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I walked out of Blade Runner 2049 after 20 Minutes

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I walked out of Blade Runner 2049 after 20 Minutes

Old 10-24-17, 02:38 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by canklecat View Post
The main difference I remember from the original version of Blade Runner and my copy of whatever is supposedly the director's cut is the addition of the unicorn symbolism -- which supposedly "proves" Deckard is a replicant -- and a different ending, along with the removal of the voiceover.

I like both versions although I never objected to the voiceover. I'm a longtime fan of film noir so the voiceover shtick is familiar and acceptable.

But I find Ridley Scott's insistence that Deckard is a replicant to be annoying. Ambiguity is better. And PKD made it clear that Deckard was never intended to be a replicant.

Also, Scott did a disservice to PKD's theme by reducing Rachael to a passive mannequin and implied sex doll. In the novel Rachael wasn't much different from the movie depictions of Pris and Zhora. Rachael had psychopathic traits. Deckard was shallow, not very bright or attractive, and was obsessed with money and status, which included owning replicant animals, with aspirations of owning a real animal. Rachael killed Deckard's pet. Any resolution or sense of emotional growth or conscience was implied, never overtly stated.

But that's no different from most movie adaptations of PKD stories. Only Richard Linklater's version of A Scanner Darkly got it right. Amazon's version of Man in the High Tower got it dismally wrong. I don't even care to watch the second season.
Like with many movie adaptations, I don't mind that Scott took great liberties with the original story. The essence of PKD stories is there -- doubting one's own perception of reality. Scanner Darkly was really good in a sense of being true to the original story, but I thought it lacked the engagement of Blade Runner.

A lot of PKD stories are merely so-so. The writing is adequate, but never stellar. It's the ideas behind them that really stand out, and in that sense, I thought Blade Runner got it right.

But the thing that's really baking my noodle is the Schwarzenegger connection to PKD adaptations -- Running Man, Terminator, Total Recall, all PDK adaptations, all with the Governator...

Apparently, Netflix (I think?) will be doing PKD adaptation shorts in a series due out in the near future. Hoping those live up to the hype a lot better than Man in the High Castle...
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Old 10-24-17, 04:06 PM
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Yup, like Ludlum, PKD was better at concept than execution. But PKD is readable, while at times Ludlum was just awful.

As much as I've always liked Blade Runner it could have been even better with the complications posed by the book: if Rachael had been closer to the book's characterization, more like the movie depiction of Pris and Zhora; the pop psychology and religion; the obsession with materialism as manifested through owning animals.

Scott was capable of weaving those complexities into a story. He did so pretty well with Alien, peeling back the Utopian facade of sci-fi to reveal the cynical corporate corruption.

Interesting observation about Schwarzenegger. Never a great actor, but his knack for absurdity and occasional self-deprecation seemed to fit those PKD concepts. Total Recall was a pretty awful movie, but in a trashy fun enjoyable way. I don't mind watching it again whenever it comes on.
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Old 10-29-17, 05:40 PM
  #28  
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I had enough of the synthetic human/AI genre. It's not plausible or interesting anymore with the world running out of oil and the industrial age winding down.
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Old 10-29-17, 06:02 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Zedoo View Post
with the world running out of oil and the industrial age winding down.

You are going to be in for a surprise.
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Old 11-07-17, 05:35 PM
  #30  
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The original Blade Runner was a very sparse film. That was part of what made it great.
I can't imagine people with three minute attention spans today watching a movie like that. Especially with a story to support the special effects.
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Old 11-07-17, 05:40 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
Note that there are several versions of the original Blade Runner movie. The most significant difference between the original and director's cut is the removal of the Deckard's voiceover and a different ending. Though various film buffs argue that the voiceover removal was a plus, I disagree. In fact, for moviegoers who had not previously seen the original movie with the voiceover or had the same information revealed in some other way, the director's cut may not make any sense at all as to who is doing what to whom, and why are they doing it.

I like both endings, but prefer the happy ending of the original.
I have not seen the directors cut. The voice over is another plus in the movie.

You couldn't pay me to watch a modern film!
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Old 11-09-17, 01:47 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by StarBiker View Post
I have not seen the directors cut. The voice over is another plus in the movie.
Sometimes the Director's Cut version of a movie is no improvement. The director's cut of Apocalypse Now is a good example, with 49 minutes or so of inferior or silly scenes added that were best left on the cutting room floor.

Not every afterthought notion by a director improves a movie after release. The voice over on the original Blade Runner was essential for understanding the plot regardless that some film buffs poo-poo the concept of having the movie goer understand the motivation for the characters' actions on the first viewing of the movie.
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Old 11-09-17, 04:59 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
Sometimes the Director's Cut version of a movie is no improvement. The director's cut of Apocalypse Now is a good example, with 49 minutes or so of inferior or silly scenes added that were best left on the cutting room floor.

