Go Back  Bike Forums > The Racer's Forum > Track Cycling: Velodrome Racing and Training Area
Reload this Page >

Ask your small, random, track-related questions here

Track Cycling: Velodrome Racing and Training Area Looking to enter into the realm of track racing? Want to share your experiences and tactics for riding on a velodrome? The Track Cycling forums is for you! Come in and discuss training/racing, equipment, and current track cycling events.

Ask your small, random, track-related questions here

Old 04-03-16, 02:36 AM
  #3451  
Muddlfuc
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Melbourne, Aust
Posts: 47

Bikes: BMC RM01, Focus Izarco, Inexa track, KHS SS MTB

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
the PC7 does have a few advantages over the Garmins, they record in .5sec samples. that just gives you a better resolution info.
Not that important in most enduro situations, Good for sprinters...
you also dont have to stuff around with turning off GPS... (only cause I'm lazy)
Muddlfuc is offline  
Old 04-03-16, 10:59 AM
  #3452  
carleton
Elitist
Thread Starter
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 15,575
Mentioned: 82 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1206 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by Huskey View Post
Whats everyones thoughts on using a srm head unit to track speed/cad/hr without using a powermeter?
A few people in my club do this, im not sure if its for the "I have an srm" bragging rights or if they actually utilize the information recorded.
Ive got a cheapo cateye that i use for current speed when warming up or training juniours and max speed for when im doing efforts, but i do like the idea of being able to see how fast i got to that speed, how long i held it for, if it was a few second peak before dropping down a few ks
I think a power meter would be awesome, but well out of my price range, the headunit is still pricey and im not sure it would be worth the cost....
I did it for years. I've used SRM PowerControl 7 without power meter cranks and the data was wonderful. It records every 0.5s. Before that I had a Garmin 500. It only recorded every second, and you had to manually turn off GPS all the time.
carleton is offline  
Old 04-09-16, 03:55 PM
  #3453  
dunderhi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: 150 miles from Ttown
Posts: 430

Bikes: Little Wing, XTRACK, Electron Pro, SuperCorsa, Paramount, & Thunderdrome

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by gycho77 View Post
haha that's funny.
I cannot wait to see your next bike
I finally decided. I just ordered a No. 22 Little Wing with bronze anodization. They currently have a 6-8 week build time, so hopefully I'll have it built up before the N.E. masters regionals at the beginning of July.
dunderhi is offline  
Old 04-09-16, 04:57 PM
  #3454  
gycho77
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Delaware, USA
Posts: 584

Bikes: Serotta steel track bike, Specialized MTB

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 87 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by dunderhi View Post
I finally decided. I just ordered a No. 22 Little Wing with bronze anodization. They currently have a 6-8 week build time, so hopefully I'll have it built up before the N.E. masters regionals at the beginning of July.
Is it going to be street geometry or track geometry?
Also I can't wait to hear review of the titanium frame, because I was interested in titanium track frames(Triton-Custom titanium frame builder)
gycho77 is offline  
Old 04-09-16, 06:01 PM
  #3455  
dunderhi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: 150 miles from Ttown
Posts: 430

Bikes: Little Wing, XTRACK, Electron Pro, SuperCorsa, Paramount, & Thunderdrome

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by gycho77 View Post
Is it going to be street geometry or track geometry?
Also I can't wait to hear review of the titanium frame, because I was interested in titanium track frames(Triton-Custom titanium frame builder)
I would say it is old-school track geometry: Short stays, medium-high BB, and 74 degree angles, but with tall head tube and moderate length top tube. Basically the same measurements as my 40 yr old Paramount, which works for me.

Nice video: Little Wing

Last edited by dunderhi; 04-09-16 at 06:43 PM.
dunderhi is offline  
Old 04-09-16, 10:51 PM
  #3456  
dunderhi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: 150 miles from Ttown
Posts: 430

Bikes: Little Wing, XTRACK, Electron Pro, SuperCorsa, Paramount, & Thunderdrome

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
68mm BB drop is not high. That's the same as the Tarmac or Madone road bikes.

