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Brake Shifters on my Surly Disc Trucker?

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Brake Shifters on my Surly Disc Trucker?

Old 10-18-18, 05:24 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by 54OldnWay View Post
... I should note all my bikes are road bikes with Break Shifters. Last week I did 100 mile round trip pulling a trailer in traffic, at times with a narrow shoulder and when I needed to shift I was fumbling around for the shifter or I had to take my eyes off the road. If I was on my road bike it would not have been an issue.. I'm not planning on making any changes to the shifters and will work on getting comfortable with them but wanted to know my options.

Thanks again for all the feed back
After a while you will develop muscle memory where you can just reach down to the shifter and make your shifts quite easily. If you have to take your eyes off of the road to find where the shifters are, it is readily apparent that you never ride with your hands on the drops, if you had you already would have developed the muscle memory that would tell you how far down to reach to the drops, then you could easily just slide your hand back to the shifter.

I regularly ride bikes with four different shifting systems. My errand bike is a flat bar bike with mountain bike shifters. My rando bike has a brifter for the rear, downtube friction shifter for the front. I have three bikes with bar end shifters. And my Rohloff bike has a twist grip on the end of the drop bar on the right side in the same place that a bar end shifter would usually go. Every time I switch bikes, it takes me a few minutes for my brain to remember which bike I am on, and then I start shifting as if I always rode that bike.

Given time you might start to realize a big advantage to bar end shifters. When you put your hand on them, by feel the lever position would tell you if the chain is on the smallest sprockets, the biggest sprockets, or somewhere in the middle. Thus you do not need to look back to the cassette to avoid cross chaining. But on my rando bike with a brifter, I often find myself cross chaining because when I shift the rear derailleur, I do not get any feedback on where my chain is on the cassette.

Another advantage to bar end shifters is simplicity and reliability. A friend of mine was getting his bike ready for his third coast to coast trip across USA. And, shortly before he was to leave for his trip, his rear brifter crapped out on him. And he could not find a replacement for it right away. He asked me what I thought about bar end shifters because I have then on three of my bikes. I let him try one of my bikes for about an hour. He then decided to put bar end shifters on his bike, which he then used for his cross country ride. On that cross country ride, someone else in that group had her brifter crap out on her, she had to finish the last thousand miles of her cross country ride with only three speeds (she had a triple crankset).

But, some people that use brifters on their other bikes make the switch you are considering, you would not be the first.
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Old 10-18-18, 05:45 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by linus View Post
Like I said, Brifter is not a thing. If you don't like STI(Shimano is the pioneer), try road shifter.
Brifter is shorthand for integrated brake and shifter lever. I thought everyone understood what it meant??

Plus, it's in Sheldon's bicycle glossary - so it's gotta be a real thing! ;-)
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_bo-z.html#brifter

Last edited by dh024; 10-18-18 at 05:51 PM. Reason: Corrected URL
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Old 10-19-18, 07:38 AM
  #28  
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Oldn, another recommendation to keep riding it and it will become natural.
I also ride bikes with all kinds of diff shifting systems, shimano road brifters like your road bike, Gevenalle ones, mountain bike trigger shifters that have thumb for upshifts and pointer finger trigger in front for upshifts, old hybrid trigger shifters that use thumb for both down and upshifts, and finally, an old bike with downtube shifters.

takes a few shifts to adapt to each, and the times I have ridden bar end shifters, I found it a familiar reach to downtube shifters that I rode for ages in the past, only faster and less distance to reach, so give it time and regular riding.
Yes, having to take your hands off the main part of the bars is part and parcel with this system, and one of the reasons I decided not to go with them when I set up a new bike a few years ago and went with the Gevenalle system (a kind of inbetween brifters and bar ends sort of marriage).

