (though density will likely not improve or may even go down a bit). I've always felt that my legs run out of steam well before I feel like my lungs or heart are maxed out. It could be that this is an illusion, but I haven't found much research into the effect on aerobic power of increasing muscle mass, so I'm just going to try it for my self. I can't compete with the good climbers even at my lightest, so I might as well try to get better at the flats. Since most of the racing here consists of criteriums anyway, worst case scenario is my FTP hits the same levels but I have a bigger sprint and anaerobic capacity, so my performance should still be better overall. If all goes well and adding 10-15 lbs of muscle can bring my FTP from the ~280-290 @ 145 lbs up to 300-310 @ 160 lbs, and get my sprint from ~1200 to 1400+, then I think it'll be worth the additional weight.

Last edited by wktmeow; 05-27-20 at 11:35 AM.
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Old 05-27-20, 02:09 PM
  #14912  
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Originally Posted by wktmeow View Post
I've always felt that my legs run out of steam well before I feel like my lungs or heart are maxed out. It could be that this is an illusion, but I haven't found much research into the effect on aerobic power of increasing muscle mass, so I'm just going to try it for my self. I can't compete with the good climbers even at my lightest, so I might as well try to get better at the flats. Since most of the racing here consists of criteriums anyway, worst case scenario is my FTP hits the same levels but I have a bigger sprint and anaerobic capacity, so my performance should still be better overall. If all goes well and adding 10-15 lbs of muscle can bring my FTP from the ~280-290 @ 145 lbs up to 300-310 @ 160 lbs, and get my sprint from ~1200 to 1400+, then I think it'll be worth the additional weight.
That's pretty much what I set out to do by joining the gym. I made sure to get month to month and told them I was gonna cancel in 3 months. Turned out I got addicted and focused solely on lifting for 18 months. Then the gyms closed, and I can't keep my motivation without heavy barbells. So far my FTP is about 90 watts lower than best ever, and weight 20 lbs higher than the racing years. Ideally I try and alternate focus like your plan, but I'm so freaking obsessive. Be warned though, adding mass really slows you down on the flats also. Broad arms and shoulders are like a parachute.
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Old 05-27-20, 02:56 PM
  #14913  
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Did a Zwift group ride today advertised as "A" pace (Tour of All). Ended up with ~55' at 3.8 w/kg AP, third out of a group of 5 and about 5' ahead of the rest who probably actually treated it as a group ride. One solo dude finished like 2' ahead of us. So I guess it was like a race! Hard start, settled into a rotation with one other guy and swooped up all but the lone solo rider. Some "attacks" over the final hills on the course (NYC - Everything Bagel) splintered us up a bit at the end. Maybe next week I'll try an actual race on Zwift.

Tomorrow I'll do my 2x SST Epic KOM "free ride" for 2 hrs, then riding outdoors over the weekend, some road and MTB.
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Old 05-27-20, 02:59 PM
  #14914  
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Originally Posted by aaronmcd View Post
That's pretty much what I set out to do by joining the gym. I made sure to get month to month and told them I was gonna cancel in 3 months. Turned out I got addicted and focused solely on lifting for 18 months. Then the gyms closed, and I can't keep my motivation without heavy barbells. So far my FTP is about 90 watts lower than best ever, and weight 20 lbs higher than the racing years. Ideally I try and alternate focus like your plan, but I'm so freaking obsessive. Be warned though, adding mass really slows you down on the flats also. Broad arms and shoulders are like a parachute.
My best ever FTP is only about 50-60 watts higher than my first ever measured FTP so I don't think I have as much to lose

Curious to see how yours responds to adding the bike work back in. I've got the home gym so it's nice that I can just pop in and do some squats for 30 mins and be done. I hear you on the obsessiveness though. When I got the C2 rower I almost went full steam with that as well.
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Old 05-27-20, 03:21 PM
  #14915  
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Originally Posted by wktmeow View Post
My best ever FTP is only about 50-60 watts higher than my first ever measured FTP so I don't think I have as much to lose

Curious to see how yours responds to adding the bike work back in. I've got the home gym so it's nice that I can just pop in and do some squats for 30 mins and be done. I hear you on the obsessiveness though. When I got the C2 rower I almost went full steam with that as well.
Oh my first ever measured FTP was way higher than it is now lol.
For a month or so I was squatting
while wearing a backpack with a dumbbell and a bunch of water in it, while holding my wife in my arms who was wearing a backpack on the front with another dumbbell in it. It was a pain. And then deadlift? High rep single leg romanian deadlifts with minuscule PowerBlocks kinda suck.

Last edited by aaronmcd; 05-27-20 at 03:27 PM.
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Old 05-27-20, 09:41 PM
  #14916  
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I blew off my ride today (still did an easy hour) because I heard my aunt is sending us a bunch of steaks in the mail, so I went to the store and bought a wood pellet smoker / gas grill. A pretty poor excuse but I did hit my calorie numbers...
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Old 05-27-20, 10:05 PM
  #14917  
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Threshold climbing intervals on Mount Soledad. 2x10’.