I figure medium-high would be 55mm. And normal would be 45mm (Dolan DF3/DF4).
The Little Wing has a 58mm BB drop. I'm not sure how normal is defined today, but I suspect there might be different normals for sprint, omnium, and pursuit frames. My current omnium-style bikes have 51mm(XTRACK), 55mm(Argon18), and 58mm (Paramount) BB drops. In looking at the Dolan geometry, it looks to be totally out of whack for me; the differences in reach and stack are pretty big when compared to my current bikes. I don't see how I could be comfortable on a DF3/4, but I don't find narrow bars comfortable either, so maybe I'm just a dinosaur.
dunderhi is offline  
Old 04-10-16, 10:55 AM
  #3457  
dunderhi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: 150 miles from Ttown
Posts: 430

Bikes: Little Wing, XTRACK, Electron Pro, SuperCorsa, Paramount, & Thunderdrome

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Ah! Forgive me...58mm not 68. But, that's still low.

The reach and stack use the BB as the zero point, so that doesn't matter. You can have great or awful stack and reach with the same BB drop. The only thing that matters for BB drop is the wheels. Basically, with a low BB drop, your entire body and cranks are lower to the ground.

The BB drop is equivalent to the spring ride height in a car. Everything in the car can be the same, and the springs lowered and the car will be lower to the ground...and scrape more. Trust me, I know...I have H&R coil-overs in my Audi

That being said, 58mm is higher that what their geometry states on their website (68mm). 58mm is still a "street" geometry and even on the street, you'd probably clip a pedal when cornering with longer cranks on a fixed gear.

With the shallow banking at TTown you won't have a problem. But, at Rock Hill, you might.

Lower is considered to be more aerodynamic. The Specialized Shiv TT bike has a drop of 72mm (and, yes, a Shiv was recently used on a 250m track during an Hour record attempt). Proper track bikes have higher BBs because of that point when you need to climb in a turn like in a match sprint or pulling off during a paceline or team pursuit. If the banking is 44 degrees and you take the bike vertical as you climb the turn, this is like cornering on the road at 44 degrees and having your inside pedal down. You won't see that cut up track during an Hour attempt


I understand both reach & stack and how BB drop impacts stack as much a head tube length. If the Dolan's BB was dropped 1 cm lower, then without change in the head tube length there would be 1 cm more of stack. As it is, the Dolan has 9 cm less stack than the Little Wing, which is too much of a position change for me.

The No. 22 website lists their track frames are having 58mm BB drop, while their road frame's BB drop ranges from 67 to 78mm. It might be old-school track geometry, but I believe it is still a proper track geometry and that's why I've ordered one.

Also, I've ridden my Argon18 (55mm drop) with 172.5mm cranks at Rock Hill and felt comfortable with my clearance moving up and down track, so the 165mm cranks that I plan for the No.22 will be just fine. In fact my No. 22 setup will only give up 2mm of ground clearance when compared to my current XTRACK setup.
dunderhi is offline  
Old 04-10-16, 05:03 PM
  #3458  
dunderhi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: 150 miles from Ttown
Posts: 430

Bikes: Little Wing, XTRACK, Electron Pro, SuperCorsa, Paramount, & Thunderdrome

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
I wasn't suggesting that you go with the complete Dolan geometry. The BB drop really has nothing to do with stack and reach. The BB drop only concerns your wheels, cranks, pedals, and the track. I just used Dolan as a reference point to show that modern track bikes use a 45mm BB drop.

BB drop has no affect on your comfort! It only adjust how high or low you and your cranks are with relation to the wheel axles.
I disagree!

It's simple geometry, if the BB is 1 cm higher, then the seat must move up 1 cm. If the seat moves up 1 cm then the handlebars must raise 1 cm. If the angles aren't parallel, then the top tube and/or stem lengths must change. This reduces the overall stability of the bike. Subsequently, the frame manufacturers that you list below all have lower stack heights because of their decreased BB drop.

