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Old 05-10-16, 03:43 PM
  #3501  
brawlo
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Originally Posted by ILikeParmesan View Post
Thanks, I'm reading through. That's the only downside of the sport, it's expensive. I used to play rugby and all you really needed was shorts, cleats, and a mouth guard.
I used to play rugby too, and the costs before running out on the field are more now than the racing licenses for myself and my 2 kids put together. True the gear CAN cost a lot more, but there's plenty of people out there winning races on $3-400 bikes. You don't have to spend a huge amount on the sport to be good at it, but upgradeitis is a serious and detrimental-to-your-wallet affliction for cyclists!
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Old 05-13-16, 10:31 PM
  #3502  
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What on earth are those little red goozers on the left fork blade near the hub?

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Old 05-13-16, 10:50 PM
  #3503  
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Originally Posted by TrackMonkey7 View Post
What on earth are those little red goozers on the left fork blade near the hub?

It's part of the electronic lap counting system. I'm not that familiar with it. But, it's mainly used in bunch races to verify lap counts (who's on the lead lap? who is a lap down? etc...)

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Old 05-14-16, 09:32 AM
  #3504  
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That system gives you real time lap times and 200m times- so you can log in between efforts and check your times..

Pretty cool stuff- might still be in the testing phase- not sure it's available to everyone yet
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Old 05-14-16, 11:08 AM
  #3505  
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Originally Posted by Quinn8it View Post
That system gives you real time lap times and 200m times- so you can log in between efforts and check your times..

Pretty cool stuff- might still be in the testing phase- not sure it's available to everyone yet

Sport timing systems - MYLAPS Sports Timing
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Old 05-14-16, 05:59 PM
  #3506  
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Hi All,

I'm investigating timing systems to invest in for training purposes. Perhaps the most prevalent use of the timing system would be short velodrome trials, i.e. 200 meters and standing laps. I know how exorbitant some electronic timing systems can be. I did look into the Free Lap System etc. The advantages here are reasonably priced and simple to use. The disadvantages are the necessity to use a watch on the handlebar and the need to be within a short distance of the transmitter at the start. I was hoping that there is a system that uses a tape that is triggered by the wheel hitting at the start and finish.

Also, I thought I read somewhere that there is a method for timing via video recorder. However, the timer would need to be manually started.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
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Old 05-15-16, 03:02 PM
  #3507  
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Originally Posted by Pole Line Stand View Post
Hi All,

I'm investigating timing systems to invest in for training purposes. Perhaps the most prevalent use of the timing system would be short velodrome trials, i.e. 200 meters and standing laps. I know how exorbitant some electronic timing systems can be. I did look into the Free Lap System etc. The advantages here are reasonably priced and simple to use. The disadvantages are the necessity to use a watch on the handlebar and the need to be within a short distance of the transmitter at the start. I was hoping that there is a system that uses a tape that is triggered by the wheel hitting at the start and finish.

Also, I thought I read somewhere that there is a method for timing via video recorder. However, the timer would need to be manually started.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Tape strip systems take a lot of prep and breakdown. Not sure if a track will allow you to install them. The benefits are small.

If this is truly for training purposes and not hosting a tournament or something, then realize that for shorter events, top speed is directly related to your finishing time. This means, if you are training for a flying 200, if you hit 42mph, that means your flying 200M time will be faster than if you hit 41mph.

For longer efforts, you can put a stopwatch on your aerobars and mark your splits yourself.

The best timing tool is a head unit that records the entire effort where you can download and review later. You don't need power (it's nice to have). You can do some in-depth analysis using speed, cadence, heart rate, and distance data all plotted over time. You can get a system like that for a couple hundred bucks. Adding Power costs a lot more.
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Old 05-15-16, 04:47 PM
  #3508  
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Also be wary of radio signal systems. These are usually made for timing distance runners in training. They work by the runner (wearing a transmitter) entering within x meters of the receiver. I think the margin of error can be significant. Not to mention radio signals (i.e. Bluetooth) being finicky.

Progression/regression in a flying 200M is measured within tenths of a second. If the margin of error is higher than that, then the system is useless.

