Turn Signals
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,840
Bikes: Bianchi San Remo - set up as a utility bike, Peter Mooney Road bike, Peter Mooney commute bike,Dahon Folder,Schwinn Paramount Tandem
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Turn Signals
Our local newspaper has a column that talks about driving issues and a couple of days ago, the topic was on when and if you use a turn indicator. That same morning, on my commute into work, I was cut off by a truck who did not use his turn indicator, and who then made a right turn on red while barely slowing down. Not unusual behaviour, but the truck was a public works truck from the city (Santa Clara) and I generally expect better of professional drivers. I sent a clip of the video to the newspaper columnist, who mentioned it in todays column.
Video here:
Video here:
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: On the bridge with Picard
Posts: 5,932
Bikes: Specialized Allez, Specialized Sirrus
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Hopefully the driver's supervisor will see it. If not, you can always send a copy of the video to the public works department.
#3
genec
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Posts: 27,079
Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2
Mentioned: 86 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13658 Post(s)
Liked 4,532 Times
in
3,158 Posts
Link to the driving column please...
#4
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,840
Bikes: Bianchi San Remo - set up as a utility bike, Peter Mooney Road bike, Peter Mooney commute bike,Dahon Folder,Schwinn Paramount Tandem
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Column from last thursday
Roadshow: Do you have to signal when exiting a freeway? - San Jose Mercury News
Today's column
Roadshow: If I don't have to use my blinker, why should I? - San Jose Mercury News
Clearly, people in the San Francisco Bay area have a hard time figuring out what their turn signals are for.....
Roadshow: Do you have to signal when exiting a freeway? - San Jose Mercury News
Today's column
Roadshow: If I don't have to use my blinker, why should I? - San Jose Mercury News
Clearly, people in the San Francisco Bay area have a hard time figuring out what their turn signals are for.....
#5
genec
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Posts: 27,079
Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2
Mentioned: 86 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13658 Post(s)
Liked 4,532 Times
in
3,158 Posts
Column from last thursday
Roadshow: Do you have to signal when exiting a freeway? - San Jose Mercury News
Today's column
Roadshow: If I don't have to use my blinker, why should I? - San Jose Mercury News
Clearly, people in the San Francisco Bay area have a hard time figuring out what their turn signals are for.....
Roadshow: Do you have to signal when exiting a freeway? - San Jose Mercury News
Today's column
Roadshow: If I don't have to use my blinker, why should I? - San Jose Mercury News
Clearly, people in the San Francisco Bay area have a hard time figuring out what their turn signals are for.....
On the other hand, as a driver and cyclist I signal any intent to make a lateral movement... from lane change to freeway exit or entrance to out right turn... even leaving the curb. I look at it as a courtesy to fellow road users.
Too bad so many others refuse to be courteous to one another. Kinda says something about our whole country, eh? Courtesy as a sign of weakness, eh?
BTW I saw a motorist yesterday that did the same thing as that city truck driver, at three different stop signs... technically running the stop signs while turning. Guess that is just how some folks roll. And yes, there was traffic around.
#8
20+mph Commuter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Greenville. SC USA
Posts: 7,517
Bikes: Surly LHT, Surly Lowside, a folding bike, and a beater.
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1434 Post(s)
Liked 331 Times
in
219 Posts
I think the guy was doing you a favor. He probably expected you to run the red anyway, so he did his best to get around you ASAP and swing that right turn without slowing you down. And in the vid it appeared that he gave you plenty of room throughout the entire passing process. Danged courteous of him if you ask me. I wouldn't rat him out.
If the tables were turned - and I was on my bike passing a slow moving road user - I would have done the exact same thing. Probably would have given a hand signal but not necessarily if the road surface was contaminated or I needed both hand to brake and downshift before the turn.
I seem to remember a clip here where a pickup truck passed a cyclist and got rear-ended for stopping at the next red light. Everybody was all up in arms about that too. Motorists just can't win sometimes.
Do you think that driver somehow slighted you, effected you, or endangered you, or were you just offended that he broke the law right in front of you?
Personally I love people who look interested in A. Getting somewhere, and B. Getting the Hell out of my way.
Forgive me for being desensitized to such maneuvers by motorists. If I sent a video clip to the news every time I saw someone go right on red without a stop or a signal I would need to start my own personal newspaper or TV network. I see that 10 times a day on a GOOD day. I really don't see a problem with it other than being visually offensive to tender sensibilities.