Originally Posted by carleton View Post
BB drop of other track frames:

Serenity: 35mm
Fuji Track Elite: 45mm
LOOK 564P (open-mold): 45mm
Tiemeyer: 45mm (Most, if not all)
Dixie Flyer: 45mm
Hoy Fiorenzuola: 46mm
LOOK L96: 50mm
Felt TK1: 55mm

I suspect that the TK1 is so low because the track frame's design seems to be "hand-me-down" from the road TT frame and keeping with the "lower is more aero" theme (which is true).
Here's few more examples:

Pinarello Pista Alu 51mm
Cipollini Speed Alto 51mm
Cinelli Mash 54mm
Argon18 Electron Pro 55mm
Bianchi Sei Giorni 55mm
Waterford Competition Track 55mm
Planet X Pro Carbon Elite 57mm
BMC TR01 58mm
BMC TR02 58mm
Cinelli Vigorelli 58mm
Bianchi Pista 58mm
Bianchi Classica 58mm
Fuji Track 58mm
Ritte 8055 58mm
All City Thunderdrome 58mm
Cinelli Super Corsa 60mm
Cipollini Speed Basso 63mm


Originally Posted by carleton View Post
I mean, it's your bike do what you want. I just figured since it seems that No. 22 may not have a lot of experience making bikes for track racing, you could offer some input on your custom rig.

When I had my custom Snyder made, I gave him the geo chart of my Tiemeyer and said, "Move the seat tube angle back 2 degrees and make the top tube 3cm longer." and kept the same 45mm BB drop.

The current Little Wing is the second generation of their track frame in their few years of existence, but they have decades of titanium frame building experience (read Serotta). With the exception of the seat tube center to top measurement, I already have a bike with the EXACT SAME GEOMETRY and I have firsthand experience training and racing on it. I wouldn't want them to change it a mm.


Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Yes, you will be fine.
I never had any doubt.
dunderhi is offline  
Old 04-11-16, 11:28 AM
  #3459  
Baby Puke
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Kanazawa
Posts: 1,450

Bikes: Marin Stelvio, Pogliaghi SL, Panasonic NJS, Dolan DF4, Intense Pro24 BMX

Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 234 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Only chiming in here to say that 58mm BB drop may have indeed been standard for old-school track bikes. My Panasonic and many other NJS bikes have a similar BB drop, as they are designed primarily for use on 400m tracks. The steep 250 is a relatively recent phenomenon and is probably the reason for the move to higher BB's. So 58mm may not necessarily be "street", but is definitely "old fashioned".

Last edited by Baby Puke; 04-11-16 at 11:31 AM.
Baby Puke is offline  
Old 04-11-16, 11:37 AM
  #3460  
dunderhi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: 150 miles from Ttown
Posts: 430

Bikes: Little Wing, XTRACK, Electron Pro, SuperCorsa, Paramount, & Thunderdrome

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Dude, you are sorta making my point with that list

Not one of those bikes are popular race bikes. Not one.

Yeah, the Fuji Track is a popular fleet bike for beginner classes, but that's it. The geometry was made street years ago because that's where Fuji made most of their sales of the basic Track model.
With the exception of the Fuji, most of the bikes on your list are a rare sight at T-town. I have no idea what makes a Dixie-Flyer, Tiermeyer, or Hoy so popular, since I not sure if I have never seen one. I do see Pinarellos, Bianchis, Argon18s, All-Citys, Cinellis, BMCs, and even a sharp looking No. 22, but I only see maybe 150 track racers each week so who am I to know what is popular or not?

Anyway, I know which geometries that have earned me podium spots in the last two years and No. 22 is building exactly what I want. There's a lot to be said for riding a crisp handling COMFORTABLE and STABLE bike that also gets you onto the podium.

Luckily, I didn't buy a Cipollini. I probably would have chosen the Basso(63mm drop) over the Alto(51mm drop).
dunderhi is offline  
Old 04-11-16, 11:40 AM
  #3461  
dunderhi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: 150 miles from Ttown
Posts: 430

Bikes: Little Wing, XTRACK, Electron Pro, SuperCorsa, Paramount, & Thunderdrome

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
@carleton,

In post 3456, 55mm was considered to be medium-high drop, but 58mm is now street. Oh the difference the 3mm makes.