In other news, we are starting a new high intensity strength training program. A boutique fitness center opened today and has an exemption from the closures. Since it is the only game in town, we joined. My wife did a session today and I am going on Friday. She loved it.
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Old 05-28-20, 05:02 PM
  #14918  
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Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
Threshold climbing intervals on Mount Soledad. 2x10’.

In other news, we are starting a new high intensity strength training program. A boutique fitness center opened today and has an exemption from the closures. Since it is the only game in town, we joined. My wife did a session today and I am going on Friday. She loved it.
Would this be whole body training or leg work only?
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Old 05-28-20, 07:33 PM
  #14919  
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Originally Posted by big john View Post
Would this be whole body training or leg work only?
I will let you know tomorrow. It is whole body on “special” machines. We will see.
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Old 05-28-20, 10:36 PM
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2 hour endurance / tempo ride along the coast to burn some calories and check out the beach action.
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Old 05-29-20, 03:30 PM
  #14921  
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I did the high intensity strength training workout. It is about what I expected but more interesting and I would say impossible to do without their equipment.

Their are five exercises including one balance on a vibrating plate and then 4 machine isometric exercise machines.

Balancing on one leg on a vibrating plate takes some practice. The first 10 seconds I get to fixate on a spot on the wall, the next 10 seconds looking up and then close my eyes for the last 10 seconds. I got about 3 seconds with my eyes closed for a total of 23 seconds on each leg. The vibration is designed as part of the warmup.

However, before I went to the place, I did a warmup muscle activation routine at home to prepare my muscles for a max effort.

The first exercise is a leg press. The machine looks just like a traditional leg press but includes a computer screen. The trainer sets up the machine for me and my legs are fairly extended but not straight. Using a protractor, she sets the angle for my leg. The first exertion is a 20% effort. The goal is to increase force slowly, hold for 5 seconds and very slowly release. The second effort, is a maximum hard as I can push increasing the force slowly and once at max, hold for 5 seconds and slowly release.

I get the force in pounds via a graph shown on the screen as well as a multiple of body weight. The setup puts my legs in the most powerful position and I was able to generate a lot of force. I mean a lot more than I could ever do using a leg press machine with weights.

So the workout is a one max isometric exercise with feedback and recording. According to the science, this is not an ATP PC exercise like we see in sprinting or leg presses. It is about neurology, muscle recruitment and joint compression. What happens is the body senses the joint compression due to the force and stimulates bone density. With added bone density, the bones send a signal allowing more strength to be added. Maximum force isometric exercises increase myofibril fibers and increase strength. That is a very oversimplified idea of how it works.

The next station was a seated chest press and the same protocol is used.

The next station was more interesting. It was an max effort isometric crunch. There was a bar to pull on similar to a pull-up and the thighs were under pads. I had to pull up on the pads with my quads and pull down on the bar above while holding the correct posture. This was a little harder to execute compared to the leg and chest press.

The final one was a deadlift. My wife told me about this one and I was a little concerned about a max effort vis a vis my back. The alignment put me and my back in the strongest position with my legs bent at the best angle and then with perfect posture, I executed an isometric deadlift. It was very cool. I could generate a lot of force but it felt great.

They only allow 1 session every 5 days.

I would say the chance of injury is much lower than the gym and there is no way I could generate the force at any gym I am aware of for those 4 exercises. And even if I could do an isometric max exercise, I would have no idea how much force I was generating.

I have a key fob and the next workout, I touch the key fob to the machine and the machine sets up for me and shows me my stats and progress with latest number.

Assuming the science is correct, this is a cyclist dream workout. It does not generate much fatigue and adds bone density and strength. Declare victory.

According to my trainer, they get power lifters, low bone density patients, athletes looking to increase strength and etc. So they have a high physical therapy component and hence, not a gym.
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Old 05-29-20, 03:48 PM
  #14922  
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Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
and check out the beach action.
Mrs. Hermes is ok with this?
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Old 05-29-20, 04:01 PM
  #14923  
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[QUOTE=Hermes;21504640]I did the high intensity strength training workout. It is about what I expected but more interesting and I would say impossible to do without their equipment.[QUOTE]

Very interesting. I've been thinking that I should be doing more upper body and core stuff. Haven't in too long.
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Old 05-29-20, 04:29 PM
  #14924  
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Originally Posted by big john View Post
Mrs. Hermes is ok with this?
Never ask for permission when forgiveness may be possible.
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Old 05-29-20, 04:51 PM
  #14925  
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Lt Dan (junior) is riding a lot now. No races in site. I really want there to be a bike race somewhere.

I saw a video of him riding off the front on the CO state P1 championship last year (he went real early -timing maybe 5sec before the sprint would be expected to start). No power data, but I thought that was interesting.
Then he "won" his only race this year - a TT.

Now back home and not racing, the training wheels have a hub PM, unlike his race wheels, so, bord and looking for dad brag, I did the Strava upgrade today to look for the first time in a few years.

This is the last 6 weeks. The significant difference is that 10s power. He can kick to 1,300W+(hib) for 10 sec or so then finish 1,600W. I think he has 1,800W in him, but I am more interested in moving that 10s and 20s (1,100->1,200).

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