If the tables were turned - and I was on my bike passing a slow moving road user - I would have done the exact same thing. Probably would have given a hand signal but not necessarily if the road surface was contaminated or I needed both hand to brake and downshift before the turn.
I seem to remember a clip here where a pickup truck passed a cyclist and got rear-ended for stopping at the next red light. Everybody was all up in arms about that too. Motorists just can't win sometimes.
Do you think that driver somehow slighted you, effected you, or endangered you, or were you just offended that he broke the law right in front of you?
Personally I love people who look interested in A. Getting somewhere, and B. Getting the Hell out of my way.
Forgive me for being desensitized to such maneuvers by motorists. If I sent a video clip to the news every time I saw someone go right on red without a stop or a signal I would need to start my own personal newspaper or TV network. I see that 10 times a day on a GOOD day. I really don't see a problem with it other than being visually offensive to tender sensibilities.
Last edited by JoeyBike; 06-24-14 at 07:43 PM.
#9
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Memphis TN area
Posts: 7,391
Bikes: 2011 Felt Z85 (road/commuter), 2006 Marin Pine Mountain (utility/commuter E-bike), 1995 KHS Alite 1000 (gravel grinder)
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 676 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 13 Times
in
13 Posts
I think the guy was doing you a favor. He probably expected you to run the red anyway, so he did his best to get around you ASAP and swing that right turn without slowing you down. And in the vid it appeared that he gave you plenty of room throughout the entire passing process. Danged courteous of him if you ask me. I wouldn't rat him out.
If the tables were turned - and I was on my bike passing a slow moving road user - I would have done the exact same thing. Probably would have given a hand signal but not necessarily if the road surface was contaminated or I needed both hand to brake and downshift before the turn.
I seem to remember a clip here where a pickup truck passed a cyclist and got rear-ended for stopping at the next red light. Everybody was all up in arms about that too. Motorists just can't win sometimes.
Do you think that driver somehow slighted you, effected you, or endangered you, or were you just offended that he broke the law right in front of you?
Personally I love people who look interested in A. Getting somewhere, and B. Getting the Hell out of my way.
Forgive me for being desensitized to such maneuvers by motorists. If I sent a video clip to the news every time I saw someone go right on red without a stop or a signal I would need to start my own personal newspaper or TV network. I see that 10 times a day on a GOOD day. I really don't see a problem with it other than being visually offensive to tender sensibilities.
If the tables were turned - and I was on my bike passing a slow moving road user - I would have done the exact same thing. Probably would have given a hand signal but not necessarily if the road surface was contaminated or I needed both hand to brake and downshift before the turn.
I seem to remember a clip here where a pickup truck passed a cyclist and got rear-ended for stopping at the next red light. Everybody was all up in arms about that too. Motorists just can't win sometimes.
Do you think that driver somehow slighted you, effected you, or endangered you, or were you just offended that he broke the law right in front of you?
Personally I love people who look interested in A. Getting somewhere, and B. Getting the Hell out of my way.
Forgive me for being desensitized to such maneuvers by motorists. If I sent a video clip to the news every time I saw someone go right on red without a stop or a signal I would need to start my own personal newspaper or TV network. I see that 10 times a day on a GOOD day. I really don't see a problem with it other than being visually offensive to tender sensibilities.
F those people that have no regards for others and think only of themselves.
#10
20+mph Commuter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Greenville. SC USA
Posts: 7,517
Bikes: Surly LHT, Surly Lowside, a folding bike, and a beater.
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1434 Post(s)
Liked 331 Times
in
219 Posts
Maybe the wide angle lens distorts the distances somewhat. I looked at the video again. Might have been a little close on the pass. I use a helmet mounted rear-view mirror so I would have seen that coming and decided to either hold my line or squeeze a bit closer to the car doors. Again, hard to judge distance through an action cam. So a marginally close pass with a "who cares" right on red without a stop - that had no effect on the cyclist.
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 799
Bikes: Pacific Reach, Strida
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
I too signal my turns while riding my bike, but lately I've begun to wonder if that's actually a good idea, because it seems to confuse drivers. I extend my arm to signal that I intend to turn at the upcoming intersection or change lanes when it's clear (the same meaning as a car's turn signal). The problem is, people interpret that to mean the same as when a driver sticks their arm out the window and points, meaning "I'm moving over right now, and I'm about to cut you off." Quite a number of cars have come to a sudden halt, clearly expecting me to cut in front of them, which I never intended to do. I guess they aren't used to cyclists signaling turns -- and it is rare.