Originally Posted by Baby Puke View Post
Only chiming in here to say that 58mm BB drop may have indeed been standard for old-school track bikes. My Panasonic and many other NJS bikes have a similar BB drop, as they are designed primarily for use on 400m tracks. The steep 250 is a relatively recent phenomenon and is probably the reason for the move to higher BB's. So 58mm may not necessarily be "street", but is definitely "old fashioned".
As I said, the No. 22 is the same geometry as my 40yr old Paramount, so yeah, it's old-school, but it works and it has worked for a very long time.

Last edited by dunderhi; 04-11-16 at 02:07 PM.
dunderhi is offline  
Old 04-11-16, 11:47 AM
  #3462  
Baby Puke
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Kanazawa
Posts: 1,450

Bikes: Marin Stelvio, Pogliaghi SL, Panasonic NJS, Dolan DF4, Intense Pro24 BMX

Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 234 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
You get that I was agreeing with you, right?
Baby Puke is offline  
Old 04-11-16, 01:55 PM
  #3463  
dunderhi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: 150 miles from Ttown
Posts: 430

Bikes: Little Wing, XTRACK, Electron Pro, SuperCorsa, Paramount, & Thunderdrome

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
@Baby Puke


I did and I thought I was agreeing with you too. The first part was aimed at Carleton's comments about medium-high vs. street geometry, but I see that wasn't completely clear. Sorry, but it should be cleaner now.

Last edited by dunderhi; 04-11-16 at 03:04 PM.
dunderhi is offline  
Old 04-11-16, 03:20 PM
  #3464  
dunderhi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: 150 miles from Ttown
Posts: 430

Bikes: Little Wing, XTRACK, Electron Pro, SuperCorsa, Paramount, & Thunderdrome

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by carleton View Post

What do you think of this?

I think you put a lot of time and energy in thinking about your geometry and you got exactly what you wanted. I also put a lot of time and energy in picking my bike's geometry and I'm getting exactly what I wanted.
dunderhi is offline  
Old 04-11-16, 09:06 PM
  #3465  
MarkWW
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: LI, NY
Posts: 483

Bikes: A little of each

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
fwiw, I like my TK1 (minus the track end problem), and I haven't had any issues with either of my 55mm bb drop bikes at FCV, or the small handful of 250m track I've raced on.
MarkWW is offline  
Old 04-11-16, 11:15 PM
  #3466  
dunderhi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: 150 miles from Ttown
Posts: 430

Bikes: Little Wing, XTRACK, Electron Pro, SuperCorsa, Paramount, & Thunderdrome

Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 65 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
The TK1 (55mm) is only popular among people being paid to ride them or who get them for free.
Unless you have some type of survey data, I'll take that as your opinion.

Originally Posted by carleton View Post
OK. Please tell me which ones?
In the past two years, I stepped onto the podium with each of my current bikes: the Argon 18, the Pinarello, and the Paramount. It's more about the legs, heart, and lungs than the bike, but the bike should be something that you enjoy riding.

Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Also, you what say you about extending the top tube to increase Stack as opposed to dropping the BB?
Hopefully, you mean head tube. I already addressed this; raise the BB, raise the seat, raise the bars, and decrease the stability. If you didn't get the nuance, raising the bars requires either a longer head tube or more spacers.

Originally Posted by carleton View Post
If you have $6,000 to spend on a track frame, more power to you. That's nuts. I'm sure when they set that price, someone in the meeting was like, "Somebody will buy it...watch."

(I also think the $10,000 LOOK L96 is grossly overpriced. Especially with the awful customer service.)
My three purchased track frames average $2.5k each, so hopefully that's a reasonable price range. The Paramount was free, which is an even better price range.

Originally Posted by carleton View Post
It's cool, man.
Wow, if that was your first post, this flame would have never started, but it's also good to let people know they don't need to chase every trend in the bicycle industry and there are plenty of options that are acceptable. I work with new riders and teach at the Try the Track and whatever bike they have is pretty much good enough. I never tell them their BB is too low or their bars are too wide. I just make sure their bikes are sound and they learn to ride safe. Everyone isn't automatically training for the worlds, so everyone doesn't need to emulate the pros.

