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NorCal Racing thread

Old 03-19-19, 12:22 AM
  #2051  
UmneyDurak
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Originally Posted by hack View Post

The drama should be worked out in private, but itíll get wrung thorough Facebook court. I was curious if he was going to keep his events USAC, but not sure how thatíd work without NCNCA. Seems thatís been answered directly though.

With the RedKite races pulled from the ncnca calendar, thereís still usac racing on all but 3 weekends until mid-October. So, thereís no shortage of racing to be had.

Curious if he tweaks his format for racing at all. Does he keep the same USAC-ish categories? Will he follow the OBRA 40+, 50+, etc model for masters racing?

That part is not clear to me. Do race promoters have to be affiliated with NCNCA to do USAC events?
Maybe it's for the best, was thinking of getting more in to outdoor climbing anyway. lol
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Old 03-19-19, 06:46 AM
  #2052  
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Any links or context for us non-norcal people who might be interested?
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Old 03-19-19, 09:21 AM
  #2053  
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Originally Posted by topflightpro View Post
Any links or context for us non-norcal people who might be interested?
Its in the NCNCA Facebook Group. Essentially a promoter is leaving NCNCA / USAC, not sure of the other details.
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Old 03-19-19, 12:09 PM
  #2054  
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Originally Posted by topflightpro View Post
Any links or context for us non-norcal people who might be interested?
Local race promoter is joining NABRA and leaving USAC/our local association ("NCNCA"), but still holding races. He puts on a lot of office park crits in addition to some other racing.

Even before this he's been a polarizing figure locally for many reasons - some people thing he's somehow ruining racing by putting on a ton of races of varying quality, people think he charges too much as is getting rich (the first part is true, I think, but not the second part).

The new drama is an allegation that he stole money from NCNCA ($4 per racer per race) for some time period - depending on who you ask he's a thief or just a hard-working promoter.

On top of all that he's been blocked from the local FB group run by our LA, which is super lame.

Overall I think joining NABRA is a dumb move, but it sounds like he's had enough with the LA and vice-versa, and is ready to take on this experiment. I talked to him about this on Sunday at the race and he likes the "grass roots" thing NABRA has going on (e.g. you're not paying for a jr to race in Europe), and better infrastructure like FinishLynx cameras. I think for him it's overall cheaper to put on races under the NABRA umbrella.

Fwiw NABRA does have an upgrade "reciprocity agreement", so people will still get upgrade points (or should), but not sure about 2->1 upgrades. Oregon's OBRA is the same deal - not USAC but they have racing and get upgrades and can race nationally.

So here we'll have a hybrid USAC/NABRA thing going on for at least a little while - probably until the NABRA experiment ends and it's all back to normal.
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Old 03-19-19, 02:16 PM
  #2055  
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Is there a reason you believe NABRA will lose?
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Old 03-19-19, 02:30 PM
  #2056  
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Originally Posted by aaronmcd View Post
Is there a reason you believe NABRA will lose?
Mostly because it's already lost. It's been around for a long time already and hasn't gained traction.. USAC isn't perfect but NABRA has 5k members, USAC has roughly 60k (active) members.

Sure NABRA can have lower fees and feel more grassroots when it's tiny - but if their goal is to grow to USAC's level of registered members, they'll end up with similar overhead (costs), similar bureaucracy, similar issues as USAC.

As for Red Kite specifically the registration numbers are already relatively low, and I only see this bringing them down - not necessarily for valid reasons, but many if not most people will think upgrade points "don't count" so they'll stop going. Especially since NCNCA is trying to doom the move from the beginning by telling people the upgrade points aren't there, even if they are apparently.
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Old 03-19-19, 02:36 PM
  #2057  
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Originally Posted by mattm View Post
Mostly because it's already lost. It's been around for a long time already and hasn't gained traction.. USAC isn't perfect but NABRA has 5k members, USAC has roughly 60k (active) members.

Sure NABRA can have lower fees and feel more grassroots when it's tiny - but if their goal is to grow to USAC's level of registered members, they'll end up with similar overhead (costs), similar bureaucracy, similar issues as USAC.

As for Red Kite specifically the registration numbers are already relatively low, and I only see this bringing them down - not necessarily for valid reasons, but many if not most people will think upgrade points "don't count" so they'll stop going. Especially since NCNCA is trying to doom the move from the beginning by telling people the upgrade points aren't there, even if they are apparently.

NABRA should advertise as "RACE DIRTY" so I can get my biceps going.
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Old 03-19-19, 04:55 PM
  #2058  
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@mattm Thanks for the details.
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Old 03-19-19, 05:24 PM
  #2059  
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Originally Posted by Ygduf View Post
NABRA should advertise as "RACE DIRTY" so I can get my biceps going.
This brings up a good point though - where is the NABRA rule book, and are the rules different than USAC?
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Old 03-19-19, 07:59 PM
  #2060  
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Originally Posted by Ygduf View Post
NABRA should advertise as "RACE DIRTY" so I can get my biceps going.
Are you doing a lot of bicep curls these days? Per @mattm, I know "oversize" biceps are indicative, if not conclusive, of doping.
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Old 03-19-19, 11:06 PM
  #2061  
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Originally Posted by mattm View Post
Local race promoter is joining NABRA and leaving USAC/our local association ("NCNCA"), but still holding races. He puts on a lot of office park crits in addition to some other racing.

Even before this he's been a polarizing figure locally for many reasons - some people thing he's somehow ruining racing by putting on a ton of races of varying quality, people think he charges too much as is getting rich (the first part is true, I think, but not the second part).

The new drama is an allegation that he stole money from NCNCA ($4 per racer per race) for some time period - depending on who you ask he's a thief or just a hard-working promoter.

On top of all that he's been blocked from the local FB group run by our LA, which is super lame.

Overall I think joining NABRA is a dumb move, but it sounds like he's had enough with the LA and vice-versa, and is ready to take on this experiment. I talked to him about this on Sunday at the race and he likes the "grass roots" thing NABRA has going on (e.g. you're not paying for a jr to race in Europe), and better infrastructure like FinishLynx cameras. I think for him it's overall cheaper to put on races under the NABRA umbrella.

Fwiw NABRA does have an upgrade "reciprocity agreement", so people will still get upgrade points (or should), but not sure about 2->1 upgrades. Oregon's OBRA is the same deal - not USAC but they have racing and get upgrades and can race nationally.

So here we'll have a hybrid USAC/NABRA thing going on for at least a little while - probably until the NABRA experiment ends and it's all back to normal.
Does it say somewhere that they have the "reciprocity agreement"? I wasn't able to find it on their website.

Upgrade is one thing, but the thing about him stealing NCNCA fees is a big thing.
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Old 03-20-19, 12:13 AM
  #2062  
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Originally Posted by UmneyDurak View Post
Does it say somewhere that they have the "reciprocity agreement"? I wasn't able to find it on their website.

Upgrade is one thing, but the thing about him stealing NCNCA fees is a big thing.
The NABRA website seems to have minimal actual info - race calendar, rule book, details like working with USAC... blog not updated since 2015? The "reciprocity" thing was from Steve, I dunno if it's actually true.

The fees theft thing.. I haven't seen it proven one way or another. People have said that happened, but unofficially. Or is that official?
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