Last edited by carleton; 05-15-16 at 04:52 PM.
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Old 05-15-16, 06:19 PM
  #3509  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Also be wary of radio signal systems. These are usually made for timing distance runners in training. They work by the runner (wearing a transmitter) entering within x meters of the receiver. I think the margin of error can be significant. Not to mention radio signals (i.e. Bluetooth) being finicky.

Progression/regression in a flying 200M is measured within tenths of a second. If the margin of error is higher than that, then the system is useless.
Yes, I guess that's what I'm really trying to ascertain. I remember (I'll look up) a Free Lap tutorial on YT showcasing the unit with BMX bikes. Their advertising accuracy within hundredths of a second. To me I thought it would make a good backup for hand timers. We want it for training trials legitimacy. If the margin of error is significant then I don't think it would be very useful.
Thanks for your input. Also, I wish I could hit 42.5 mph.
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Old 05-15-16, 09:06 PM
  #3510  
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Originally Posted by Pole Line Stand View Post
Yes, I guess that's what I'm really trying to ascertain. I remember (I'll look up) a Free Lap tutorial on YT showcasing the unit with BMX bikes. Their advertising accuracy within hundredths of a second. To me I thought it would make a good backup for hand timers. We want it for training trials legitimacy. If the margin of error is significant then I don't think it would be very useful.
Thanks for your input. Also, I wish I could hit 42.5 mph.
I'm not saying it's not possible. I guess I'm saying verify and test (if possible) before you buy.

The only electronic timing systems that I have direct experience with (that weren't handheld) were DIY systems made by engineers in their free time. One of which I was very familiar with. It involved a custom programming, an Arduino board, and a Ditch Witch to run electronic wires underground to various points of the track. Not for the faint of heart

BTW, I've made an iOS app that does this. It's more sophisticated than a normal stopwatch. It's designed for track training and racing. Search for "track cycling time trial stopwatch" in the Apple App Store.

I'm trying to be careful and not advertise it but more so offer it as a possible solution to your problem. If you want, I can give you a free promo code to use it.
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Old 05-16-16, 09:40 AM
  #3511  
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Originally Posted by Quinn8it View Post
That system gives you real time lap times and 200m times- so you can log in between efforts and check your times..

Pretty cool stuff- might still be in the testing phase- not sure it's available to everyone yet
i wasn't clear-
meant that the one in place at the Velodrome in Los Angeles may not be available to everyone.. When I tried to get one a few months back that was the case..
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Old 05-16-16, 08:31 PM
  #3512  
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Originally Posted by Pole Line Stand View Post
Hi All,

I'm investigating timing systems to invest in for training purposes. Perhaps the most prevalent use of the timing system would be short velodrome trials, i.e. 200 meters and standing laps. I know how exorbitant some electronic timing systems can be. I did look into the Free Lap System etc. The advantages here are reasonably priced and simple to use. The disadvantages are the necessity to use a watch on the handlebar and the need to be within a short distance of the transmitter at the start. I was hoping that there is a system that uses a tape that is triggered by the wheel hitting at the start and finish.

Also, I thought I read somewhere that there is a method for timing via video recorder. However, the timer would need to be manually started.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
One method to obtain lap times is to set up a video camera/cell phone/Go Pro facing the pursuit line, set it recording, mount your bike and start riding (if a flying lap give a hand signal prior to your first lap). After your ride, dismount, stop the camera, sit down with a stop watch, then rerun the video and time each lap starting from your hand signal.
Not a great method but better than nothing.

It just occurred to me that it might be possible to mount a Go Pro facing the track so you could use it to obtain 200m times in a manner similar to the above (I would try this but do not have a Gp Pro).
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Old 05-17-16, 06:27 PM
  #3513  
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https://punainenparooni.com/2013/04/...bars-compared/
I was reading this post, and found this "With the Scatto my setup looks like this. I do not need to use spacers nor flip the stem upwards to make the bike UCI legal, like I did with Alpina bars (I have the 3T Arx Team stem, 6 degrees, 120mm). I can still do that if the position feels too aggressive. So I thing the Scatto gives me a bit more wiggle room to modify my setup"
What kind of uci rule is he talking about?