lets be realistic though, cross the bridge of changing your shifters or selling the bike after living with it for a while. Either way, its either X hundreds of dollars to make a change, or at the worst case scenario, at least a touring bike like yours in excellent shape will be easy to sell with minimal loss.
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Old 11-24-18, 10:10 PM
  #29  
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This is an informative thread. Like the OP, I'm getting to really dislike bar end shifters on my disc trucker too. At first they were novel (ironic, huh?). But now, after about 3k miles of touring, they're just a pian-in-the-butt. I just spent a month riding from Bend, OR to PDX, then down the coast to SFO and really started missing all the years with brifters (which, IIRC, we used to call "dual controls" when they were a new thing). Anyway, it never occurred to me that a brifter wouldn't work with a MTB drivetrain, but it makes perfect sense.
Originally Posted by dh024 View Post
Brifter is shorthand for integrated brake and shifter lever. I thought everyone understood what it meant??
They do. Some people just have issues.
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Old 11-26-18, 10:10 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by Brett A View Post
This is an informative thread. Like the OP, I'm getting to really dislike bar end shifters on my disc trucker too. At first they were novel (ironic, huh?). But now, after about 3k miles of touring, they're just a pian-in-the-butt. I just spent a month riding from Bend, OR to PDX, then down the coast to SFO and really started missing all the years with brifters (which, IIRC, we used to call "dual controls" when they were a new thing). Anyway, it never occurred to me that a brifter wouldn't work with a MTB drivetrain, but it makes perfect sense.
You have 10-speed drivetrain? If you have 9-speed (triple), Shimano Sora dual-control levers + MTB front derailleur should work. BTW the new Sora levers route the gear cable along the handlebar, a nice feature that even former 9-speed Tiagra lacked.
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Old 11-27-18, 11:18 AM
  #31  
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But , because the under the tape routing has tight cable bends in 2 directions
coming out of the shifter..

Touring, replace the gear cable at home before you leave, for the tours each year..




...
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Old 11-27-18, 03:27 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
But , because the under the tape routing has tight cable bends in 2 directions
coming out of the shifter..

Touring, replace the gear cable at home before you leave, for the tours each year..
good point there. Even on my old 9 spd tiagras with external cables, the point right at the end of the cable, inside the hood, my cables have begun fraying after 3 or 4 years of use--but being inside there, you have no idea.
I only cottoned onto it when I had to readjust the barrel adjuster a few times, and then said, "wait, this isnt right, they never need adjusting...." and sure enough, frayed up the ying yang.

So yes, a good idea to change regularly.

Even my Gevenalle shifters have had similar fraying at the same spot, at the exact spot where the end of the cable bends at the shifter part, just after the fat end thing butts up against the shifter.
I do suspect that a slightly overtight cable than needed accelerates this, so when shifting into first gear, the large cog at back, puts more strain than if it was just a bit less tightened, but still working well.
I figure with trial and error adjustments, at times I had it a bit too tight.
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Old 11-28-18, 09:08 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by DropBarFan View Post
You have 10-speed drivetrain? If you have 9-speed (triple), Shimano Sora dual-control levers + MTB front derailleur should work. BTW the new Sora levers route the gear cable along the handlebar, a nice feature that even former 9-speed Tiagra lacked.
Yes, my 2016 disc trucker came stock with a 3x10 system. 2015 was the last year the disc trucker was spec'd with a 3x9.
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Old 11-28-18, 10:17 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Brett A View Post
Yes, my 2016 disc trucker came stock with a 3x10 system. 2015 was the last year the disc trucker was spec'd with a 3x9.
my wifes 2017 Troll was 3x10, might have been first year going 10.
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Old 12-10-18, 11:48 AM
  #35  
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Seven Touring bike

Friend was showing me his Ti bike this weekend made by Seven and I noticed it had break shifters. The drivetrain had SRAM X9 mountain derailleurs
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Old 12-10-18, 12:33 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by 54OldnWay View Post
Friend was showing me his Ti bike this weekend made by Seven and I noticed it had break shifters. The drivetrain had SRAM X9 mountain derailleurs
Yep, Sram X9 10-sp rear derailleur can be shifted with Sram 10-speed road shifters (Apex or Rival for sure, possibly others). Make sure you get the 10sp ones. Rival 22 won't work.