#12
genec
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Posts: 27,079
Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2
Mentioned: 86 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13658 Post(s)
Liked 4,532 Times
in
3,158 Posts
I too signal my turns while riding my bike, but lately I've begun to wonder if that's actually a good idea, because it seems to confuse drivers. I extend my arm to signal that I intend to turn at the upcoming intersection or change lanes when it's clear (the same meaning as a car's turn signal). The problem is, people interpret that to mean the same as when a driver sticks their arm out the window and points, meaning "I'm moving over right now, and I'm about to cut you off." Quite a number of cars have come to a sudden halt, clearly expecting me to cut in front of them, which I never intended to do. I guess they aren't used to cyclists signaling turns -- and it is rare.
Cooperation on the road would work quite well if indeed we all chose to cooperate... but too many people decide to do what is best only for themselves and live with whatever selfish consequences may result.
#13
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,840
Bikes: Bianchi San Remo - set up as a utility bike, Peter Mooney Road bike, Peter Mooney commute bike,Dahon Folder,Schwinn Paramount Tandem
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
A few months ago, I was on a 4 lane road (2 lanes in each direction), and had moved into the left lane to make a left turn, had my left arm out indicating my intention to turn and a lady in a minivan passed me on the left to go straight - crossing over entirely into the lane of oncoming traffic to do this maneuver. I yelled at her and she stopped (in the middle of the intersection) to tell me that she thought that my left arm out meant that I wanted her to pass me on the left.
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Kent Wa.
Posts: 5,332
Bikes: 2005 Gazelle Golfo, 1935 Raleigh Sport, 1970 Robin Hood sport, 1974 Schwinn Continental, 1984 Ross MTB/porteur, 2013 Flying Piegon path racer, 2014 Gazelle Toer Populair T8
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 396 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times
in
7 Posts
I know lots of folks here like to complain about our "motorcentric" culture, but going by what I often read here, on motorcycle forums, and observe drivers do every day, the real issue is we are becoming a "mecentric" culture. People are getting way to comfortable with making excuses and justifications for why they don't need to play by the same rules as everyone else.
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Gig Harbor, WA
Posts: 2,470
Bikes: Surly Long Haul Trucker, Gary Fisher Hoo Koo E Koo, Dahon Mu P 24 , Ritchey Breakaway Cross, Rodriguez Tandem, Wheeler MTB
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 32 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
#16
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Memphis TN area
Posts: 7,391
Bikes: 2011 Felt Z85 (road/commuter), 2006 Marin Pine Mountain (utility/commuter E-bike), 1995 KHS Alite 1000 (gravel grinder)
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 676 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 13 Times
in
13 Posts
I too signal my turns while riding my bike, but lately I've begun to wonder if that's actually a good idea, because it seems to confuse drivers. I extend my arm to signal that I intend to turn at the upcoming intersection or change lanes when it's clear (the same meaning as a car's turn signal). The problem is, people interpret that to mean the same as when a driver sticks their arm out the window and points, meaning "I'm moving over right now, and I'm about to cut you off." Quite a number of cars have come to a sudden halt, clearly expecting me to cut in front of them, which I never intended to do. I guess they aren't used to cyclists signaling turns -- and it is rare.
I know lots of folks here like to complain about our "motorcentric" culture, but going by what I often read here, on motorcycle forums, and observe drivers do every day, the real issue is we are becoming a "mecentric" culture. People are getting way to comfortable with making excuses and justifications for why they don't need to play by the same rules as everyone else.
#18
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Singapore
Posts: 1,143
Bikes: Fully customized 11-spd MTB built on 2014 Santa Cruz 5010 frame; Brompton S2E-X 2014; Brompton M3E 2014
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I know lots of folks here like to complain about our "motorcentric" culture, but going by what I often read here, on motorcycle forums, and observe drivers do every day, the real issue is we are becoming a "mecentric" culture. People are getting way to comfortable with making excuses and justifications for why they don't need to play by the same rules as everyone else.
EVERYONE here has their personal justifications for their on-road behaviour, so does your friends, family, colleagues, that hot girl you knew in college, etc.