Originally Posted by carleton View Post
My point is that, "Old school" geometry is considered old school for a reason. The reasons that BBs have gotten higher are not because of aesthetics, it's because in the 70's and 80's 333M and 400M tracks with 14 degree banks were world class standard tracks. Now 250m tracks with 44 degree banks are standard. And some go over 44 degrees. It's a safety concern...so why not?
Really, I thought there were more 333m & 400m tracks in the the US than 250m tracks. I've raced at Rock Hill and never felt unsafe, but I'll also claim that I know what I am doing on the track.

Congrats, you finally joined the it's "old school" track geometry, just as I posted in my very first post about the geometry.

Originally Posted by carleton View Post
You have two options when you are match sprinting or simply turning up track on a 250:

- Worry about clipping a pedal.
- Worrying about winning your race.

You are very likely to race at 250m track as an active masters racer. In the past few years Masters Nationals has been held at Rock Hill and The Superdrome and it will be at ADT next year...all 250m tracks. Trust me, you do not want to snag a pedal and slide down a turn at the Superdrome. Sliding down 30ft of a surface similar to skateboard grip tape is not fun.
Ahh, I'm not a match sprinter. I don't care about match sprinting. I avoid match sprints. I did a sprint tournament last year and despite the fact that I podiumed, I felt like I lost a race day.

Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Yes... you have decided to ride 165mm cranks next year...but what if you decide to go back to 172.5?
I have 165, 167.5, 170, and 172.5mm cranks. Just like my chainrings and cogs, I pick whichever is appropriate for the track, the races, and my conditioning. I also bring more than one bike to the track on any given race day. It's good to have as many options as possible.

Originally Posted by carleton View Post
My bigger point is that you have nothing to gain by going to a lower bottom bracket and are ignoring the reasons why others have gone to a higher bottom bracket.
The benefits of the lower BB is increased stability and improved aerodynamics. The only downside is IF, and that's a big IF, I don't where my pedals are then I could hit the track if I am not careful. The good news is I always know where my pedals are and I'm always careful. It's as easy as riding a bike.

Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Seems like you have already made your mind and that's cool. But, you started the discussion.
All I did was reply to a forum member who said he couldn't wait to see my next build. I'm not sure why you felt the need to jump in on the conversation to correct that my 58mm drop was not medium-high only to state the 55mm was medium-high instead and later that 58mm was street geometry.



In the end I look forward to getting my No. 22 exactly how I want it and there isn't a track in the US that it would give me any pause to race upon. So with that bold statement, I will end my part in this conversation. Enjoy what you ride and I'll do the same.
dunderhi is offline  
Old 04-19-16, 11:40 AM
  #3467  
TDinBristol
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 54
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Curious if anyone has an opinion on running front wheels with hollow axles/hex-bolt skewers (pictured) vs. the traditional solid axle/nut setup. Is there any performance or safety difference? Can I repurpose a road tubular front without issues?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg
hex skewer.jpg (6.2 KB, 49 views)
TDinBristol is offline  
Old 04-19-16, 01:40 PM
  #3468  
700wheel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 564
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 118 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by TDinBristol View Post
Curious if anyone has an opinion on running front wheels with hollow axles/hex-bolt skewers (pictured) vs. the traditional solid axle/nut setup. Is there any performance or safety difference? Can I repurpose a road tubular front without issues?
I'm not familiar with the hex-bolt skewer you show but if there is any torque applied to the axle I would be skeptical of using it (since you would be combining tensile and shear stresses ion the axle). Others may have more experience/knowledge.

USA Cycling rule 113(a) states for track races: "....... in pursuit and time trial events that are not championships or selection events......... quick releases,.........may be installed on the bicycle....." I see track riders using a QR skewer on their front wheel occasionally.
700wheel is offline  
Old 04-19-16, 01:45 PM
  #3469  
Spoonrobot 
Senior Member
 
Spoonrobot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,180
Mentioned: 55 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 988 Post(s)
Liked 27 Times in 23 Posts
Originally Posted by TDinBristol View Post
Curious if anyone has an opinion on running front wheels with hollow axles/hex-bolt skewers (pictured) vs. the traditional solid axle/nut setup. Is there any performance or safety difference? Can I repurpose a road tubular front without issues?
I used on for my dozen or so race days with a Flo 30 front and didn't have any issues.
Spoonrobot is offline  
Old 04-19-16, 03:10 PM
  #3470  
carleton
Elitist
Thread Starter
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 15,575
Mentioned: 82 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1206 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by TDinBristol View Post
Curious if anyone has an opinion on running front wheels with hollow axles/hex-bolt skewers (pictured) vs. the traditional solid axle/nut setup. Is there any performance or safety difference? Can I repurpose a road tubular front without issues?
Those work very well.