Not every afterthought notion by a director improves a movie after release. The voice over on the original Blade Runner was essential for understanding the plot regardless that some film buffs poo-poo the concept of having the movie goer understand the motivation for the characters' actions on the first viewing of the movie.
I have heard this same nonsense about voice overs and introductions that set up the story in other films. I have heard complaints about Citizen Kane, and the lead in point of view point looking back.
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Old 11-10-17, 12:29 AM
  #34  
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Ditto, Apocalypse Now. I enjoy the minutiae of the various later versions -- there's more of a sense of ennui and even hopelessness, between the laconic scene in the French rubber plantation family home, and the extended bits with the playmates/dancers. But ultimately it thwarts the momentum and gnawing tension of the original theatrical cut.

And the voiceover in the original release of Blade Runner never bothered me. It seemed to fit. But I'm a fan of good film noir and voiceover works in that context when done well. While Harrison Ford apparently claimed to have tried to sabotage the voiceover by making it deadpan and boring, he ended up doing it pretty well.
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Old 11-10-17, 01:58 AM
  #35  
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There hasn't been a single good movie released this year. Maybe Star Wars will break the losing streak?
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Old 11-10-17, 04:13 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by city_cowboy View Post
There hasn't been a single good movie released this year. Maybe Star Wars will break the losing streak?
Dunkirk was OK.
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Old 11-10-17, 04:22 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by canklecat View Post
Ditto, Apocalypse Now. I enjoy the minutiae of the various later versions -- there's more of a sense of ennui and even hopelessness, between the laconic scene in the French rubber plantation family home, and the extended bits with the playmates/dancers. But ultimately it thwarts the momentum and gnawing tension of the original theatrical cut.
Did you see Apocalypse Now at the movie theater when it was released? I swear when I saw it in 1979, Captain Willard called in the air strike and the final credits appeared over the Cambodian Village being blown apart. Never saw that ending on any VCR or DVD version of the movie.
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Old 11-11-17, 12:23 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
Did you see Apocalypse Now at the movie theater when it was released? I swear when I saw it in 1979, Captain Willard called in the air strike and the final credits appeared over the Cambodian Village being blown apart. Never saw that ending on any VCR or DVD version of the movie.
Yup, saw it in the theater when it was new. But I've watched the movie so many times, in various versions, I can't be certain which ending I first saw.

It's possible more than one ending was screened in the early theatrical release, either deliberately to test the markets, or inadvertently due to a post-production and distribution mixup.

Might be an interesting question to ask the Coppola clan. They tend to be meticulous about documenting their own history in movie making, so they might know for certain.

I do remember seeing that ending, but can't remember specifically when or where. Reportedly it was the ending Coppola intended, with Willard following Kurtz' instructions to kill them all. Also, if I'm recalling correctly, they were obligated to strike the entire set after filming was finished, so they decided to incorporate the destruction of the set pieces into the movie ending.

I'm pretty sure I have my original DVD -- supposedly the original theatrical release -- Redux, and another version touted as the director's cut, all on my MyCloud media server. I'll need to check those endings again. I might be disremembering about Redux -- I might have watched it a couple of times via Amazon Prime, so I'm not sure I owned the DVD. It's been two or three years since I last watched them. I remember discussing the variations and comparisons with Conrad's Heart of Darkness with some writer friends on Facebook back then.


On a similar topic, I'm certain I saw the first episodes of The X-Files aired a few weeks earlier in the D/FW market than Wikipedia, IMDB and other sources report. I was a huge fan and even scheduled weekend trips around the show. I recall being surprised one Friday night when we went to visit my wife's family in Oklahoma. My ex-MIL worked in a nursing home and while waiting for her shift to end I watched The X-Files in the lobby. It was an episode I'd already seen in the D/FW market, yet this was the regular season, not the end of the season when some shows go into reruns.

And I used to drive all over the U.S. on business trips in the 1980s and remember hearing multiple versions of then-current pop music songs in different cities/markets. In particular I remember some alternate mixes of songs by Heart, Cheap Trick and a few others. I asked my brother about it -- at the time he was a DJ and station manager for a typical pop/rock music station He said it was common for record studios to mix different versions for different cities/markets and even for different types of stations within those markets. The differences were often pretty subtle -- just extended intros/outros, longer/shorter solo/instrumental breaks, etc. But I also remember totally different takes and vocals -- same lyrics, same structure, but definite differences in inflection, timing, etc., all the stuff you'd expect when an untrained musician in a more free form genre does multiple takes.
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Old 11-14-17, 08:52 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
Did you see Apocalypse Now at the movie theater when it was released? I swear when I saw it in 1979, Captain Willard called in the air strike and the final credits appeared over the Cambodian Village being blown apart. Never saw that ending on any VCR or DVD version of the movie.
That's what I remember from the movie. Not sure why they cut it out. Also agree that the director's cut is terrible.