My favorite setup is Shimano 3x9. 5503 shifters and an olde XT or XTR rear derailleur, and a Shimano road triple front derailleur.
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Old 12-10-18, 01:08 PM
  #37  
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being too lazy to do it right now, how much are you looking at for a sram 10 rd and apex or rival shifters?
Dont forget though, that the left brifter will be for only a double, so it wont shift for his triple fd.
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Old 12-10-18, 03:03 PM
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OP read post #9 - you will need short-pull disc brakesets or gear cable adapters for compatibility with brifters.
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Old 12-10-18, 05:28 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by seeker333 View Post
OP read post #9 - you will need short-pull disc brakesets or gear cable adapters for compatibility with brifters.
good thing you are paying attention, I'd forgotten that.
When I got my gevenalle set, I specifically got the long pull mtb versions of their 9 speed shifters.
They are smart however though with the 10 spd shifter units, as inside there are two doohcikies that the brake cables fit into, so you can run mtb or road pull disc brakes, smart design and simple.
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Old 12-12-18, 12:47 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by ksryder View Post
Road shifters won't work with Shimano MTB derailleurs 10sp or above, different cable pull ratio. If you want Shimano 105 10speed (aka 5700) you'd need to get a 105 10sp RD.
I'm pretty sure wolftooth and a few others make pulleys that will let you use road shifters with em. Haven't tried that myself though.

Not too sure on brake compatibility wrt mech disc brakes on rd vs mtb since it hasn't been a concern for me.
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Old 12-12-18, 05:05 PM
  #41  
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Faq

Originally Posted by 54OldnWay View Post
Just purchased a Disc Trucker, put over 100 miles on it and I can not get comfortable with the Bar End shifters. Has anyone put Break Shifters on the Disc Trucker and would I need to change the Derailleurs. I'm considering 105s
Thanks
Bill
Many posts on brifters by now. It seems with Shimano at 9 speed there is a better cross compatibility, between MTB and road cable pulls ,
10 & 11 they diverged... and Especially wanting a MTB triple Crank for the lower gears for hills with a indexed left lever becomes a problem..

Look into Gevenalle Brake /shifters the actual bar end lever can be transferred to the front of the brake lever
retaining the left friction lever that works with most any crankset..


105 as a road group you want to run a road crankset, a 50-34 enough ? road triples only go 4 t smaller, a 30t...
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Old 12-18-18, 09:13 PM
  #42  
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if you're comfortable with brifters convert to them. I built my 520 with bar ends a few years ago, and my first major tour across Canada, I learned that I did not like them. Read too many horror stories about brifter maintenance and breaking down, so I went with the Gevenelles. Couldn't be happier. This years tour was Vancouver to Tuktoyaktuk, NWT and they were great, and I am glad that I made the switch.
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Old 12-18-18, 09:23 PM
  #43  
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and by the way, I should add, I am running an 11-36 XTR rear end, and 30-39-52 Ultegra crankset. Originally I built it with Dura Ace bar ends. I get all 30 gears, no grinding issues.
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Old 12-19-18, 07:50 PM
  #44  
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I tried to love double bar cons just like I tried to love touch screen only phones. It just didn't work.

I never felt comfortable ring shifting in heavy urban traffic and could never manage the double shift. Enter shamerglo. One super secret thing about gen 1 and 2 ergo shifters is that they are all? triple comparable. Ratchet up and down ftw. When I needed a new rear wheel on my campy equipped touring rig I cheeped out and bought shimino which meant going friction for the rear shifting unless I wanted to spent $$ on a full drive train change out. Since I had been riding with bar cons on my commuter it was not a big change to toss a bar con on the right side.