And do I have to set back my saddle 5cm for match sprint races?

Last edited by gycho77; 05-17-16 at 06:34 PM.
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Old 05-17-16, 09:36 PM
  #3514  
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Originally Posted by gycho77 View Post
https://punainenparooni.com/2013/04/...bars-compared/
I was reading this post, and found this "With the Scatto my setup looks like this. I do not need to use spacers nor flip the stem upwards to make the bike UCI legal, like I did with Alpina bars (I have the 3T Arx Team stem, 6 degrees, 120mm). I can still do that if the position feels too aggressive. So I thing the Scatto gives me a bit more wiggle room to modify my setup"
What kind of uci rule is he talking about?
The grip area of the handlebars cannot be lower than the top of the tire.

Scattos are shallow drop bars. If he has a stem in the negative (down) position and use deep drop bars like the Dolan/Alpina Sprint bars, then they would be so low that the grip area will be under the tire line. So, he had to flip the stem to the upward position to raise the bars.

Originally Posted by gycho77 View Post
And do I have to set back my saddle 5cm for match sprint races?
I honestly forgot. Maybe someone else knows and will answer?
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Old 05-17-16, 09:49 PM
  #3515  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
The grip area of the handlebars cannot be lower than the top of the tire.

Scattos are shallow drop bars. If he has a stem in the negative (down) position and use deep drop bars like the Dolan/Alpina Sprint bars, then they would be so low that the grip area will be under the tire line. So, he had to flip the stem to the upward position to raise the bars.



I honestly forgot. Maybe someone else knows and will answer?

Thank you

And it's not fair that my handlebar has to be higher than tire
because if you are short like me(5'8"), you cannot lower your handlebar like tall people.
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Old 05-17-16, 11:12 PM
  #3516  
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Originally Posted by gycho77 View Post
https://punainenparooni.com/2013/04/...bars-compared/
I was reading this post, and found this "With the Scatto my setup looks like this. I do not need to use spacers nor flip the stem upwards to make the bike UCI legal, like I did with Alpina bars (I have the 3T Arx Team stem, 6 degrees, 120mm). I can still do that if the position feels too aggressive. So I thing the Scatto gives me a bit more wiggle room to modify my setup"
What kind of uci rule is he talking about?

And do I have to set back my saddle 5cm for match sprint races?
  1. 1.3.013 The peak of the saddle shall be a minimum of 5 cm to the rear of a vertical plane passingthrough the bottom bracket spindle. This restriction shall not be applied to the bicycleridden by a rider in a sprint event on track (flying 200 m, flying lap, sprint, team sprint,keirin, 500 metres and 1 kilometre).



    so in short, no.

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Old 05-18-16, 04:42 AM
  #3517  
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Originally Posted by gycho77 View Post
Thank you

And it's not fair that my handlebar has to be higher than tire
because if you are short like me(5'8"), you cannot lower your handlebar like tall people.
True...but it's a safety precaution. If the grip area is at or below the tire line, then that means your fingers will be, too. If you rub the rear tire of someone beside you with your handlebars, it will injure your fingers.

Of course, if you are riding a legal 650c bike in a race with 700c bikes, then you will probably be in the danger I mentioned above
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Old 05-18-16, 10:09 AM
  #3518  
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1.3.022 In competitions other than those covered by article 1.3.023, only the traditional type of
handlebars (see diagram «structure 1») may be used. The handlebars must be
positioned in an area defined as follows: above, by the horizontal plane of the point of
support of the saddle (B); below, by the horizontal line passing 10 cm below the highest
point of the two wheels (these being of equal diameter)
(C); at the rear by the axis of the
steerer tube (D) and at the front by a vertical line passing through the front wheel spindle
with a 5 cm tolerance (see diagram «Structure (1A)»). The distance referred to in point
(A) is not applicable to the bicycle of a rider who takes part in a sprint event on track
(flying 200 m, flying lap, sprint, team sprint, keirin, 500 metres and 1 kilometre), but must
not exceed 10 cm in relation to the vertical line passing through the front wheel spindle.
Looks like the UCI rules have changed. I thought it used to be no lower than top of tire, except for sprint events.
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Old 05-18-16, 12:15 PM
  #3519  
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Originally Posted by MarkWW View Post
Looks like the UCI rules have changed. I thought it used to be no lower than top of tire, except for sprint events.
Good catch. It looks like the rule has changed.