One note: The threads within lightweight aluminum nut will probably strip out on you if you have gorilla hands like me. If you get the nut from a standard non-lightweight steel skewer, the threads will also be steel and will not strip out.



You can find these at any local bike shop. They probably have the ends in a random parts drawer and will give you one for free if you are a regular. Nobody wants them. You just need the female end.
carleton is offline  
Old 04-19-16, 03:14 PM
  #3471  
carleton
Elitist
Thread Starter
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 15,575
Mentioned: 82 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1206 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by 700wheel View Post
I'm not familiar with the hex-bolt skewer you show but if there is any torque applied to the axle I would be skeptical of using it (since you would be combining tensile and shear stresses ion the axle). Others may have more experience/knowledge.

USA Cycling rule 113(a) states for track races: "....... in pursuit and time trial events that are not championships or selection events......... quick releases,.........may be installed on the bicycle....." I see track riders using a QR skewer on their front wheel occasionally.
I used one of these with a deep dish road TT wheel back in 2009. I stripped out the aluminum nut by over torquing it, which led me to the solution above. I would advise using a steel nut for anyone.

I'm a big guy and I was doing sprints on a 36 degree track and didn't have any issues.

Last edited by carleton; 04-19-16 at 03:18 PM.
carleton is offline  
Old 04-19-16, 04:01 PM
  #3472  
Dalai
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,137
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 83 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Fine using a bolt on skewer. As Carlton has mentioned, don't get a lightweight one...
Dalai is offline  
Old 04-20-16, 03:35 PM
  #3473  
rensho3
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Santa Ana
Posts: 278

Bikes: Fuji Elite, 3Rensho track, Trek Madone 6.9, Specialized MTB, GT MTB, Cannondale Cad3 fixie

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 72 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Used that setup on my Zipp front wheel with no problems for more year than I can remember using a steel nut.
rensho3 is offline  
Old 04-21-16, 01:28 AM
  #3474  
bitingduck
Senior Member
 
bitingduck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,165
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 40 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by queerpunk View Post
Thanks! This wasn't what I was thinking of, but it's interesting and I'm looking forward to playing around with it.

I actually found what I was looking for, and the embarrassing thing is that it was a spreadsheet that I made based on a Coggan chart I found associating W/CDA ratios to pursuit times for 2k, 3k, and 4k distances. From there it's easy to put in your power, get your cda, and then pick your target time and produce the power required to hit your target time.
I have a spreadsheet that was the precursor to this site: Bike Calculator

I like the spreadsheet better than the app because it's got a bunch of columns (and you can add more) so that you can easily enter a whole course profile if you want. It takes a little more tweaking to get your CdA out but it's more flexible than the app. Pm me if you want me to email it somewhere.
__________________
Track - the other off-road
http://www.lavelodrome.org
bitingduck is offline  
Old 04-21-16, 01:46 AM
  #3475  
bitingduck
Senior Member
 
bitingduck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,165
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 40 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by 700wheel View Post
If you build a wheelset with these hubs do not use radial spoking - I've seen shear failures at the hub holes a couple of times.
I had one fail very abruptly while I was at the rail getting ready to start a motorpace race, right after doing a bunch of intervals. A few minutes earlier or later would have been very unpleasant. It was one of the sheriff-star hubs, with only 5 more spindly spokes than the ones in the pic, and a less beefy ring for the spoke holes. I think those in the pic were a response to the sheriff stars exploding. If you google them you'll find pictures of broken ones that were laced in cross patterns, too.
__________________
Track - the other off-road
http://www.lavelodrome.org
bitingduck is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.