livedarklions

Because I needed to prove that someone is wrong on the internet!

63rickert

Collar bones are the crumple zone everyone says does not exist. They heal quick enough and complications are rare. If you fall and break a collar bone you fell just right. Only better course is to not fall. Freak accidents like that stick are going to cause falls.

livedarklions

I only know that's where I was hit because there's no mark on me on the left side, and everything on the bike is intact except for the left side of the handlebars, which is completely bent out of shape. I fell hard enough that my seat somehow turned around and like I said, I don't remember being hit or landing, so I definitely count myself lucky. Worst things right now are trying to sleep and tying my shoes. Bruised ribs hurt when you lay down or bend over.

indyfabz

As fractured collar bones go, it was a good one, especially considering I take blood thinners. I split the end of it. No surgery required. Just a sling for a while and R&R. Happened on a June 6th. I was back on the bike for an short, flat ride one month later. A month after that I did D2R2, which was probably not wise. (Fell on the opposite side climbing a steep, wet, cobblestone carriage road.) First week in September I started Cycle Oregon, which was my long range goal after the accident.

I had a friend who was not so luck. She needed a rod installed after her collar bone fracture. I think she didn't ride for a year.

02Giant 

My crash strategy...don't crash.

BicycleBicycle

Honestly, anyone that gives you some detailed multi-faceted strategy for crashing is full of crap.
You can't predict like 99% of them, and if you can do anything about it, you're usually flying in the air for some reason (big gap, obvious sudden obstruction in your path, or you are going fast on the road brakeless and your chain gives out) and you have time to make a decision.
Anything close to the floor and you're kind of just screwed because you're going to be on the ground faster than you can think.
The only thing that I've been able to to reliably, is "feel" when a fall is going to happen, and "react" in a pre-determined way to said fall.

Unfortunately, the only way to get better at falling is by falling. I'm sure that there are very safe ways of practicing this on very soft stuff, but I've personally never done it.
You just learn to react better, and you learn when to let go of your bike, or just learn to "feel" when/if you're going over.
You can't predict how you're going to land, what you are going to do before you land, etc. But you just learn how to do different things every time.
For example,
I used to get 3 good, solid, very hard palm strikes out of every month (Palms are great fall breakers, but you have to be careful about breaking your wrist, and extended arms at speed can be extremely dangerous (slides are better in these situations)). If 3-4 of them happened within a couple of weeks, I was doubled over from the pain of any other fall on my palms, and I had to wait weeks for them to heal. So I eventually learned how to fall onto my elbows/forearms instead while my palms were healing so that I could still protect my head and not just land on the side of my arm.
That came with a lot of practice, and it wasn't always reliable, as sometimes it just happened to quick and the first thing that I did was throw a palm out.
Imagine being in excrutiating "can't get up" pain from just a simple low speed, no air slip and fall that you broke with your palm lol.

You just get better at reacting, and you instinctively learn when/how to jump off of your bike, position yourself better, etc.
You'll just "feel" when things are not right (bars are way too far forward) and you'll let go of them so the bike doesn't take you with it.
You'll "feel" when you're going down on your side and you'll instinctively let go of that foot, etc.
You'll "know" when you're incredibly off balance (about to fall) and you'll be able to react accordingly.
I'm getting older, and being a crash dummy is not something that sounds very fun anymore so I just try to prevent them from happening in the first place by being very slow, methodical, and careful about the stuff that I do on bikes.
I was always careful, but I was just more willing to try stuff because I had so much muscular padding and I healed very quickly, and I was much more "springy" if that makes any sense.
Like 90% of the time when your adrenaline spikes and you have fractions of a second to react it comes down to whatever you have in your muscle memory. Your muscle memory just gets better after time.
You'd be surprised at just how much you instinctively tuck your head when you go over.
Sometimes, your adrenaline won't spike at all, and you just have this dull, emotionless detached feeling. That can be both an advantage and a disadvantage.
Advantage because you are calm, disadvantage because you are calm and your body is not giving you anti pain and reaction juice, so you're not going to react very well.

I'd say that the best thing honestly is to just try and "remember" the exact feeling that you had when the event occured, then, replay the event several times in your head, while taking note of the feeling that you had, and
the way that your brain worked when it was happening. Then, as you're replaying that moment, think about the times when you made a move or did something that could have hurt less if you had done something else.
Was there a point where you coudl/should have let go of the bike? What is your instinct for breaking a fall (we're all pretty similar here, as we throw arms/legs out instinctively)?
At what point exactly did you know for sure that you were going to lose balance? How did you react at that point, and how could that have been better?
The more you replay that, the better you can think it through for yourself (as it's different for every person), and the more you can improve without actually having to crash.

The one thing you want to avoid is what is called a "dead sailor", meaning you just completely freeze and stiffen up when you're about to crash.
That, is also something that you don't learn how to do without practice. A dead sailor almost guarantees that your crash is going to be concentrated on ONE point of your body, and that one point can be a very critical area.
Since you're basically frozen in place from just not reacting to these kinds of situations a lot, you're for sure going to create an axis of rotation and slam something really hard into the ground. That's how your face/head ends up slamming against the ground really hard.
It's almost better to just let loose and ragdoll than it is to dead sailor. But ragdolling is worse than a "reactive" fall.
Those are honestly the worst ones, and usually the kinds of falls that end up hurting people the most.

Whenever I read about step by step "strategies" about people "planning" in situations like that, I always think like "Are these people serious?".