Gycho, it appears that you can go 10cm below the top of your tire based on the rule listed above.
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Old 05-18-16, 05:59 PM
  #3520  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Gycho, it appears that you can go 10cm below the top of your tire based on the rule listed above.
...But im guessing that probably nowhere near that amount of drop is going to be an optimal setup if your frame fits, even for someone who is 5'8". You have to be able to apply power in that position and it's no fun when your hands go numb during the warmup....
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Old 05-18-16, 06:52 PM
  #3521  
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“The peak of the saddle shall be a minimum of 5 cm to the rear of a vertical planepassing through the bottom bracket spindle. This restriction shall not be applied to thebicycle ridden by a rider in a sprint event on track (flying 200 m, flying lap, sprint,team sprint, keirin, 500 metres and 1 kilometre); however, in no circumstances shallthe peak of the saddle extend in front of a vertical line passing through the bottombracket spindle.The peak of the saddle can be moved forward until the vertical line passing throughthe bottom bracket spindle where that is necessary for morphological reasons. Bymorphological reasons should be understood everything to do with the size and limblength of the rider.Any rider who, for these reasons, considers that he needs to use a bicycle of lesserdimensions than those given shall inform the commissaires' panel to that effect at thetime of the bike check.Only one exemption for morphological reasons may be requested; either the peak ofthe saddle can be moved forward or the handlebar extensions can be movedforward, in accordance with Article 1.3.023”

is the full article on the saddle setback. So track sprinter can go past the 5 cm limit but not have the front of the saddle ahead of the bottom bracket center.

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/R...NG_English.PDF is the full UCI equipment rule guide with explanations.
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Old 05-18-16, 09:14 PM
  #3522  
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Thank you everyone for all your help.
I think I could set up my bike what I wanted and worry about nothing.
It's good to hear that most of uci rules do not bother me at all haha
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Old 05-18-16, 10:13 PM
  #3523  
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Originally Posted by Koogar View Post
...But im guessing that probably nowhere near that amount of drop is going to be an optimal setup if your frame fits, even for someone who is 5'8". You have to be able to apply power in that position and it's no fun when your hands go numb during the warmup....
Yeah, I totally agree.

Gycho, lower isn't always better. The lower you go, the less power you are able to make.

You can test this on trainer (or even a spin bike in a gym). Set the resistance at a moderate level and turn the cranks. As you continue to pedal, slowly bend your elbows and lower your back and you will eventually hit a point where your leg muscles can't produce the power they were just making.

So, while you may be flexible enough to go very low, your muscles lose effectiveness after a certain point.
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Old 05-18-16, 10:32 PM
  #3524  
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Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Yeah, I totally agree.

Gycho, lower isn't always better. The lower you go, the less power you are able to make.

You can test this on trainer (or even a spin bike in a gym). Set the resistance at a moderate level and turn the cranks. As you continue to pedal, slowly bend your elbows and lower your back and you will eventually hit a point where your leg muscles can't produce the power they were just making.

So, while you may be flexible enough to go very low, your muscles lose effectiveness after a certain point.
Thank you for the tip, but I'm not going to lower my handlebar a lot.
Maybe I will lower my handlebar half an inch and try other position.
and this is my apartment gym, if you are interested. When I move to LA, I'm going to get a gym membership so I have more equipments

and here is a picture of myself.

I have been training in gym for about four months now, but I started proper training(upupup) a month ago.
I think I shouldn't be a sprinter because of my body.....
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Old 05-19-16, 02:44 AM
  #3525  
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That's plenty of good equipment to help you train.

Race a few races before you decide if you are a "sprinter" or not. Ask people that watch you train/race what they think. Remember, your beginning races will suck. Everybody does in the beginning.

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