Did you ever see Hearts of Darkness: A Filmmaker's Apocalypse? It is the documentary on the production of Apocalypse Now. Pretty interesting.
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Old 11-14-17, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by bikecrate View Post
Did you ever see Hearts of Darkness: A Filmmaker's Apocalypse? It is the documentary on the production of Apocalypse Now. Pretty interesting.
Yes, I have a VCR of that documentary. I might just dig that out again from the closet.
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Old 11-27-17, 03:35 AM
  #41  
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its been interesting reading the posts in this thread

i went and saw the film and thought it was the best cinema experience i've ever had, ever. and up till now the previous was the original film

i can see how the film is not for everyone, and the people next to us i over-heard after the film saying they thought it was boring. [what!?] they had obviously gone to see the wrong film :-) as the trailer did try and market the film as scifi-action, which its not.

i loved every minute of it and look forward to seeing more from Denis Villeneuve and watching this again at home

every few days i sit back close my eyes and play this from the soundtrack:

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Old 12-14-17, 08:57 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by U.V. View Post
its been interesting reading the posts in this thread

i went and saw the film and thought it was the best cinema experience i've ever had, ever. and up till now the previous was the original film

i can see how the film is not for everyone, and the people next to us i over-heard after the film saying they thought it was boring. [what!?] they had obviously gone to see the wrong film :-) as the trailer did try and market the film as scifi-action, which its not.

i loved every minute of it and look forward to seeing more from Denis Villeneuve and watching this again at home

every few days i sit back close my eyes and play this from the soundtrack:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NujlXgBmUoU
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Old 12-14-17, 12:54 PM
  #43  
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I thought the film was excellent, adding to the original without taking anything away. It displayed a great deal of restraint in the characterizations, action, scenery and violence. And it was certainly the best Harrison Ford role in at least a decade.

Like the original, I thought the themes were primarily speculative - things about memory and free will that don't have anything to do with our lives. You really have to be wearing a lot of tin foil to detect much beyond that.


My vote for best original BR was the first director's cut. The Final Cut might be "cleaner", but I didn't care for the dialogue changes.
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Old 12-14-17, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by StarBiker View Post
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Old 12-20-17, 10:29 PM
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It seems that Blade Runner got yanked from 855 theatres after only three weeks. Hollywood in general is in a protracted terminal decline. it isn't just the unions and the system dragging it down. It's a cesspool of recycled plots and CGI veneering over trite storytelling. Look at the mountain of comic book crap that has come out over the last 15 years. Sequel after milking-the-hell-out-of-a-franchise sequel. The latest Star Wars looks like it was developed primarily as a merchandising platform and a "film" a distant second.
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Old 12-21-17, 02:36 AM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by prairiepedaler View Post
It seems that Blade Runner got yanked from 855 theatres after only three weeks. Hollywood in general is in a protracted terminal decline. it isn't just the unions and the system dragging it down. It's a cesspool of recycled plots and CGI veneering over trite storytelling. Look at the mountain of comic book crap that has come out over the last 15 years. Sequel after milking-the-hell-out-of-a-franchise sequel. The latest Star Wars looks like it was developed primarily as a merchandising platform and a "film" a distant second.
i couldn't agree more


you should watch 'The Killing of a Sacred Deer'
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Old 12-21-17, 02:49 AM
  #47  
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Blade Runner 2049 was pulled because it wasn't doing well in ticket sales. What other movie did poorly in theaters?

Blade Runner.
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Old 12-21-17, 07:37 AM
  #48  
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Movies are dedicated to a Global Market.

How many people on here post interesting films?

How many people aren't in a hurry anymore?

You have to fill the massive void that has been created by technology. What do you think that space will be filled with?

And lastly those crappy comic book movies keep making my small silver age comic book collection more valuable.
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Old 12-28-17, 12:43 PM
  #49  
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Interesting. I'm a big fan of the original BR, and went to the new one figuring it would be a disappointment, but hoping it would be at least decent. To my surprise, it was outstanding. Frankly, I was blown away by how good it was. In my opinion, a 100% worthy successor to the original. Maybe the best movie I've seen this year. I'd rate it above Dunkirk, and I thought that movie was very good.

I consider myself to be fairly cynical, maybe a bit too much of a glass half empty person if I had to admit it. I should be one of the people dissatisfied with 2049, really, given how much I like the original. But I have to say, the new BR was great, in my opinion.

My only beef with it, if I had to look for one, would be Robin Wright's character. Not sure she was the right person for that role. But a minor carp, and easily overlooked given how good the rest of the film was, and the rest of the casting decisions. Heck, I don't even particularly like Ryan Gosling in general, and I thought he was very good.
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Old 12-28-17, 06:19 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by StarBiker View Post
Movies are dedicated to a Global Market.

I'd say Hollywood tries to maximize their bottom line from all markets. The USA is the number one consumer society in the world and it's reasonable for studios to take a path of least resistance to profit taking. Some films do not translate or relate well to global audiences. In terms of overall cultural exports (movies, music, celebrity, sports etc), America is undeniably the most influential at spreading it's toxic contamination globally. Untouchable really.
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