The ones you don't get to know - that trucker who cut you off, that soccer mom who ran the red light, that asshat cyclist on a racer weaving in and out of traffic - those 'people' are apparently part of a shadowy underground organisation out to sow chaos on the roads and rightfully deserves condemnation without reservation.
It's not 'us' vs 'them' - everyone is an individual and has the capacity to make bad judgement calls - it does not mean they're idiots or dangerous drivers/cyclists. Of course, that doesn't mean there aren't true idiots and morons out there lol.
#19
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: NA
Posts: 4,267
Bikes: NA
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 7 Times
in
7 Posts
rules created for and by motorists that discriminate against other transport modes, are frequently irrelevant to safe active transport, and are typically not enforced.
#20
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Kent Wa.
Posts: 5,332
Bikes: 2005 Gazelle Golfo, 1935 Raleigh Sport, 1970 Robin Hood sport, 1974 Schwinn Continental, 1984 Ross MTB/porteur, 2013 Flying Piegon path racer, 2014 Gazelle Toer Populair T8
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 396 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times
in
7 Posts
Targeted regulations may not always be perfect, but their detractors don't seem to ever provide any reasonable evidence that they are actually counter productive.
I find it amusing that they are supposedly made up by a cabal of evil car drivers bent on road domination.
#21
20+mph Commuter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Greenville. SC USA
Posts: 7,517
Bikes: Surly LHT, Surly Lowside, a folding bike, and a beater.
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1434 Post(s)
Liked 331 Times
in
219 Posts
Some motorcyclists, and CDL drivers make the same unsubstantiated emotional claims.
Targeted regulations may not always be perfect, but their detractors don't seem to ever provide any reasonable evidence that they are actually counter productive.
I find it amusing that they are supposedly made up by a cabal of evil car drivers bent on road domination.
Targeted regulations may not always be perfect, but their detractors don't seem to ever provide any reasonable evidence that they are actually counter productive.
I find it amusing that they are supposedly made up by a cabal of evil car drivers bent on road domination.
#22
genec
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Posts: 27,079
Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2
Mentioned: 86 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13658 Post(s)
Liked 4,532 Times
in
3,158 Posts
+1
EVERYONE here has their personal justifications for their on-road behaviour, so does your friends, family, colleagues, that hot girl you knew in college, etc.
The ones you don't get to know - that trucker who cut you off, that soccer mom who ran the red light, that asshat cyclist on a racer weaving in and out of traffic - those 'people' are apparently part of a shadowy underground organisation out to sow chaos on the roads and rightfully deserves condemnation without reservation.
It's not 'us' vs 'them' - everyone is an individual and has the capacity to make bad judgement calls - it does not mean they're idiots or dangerous drivers/cyclists. Of course, that doesn't mean there aren't true idiots and morons out there lol.
EVERYONE here has their personal justifications for their on-road behaviour, so does your friends, family, colleagues, that hot girl you knew in college, etc.
The ones you don't get to know - that trucker who cut you off, that soccer mom who ran the red light, that asshat cyclist on a racer weaving in and out of traffic - those 'people' are apparently part of a shadowy underground organisation out to sow chaos on the roads and rightfully deserves condemnation without reservation.
It's not 'us' vs 'them' - everyone is an individual and has the capacity to make bad judgement calls - it does not mean they're idiots or dangerous drivers/cyclists. Of course, that doesn't mean there aren't true idiots and morons out there lol.
And how much of that comes from distraction or flat out not paying attention... a whole other factor.
#23
Banned
Maybe the wide angle lens distorts the distances somewhat. I looked at the video again. Might have been a little close on the pass. I use a helmet mounted rear-view mirror so I would have seen that coming and decided to either hold my line or squeeze a bit closer to the car doors. Again, hard to judge distance through an action cam. So a marginally close pass with a "who cares" right on red without a stop - that had no effect on the cyclist.
#25
That guy from the Chi
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 1,000
Bikes: 88 Trek 800 - gone to new cheeks; '14 Trek 1.2 - aka The X1 Advanced; '13 Trek 3500 Disc
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
2 Posts
Same here, even when I signal into a left turn only lane to turn left, I still get drivers trying to pass me in the turn and swing wider than I do. I still signal though, just in case someone remembers the fundamentals they taught in driver's ed.