Knowing those situations is both a blessing and a curse, as I know the seriousness of many different situations, so I'm way more scared and way less relaxed than most people would be even in compltely normal sitautions.
So when I don't need to be worried, and I just want to have fun, my instincts don't allow me to have that fun. Even when I'm doing non-bicycle related things like driving or just hanging out in an elevated area.

But it's a blessing because I very rarely get seriosuly injured even when doing things that have the potential to seriously injure me.
I'm never extremely overconfident to the point where I am doing something that is just way too stupid for my skill level. Some people get away with that for a while, but they have that one bad crash and then they are done.
That's how a lot of really bad accidents happen, when people have never crashed or been hurt, and they just go full blast, maybe pick up a brakeless fixie and just aimlesssly blast down everything.
SHouldn't confuse those people with the actual pro's that you see in your favorite movie. They are for sure at that advanced level, and they are simply pushing their limits to their max. So it may seem reckless, but it's very calculated, and they damn well know the risks lol. Thta'ts what makes it just so much more crazy.

But there is variance in any/all situations. If you're constantly doing something that can hurt you, you will eventually get hurt. Period.
For the more professional people in the various cycling disciplines, this often involves very serious injury as they are pushing the absolute physical limits of what they know to be possible.
(Meaning, if they make even a small mistake, they're done, as they are going increidbly fast on a land bike, or they are incredibly high int he air on another kind of bike, etc.).

I'm constanlty trying to find the balance between fun and risk, but it's really hard to have even basic fun without risking some kind of injury.
Sux, but we're human.
Nowadays I barely screw around anymore so it's really a non issue, but I really just want to get better at biking again, so hopefully I can do that with all of my knowledge and do it very safely.
You should too!

Jeff Neese

The difference between many of the responses you are getting here, versus reality, is that in reality most crashes happen in a flash, and by the time you even realize the fact that you're crashing, it's all over and you're on the ground tryng to figure out if you're hurt or not. There will be no "tuck and roll" or martial-arts style falling techniques, only "Oh crap - I crashed" and then checking to see what hurts.

The only valid advice is to wear protective gear, and of course avoid crashing in the first place.

RC71

[QUOTE= If you are clipped in your reactions are constrained. And a lot of the time everything happens so fast .... the best thing to do is get up and get out of the road after it is over.[/QUOTE]

We have a 650 rider cycling club here and listening to their crash stories as I became active again I decided to use SPD clipless pedals because they release faster.

mjd420nova

Anticipation No one really can. It happens at a point where the mind is preparing for impact and it happens before you really can think. My last was a surprise, aren't they all?? As I rode past a family on their front lawn, a very wide street, 6 lanes, no traffic and their dogs runs from the curb (no leash) and attacks my front tire. The momentum of the rotating wheel and the dogs jaw locked on the rim. Ass over tea kettle in a flash. Was hit in the back shoulder by the shimano and gouged, with road rash on shoulder, palms, shins and elbows. Almost went into shock. Didn't ride for 3 days and had to have wrist support for two weeks. It can happen anytime.

wphamilton

I want people to realize that I'm speaking from experience, not theory. I know for an absolute fact - because I've done it many times - that on many crashes you can react, and you can execute whichever technique is appropriate for the situation, and that it can prevent injury. All injuries including bruises and road rash. Anyone who has the knowledge and skills knows what I'm talking about.


You don't have to strategize, decide and react - that's actually the whole point of the martial arts fall training. It's ingrained, and your body does its thing just like jerking your hand back from a hot burner. Sure, sometimes if you're caught daydreaming and completely unaware you won't do anything and just hit the ground like anyone else. The other times, you're doing basically the same thing as everyone else, or what they imagine doing, just much better.

Flip Flop Rider

lots of responses

seems there are only 2 choices when crashing, extend your arm or not (most here say do not). What am I missing?

other than that, I cannot think of a "crash strategy". If you go over the handle bars, there are no decisions to be made

wphamilton

Rhetorical or serious question?

mr_bill

Imagine if someone spoke from EXPERIENCE, not theory, about how a helmet saved their life. Oh wait.

-mr. bill

wphamilton

Take it to the Helmet Thread please.

livedarklions

Crash Strategy is my male stripper name.

mr_bill

Imagine if there was an Aikido thread, please?

-mr. bill

AlmostTrick

Tuck head and shoulder roll out. I've done this successfully twice. Did not hit my (un-helmeted) head.

Use the force of the crash against itself.

livedarklions

I've been trying to use fencing moves--I parry the ground with my water bottle.

MoAlpha

All I've seen so far is tactics. I want a strategy I can execute right from the beginning of the ride when I know I'm going to crash.

mr_bill

If you know you are going to crash at the beginning of the ride, at the beginning of the ride don’t ride.

(There’s a paradox there, even if it’s future history.)

-mr. bill

MoAlpha

...there are known knowns...

-Donald Rumsfeld

wphamilton

I think the trolls would dearly love that, judging from responses on this one.

tim24k

PLUS ONE!
LOL, keep the shinny side up people.

livedarklions

Depends on what the alternative to crashing is. If it's scalded to death in a fryolator explosion, I might take my chances on the crash.

If you know you're going to crash, confine your riding to a golf course. That's the strategic move.

noglider 

Heh. You remind me of the time my wife and I went cross country skiing on a golf course. We were total beginners. We kept falling all over the place and laughing all the way.