A year later I switched the commuter to the same configuration. Friction cassette shifting opens up some amazing mix and match possiblities. Note: I found 9sp about the max for friction.
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Old 12-26-18, 07:33 AM
  #45  
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It is crazy that we have to work so hard to find the gear combinations we want in a touring bike. I too was looking at building a drop bar road bike with brifters when I first started considering my build. Eventually I just gave up. It was a challenge to find a 10 speed triple flat bar set up that would work. I wanted a mountain triple crankset. They are still readily available. The challenge is to find a triple front derailleur with the right cage profile for a mountain crankset and a shifter for that derailleur. It is only going to get more difficult as time goes on to build a good quality triple (with MTB gearing) touring bike.
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Old 12-27-18, 05:04 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by 54OldnWay View Post
Just purchased a Disc Trucker, put over 100 miles on it and I can not get comfortable with the Bar End shifters. Has anyone put Break Shifters on the Disc Trucker and would I need to change the Derailleurs. I'm considering 105s
Thanks
Bill
Bill,
What year did you buy? Would you mind sharing what components came on the bike? Surly's website is not up to date. I'm thinking about buying myself but I'd like to know what components I'm getting first. For instance, the website claims FD is a Sora but pics I've seen look like it's actually a Tiagra. Is your crank an Andel or Shimano?
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Old 12-27-18, 06:25 PM
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Originally Posted by megaclyde View Post
Bill, What year did you buy? Would you mind sharing what components came on the bike? Surly's website is not up to date. I'm thinking about buying myself but I'd like to know what components I'm getting first. For instance, the website claims FD is a Sora but pics I've seen look like it's actually a Tiagra. Is your crank an Andel or Shimano?
Surly's DT page is most likely current, since bikes are sold like cars, meaning new models come out in the fall of preceding year. Components do change over time, so if you want to know exactly what components are fitted to 2019 DTs, then you really should contact Surly directly. Surly has very good customer service and they've always been prompt, accurate and very helpful in the half-dozen times I contacted them over the years. Call or email them:

6400 W. 105th St.
Bloomington, MN 55438

Phone: 877.743.3191
Web: surlybikes.com
E-mail: derby@surlybikes.com
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Old 12-27-18, 06:26 PM
  #48  
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Mr MC,
Isnt this surly page up to date re the disc trucker, or have they changed things?

https://surlybikes.com/bikes/disc_trucker/bike_specs

re tiagra vs sora fd, I am fairly certain you wouldnt have any diff between them, especially with a friction only setup that is super easy to use and make small adjustments.
I honestly dont know what the differences are between the two of them, but have ridden a 9 spd era tiagra fd for ages, and another bike in the family has a 9 spd sora fd, and I'd say both work as good as the other.
I guess if the price is similar, perhaps the tiagra has slightly better build quality--but again, its a fd that performs a very simple job, and friction on top of that, so all that matters is the shape of it so it works with triple chainrings and has the cage length to work with a given capacity of large to small chainring differences.

although of course, if interested in your other bike, you have to make sure the model is for a braze on mount thingee or a clamp that goes around the bike frame seat tube.
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Old 12-27-18, 08:41 PM
  #49  
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I'm not so much concerned about the effectiveness of the FD, just pointing out that actual components seem different than what is listed. I am however very interested in what crankset the bike actually ships with. Look at the specs listed for the LHT. Crankset Shimano Sora Triple 50x39x30T 9 speed. Then look at the picture of the bike. That's no Sora crankset. If they really changed to 50,39,30 front rings for 2019 I really think that's a significant change most buyers wouldn't be happy with.
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Old 12-27-18, 10:00 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by megaclyde View Post
I'm not so much concerned about the effectiveness of the FD, just pointing out that actual components seem different than what is listed. I am however very interested in what crankset the bike actually ships with. Look at the specs listed for the LHT. Crankset Shimano Sora Triple 50x39x30T 9 speed. Then look at the picture of the bike. That's no Sora crankset. If they really changed to 50,39,30 front rings for 2019 I really think that's a significant change most buyers wouldn't be happy with.
the links seeker and I put up were for the disc trucker, which shows the parts re 48 36 26 etc
I do see on the lht non disc page that it says a sora 50 39 30 , which is odd as it doesn't appear to be one in the photo, and as you say, would be an odd choice.

you best contact them directly after the holidays to clear it up
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